|T O P I C R E V I E W
||Posted - 03/03/2008 : 09:47:59 AM
New Tactical Action from Badger Ordnance
At SHOT Show, Martin (Marty) Bordson of Badger Ordnance, previewed the new Badger M2008 Tactical action. A slab-sided, flat-bottomed, "fat bolt" action, the new Badger action resembles an Accuracy International receiver externally, but it shares some Remington features internally. The M2008 will initially be available for .308 bolt face calibers, and it is designed to work with any Remington detachable-style magazine.
The new action features TWO (2) integral recoil lugs in the front, plus two raised "abutments" for the action screws. This should provide a very rigid, solid action. We're not sure why two recoil lugs are necessary, but perhaps this reflects Badger's "extra heavy duty" design bias. The new action also features a built-in Picatinny rail on top. The M2008 fits standard Remington triggers and will fit all stocks that can be inletted for a Remington.
Here is a video link to the introduction:
Marty said the new action should be available in summer 2008 and the current "projected price" is "under $1000.00#8243; including rail. FYI, Badger Ordnance, which marked its 25th year in business in 2007, recently moved to a new facility. Here's the latest contact info:
1141 Swift Street
N. Kansas City, MO 64116
phone: (816) 421-4956
e-mail: info [at] badgerordnance.com
|8 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First)
||Posted - 03/07/2008 : 09:21:29 AM
I've worked with big bore takedowns (expensive), barrel clamps and switch barrel configurations. As much as I like innovation and flexibility, I still come back to the single use rifle. The others have their place and can be an extremely useful under certain sets of circumstances so I'm not demeaning them at all. In fact, one of my favorite long range rifles is built on the barrel clamping system for switching barrels or whole barreled actions.
The Gilke-Ross system is a marvel of design and machining. I had the opportunity to shoot one prone at 600 and 1,000 yards a couple of years ago and found it to be an incredible stock and action for position shooting. The extreme amount of adjustments in the stock is amazing. The stock is also able to accommodate other actions as well due to the use of the barrel block. You can see the European smallbore stock influence.
The prices are a little over the top but not so severe by comparison to other custom rifles of lesser designs.
Barreled action = $2120.00
Stock = $1195.00
Additional bolt heads = $199.00
All totaled, stock plus barreled action = $3315.00 or about the same as any of the competition rifles from any of the major gunsmiths and less than some of them. Plus it includes the Anschutz trigger.
With the way the market is going, it appears that this will become a little more accepted as individual custom firearms become increasingly more expensive.
||Posted - 03/06/2008 : 9:48:35 PM
I have to say I like that Gilkes-Ross idea as well. In the not too distant past when things were a little more favorable for me financially, I was seriously considering a Mauser M03. Simply because I could have every rifle in one. I will say I balked when I checked the prices of extra barrels and bolt-heads and magazine inserts. That led me to thinking I could have a lot more guns period than to tie up that much in one piece.
Anyhow, I don't know how much these custom action makers are pushing that idea. Or, that you may have a myriad of ideas to start with but once you go down one road you're kind of stuck with at least something like it. Also, takedowns seem to bring a premium just because they are takedowns. As long as you have a takedown, why not see what is possible as far as making it interchangeable. A bolt/head like the Gilkes-Ross sure lends credibility to that avenue.
||Posted - 03/06/2008 : 2:59:37 PM
They are all available in magazine feed, the photos I have are pre-production or prototype so they don't show all the variation.
The constant diameter bolt is a great idea to save production money since the maker gets to avoid cutting in the lugways. The Voeres, Texas Magnums and the Omega III all used the idea in their original form. The drawbacks are that every diameter limits what size rim can go on the bolt. The bolt nose gets a little thin on the outside diameter when you step up in cartridge rim size. Catastrophic failures take out the side of the bolt nose usually around the extractor since that's the thinnest and therefore weakest point.
The design allows the bolt to continue forward without interfering with or picking up the next cartridge.
The lug arrangement is usually three since the O.D. can be a little smaller and still get the bearing surface required for the pressures. Two lugs would require a much larger diameter and add a lot of weight overall. It also looks stupid being so large in diameter, ungainly.
This is my favorite design so far. It a Gilkes-Ross from Ross Precision. Not only is it an amazing machining project but the bolt head is interchangeable.
Prices run the entire gamut and depend upon what you want and need:
Stiller Precision starts at $750 and goes up from there.
Surgeons are running $1285 and go up.
Here's an article that gives a good summary of most of the precision actions but doesn't get carried away with the tactical stuff:
There's a lot of new actions coming along but the field won't get crowded for a while yet. Every time a new one gets announced, delivery times zoom up to 6 months from the massive demand.
||Posted - 03/06/2008 : 12:55:36 PM
NICE! The money wants to just fall out of the wallet.... Unfortunately, that's when my kids see it and it's a mad scramble to get it back.
