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 Winchester Model 94, 55, & 64 Survey update
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2011 :  6:27:25 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by lonewolf1

1-382558
2-32 w.s.
3-carbine
4-#5 but says model 1894, winchester,trademark
5-no
6- n/a
7-nickel steel
8-no
9-single band on mag. hex barrel
is new store bought 32 w.s. ammo ok for this , is it still a black powder type?
also has 42 60 marked on receiver just ahead of trigger
and has a stamp on top of barrel and rec. of (P-T) with a sideways W between the P-T



The serial number places the date of manufacture as January 1908.

The 32 W.S. has always been a smokeless powder cartridge (with nearly identical ballistics to the more common 30-30 Winchester). Any new 32 Winchester Special ammo you buy is perfectly fine and safe to shoot.

The barrel is octagon (8-sided) versus hexagon (6-sided), and the butt plate should be a crescent verus a carbine style.

The marking on the barrel and the top of the frame ring is a superposed "W" and a "P", and indicates "Winchester Proof".


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Edited by - Bert H. on 02/14/2011 6:33:10 PM
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lonewolf1
Starting Member

USA
4 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2011 :  8:33:43 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Bert H.

quote:
Originally posted by lonewolf1

1-382558
2-32 w.s.
3-carbine
4-#5 but says model 1894, winchester,trademark
5-no
6- n/a
7-nickel steel
8-no
9-single band on mag. hex barrel
is new store bought 32 w.s. ammo ok for this , is it still a black powder type?
also has 42 60 marked on receiver just ahead of trigger
and has a stamp on top of barrel and rec. of (P-T) with a sideways W between the P-T



The serial number places the date of manufacture as January 1908.

The 32 W.S. has always been a smokeless powder cartridge (with nearly identical ballistics to the more common 30-30 Winchester). Any new 32 Winchester Special ammo you buy is perfectly fine and safe to shoot.

The barrel is octagon (8-sided) versus hexagon (6-sided), and the butt plate should be a crescent verus a carbine style.

The marking on the barrel and the top of the frame ring is a superposed "W" and a "P", and indicates "Winchester Proof".
THANKS BERT, YES THE BUTTPLATE IS MORE POINTED ON THE BOTTOM, IS WINCHESTER PROOF KINDA LIKE DP DOUGLAS PREMIUM? IS THERE A GOOD WEBSIGHT TO FIND A NEW REAR SIGHT FOR MY BROKEN EXPRESS?


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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2011 :  11:09:17 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by lonewolf1
THANKS BERT, YES THE BUTTPLATE IS MORE POINTED ON THE BOTTOM, IS WINCHESTER PROOF KINDA LIKE DP DOUGLAS PREMIUM? IS THERE A GOOD WEBSIGHT TO FIND A NEW REAR SIGHT FOR MY BROKEN EXPRESS?



No, the superposed "WP" is not like the "DP". The Winchester Proof mark indicates that the barrel and action passed inspection following a 200% proof load.

I am not aware of a specific "Winchester" gunsight website, but I do know several dealers that have them on occasion. Have you tried a Google search "Winchester 3-leaf express sight"?


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atvidaho
Starting Member

17 Posts

Posted - 02/18/2011 :  5:00:28 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here's mine, I can't take a decent photo to save my life.
Can I ask here value with the wrong buttplate/pad setup?

I see a red x, I'll email you pics.
1640626
25-35 W.C.F.
cut and pad installed
blank
no
milled
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oakridge
New Member

82 Posts

Posted - 02/23/2011 :  6:38:04 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bert,
I previously sent you info on several guns that I no longer own. There were 6 other 94's (3 rifles and 3 carbines) that may fall in the serial ranges that you're looking at, so I'll give you this, too. If it's of no use, just disregard it. I owned several other 94's made pre-1900 that I know are not of interest.

Win. 1894 Rifle
Ser.# 396,179
Cal. .38-55
26" Half Round - Half octagon Bbl.
Half magazine
Takedown
Shotgun butt
Plain walnut stock w/Style I
checkering on grip and forend

Win. 1894 SRC
Ser.# 402,498
Cal. .32-40
20" Round Barrel
Half magazine
Carbine butt

Win. 1894 SRC
Ser.# 410,488
Cal. .30WCF
20" Round Barrel
Full magazine
Carbine butt

Win. 1894 Rifle
Ser.# 581,015
Cal