What do each of these generally run in price? I have to say I like the constant diameter bolt. But what I'm wondering now is how do you get it to pick a round up out of a mag(I noticed most of these are solid bottom single shot) and the main bolt diameter not pick up the round behind it? Shorten the gap between the lugs and body? I guess I look though, for all intents and purposes, the AR is a constant diameter bolt(carrier)body. Just that the bolt itself rotates separately.
||Posted - 03/05/2008 : 10:00:36 PM
These are a few of the other current contenders for the same position. I have left out Surgeon, Lawton, Nesika Bay, Dakota and PGWDTI.
Stiller TAC action
Peter Stahl SWS2000
T/C ICON Tactical
||Posted - 03/05/2008 : 2:25:54 PM
Thanks for the reply! I know what you mean about AI getting way too expensive. I just don't have the want or the money to look or be that "Tacti-cool". What I'm really looking for is some downright accurate system to come along. ...That I can get into on working man's wages. I'm thinking I may want one more rifle in the reasonably near future that will do that. But then again, I have yet to get some of my bigger 'artillery' out west where I have unlimited range and see what all it will do.
A lot of the combination of things they are doing seem to be good. Hopefully, they have a quality enough name that getting it marketed won't be that much of an issue. I hope they have a lot of luck with this.
||Posted - 03/04/2008 : 10:45:34 PM
An e-mail from Marty Bordson at Badger:
I see the new action has stirred some interest.
Here is the skinny...It is an AI/Remington hybrid.
The new action is called the M2008 (M Twenty O Eight) or "08 for short.
It is 308 length has 1.25" long barrel tenon and a 1.0626 X 16 thread.
Uses Remington Triggers and Guards, WHY REMMY TRIGGERS, WELL...M40 M40A1 M40A3 M24 M700/300WM Mk 14 mod 0,1,2,3,4,5 I think the record speaks for it self.
It has a removable base, I like Integral bases but what if you have a 20 moa base and need a 30? Trust me We will make it solid.
The final version will have a full length rail.
Can be fit into Remington compatible stocks with a little work.
Tom Manners will make a "Fit" stock for the action.
I intend to start shipping them Mid year, FOR REAL!
Projected cost is less than 1K.
Lastly, if you like the 60º dovetail that is ok, But the reality of the modern world is the M1913 standardized optical mounting platform, I have also seen the dovetail type mount peeled off of the dovetail.
Badger Ordnance - Marty
I don't see anything wrong with the action in general. We can always use another action designed with slight differences. Some of the details are borrowed and some are standard to the industry. His idea is to compete head-to-head with Accuracy International and make some money in the mean time.
Accuracy International has grown to be far too expensive for most folks to afford let alone those that really want to afford them. The wannabes mortgage everything they own just to say they have an AI and so they can be considered 'kool' and smart by the 'tactical' folks. I have no time for rifles that cost $6000.00 for a plastic skinned aluminum action. Yes, they're accurate but way overpriced. And before anyone gets cranky, I've owned two of them when they were at least affordable.
The so-called 'big bolt' is another term for a constant diameter bolt which doesn't need separate lugways cut into the action which is fairly expensive. Look at the photo, the lugs are the same diameter as the bolt body. The use of 3-lugs cuts down on the additional diameter required for a 2-lug bolt. This idea has been around for a long time, maybe 40 years or more. Even the AI uses 3-lugs in the same configuration, the difference is that AI uses a proprietary steel action lug seat which is a separate piece instead of cutting the lug seats into the action. I do like the longer barrel tenon.
The double recoil lugs supposedly adds 'lateral stability'... My thought is that they have plans for some sort of bedding block that this will nest into. It also has potential for being able to create a form of epoxied action rail system similar to what's been shown by most of the bolt action 'tactical' market.
The bedding block system will also allow for an easier transition into another form of Detachable Magazine.
The smaller ejection port is of very little import. It will keep slightly bigger garbage out of the action but in reality, the action stiffness comes from the front ring forward and the bolt lock up.
The uninformed that want an integral scope rail have never had to balance manufacturing against stock and orders. The best idea is make an interchangeable scope rail in various tapers and make all the actions the same. Smart manufacturing, hold the costs down.
Guesstimate on retail will be somewhere around $1,000.00 and that doesn't include anything. No trigger, no rail, no bottom metal, no adds, no ups, no extras. But it will take any of the various Remington-style triggers from factory up through custom. Call it $1500 to $1600.00 ready to barrel, stock and scope. Maybe $3,000.00 on the cheap side.
I think it will fine and Badger will sell a ton of them. I'll buy one to have and play with just to see what can be done with it.
||Posted - 03/04/2008 : 7:52:49 PM
What is your general opinion of building off one of these actions? I have one set of Badger rings and I think they are tough. At least tougher than what I have them sitting on. Even 4 6-32 NC screws holding a picatinny rail don't instill a lot of confidence for me.
I'm thinking you wouldn't have posted this if you didn't have a fair amount of confidence in the company?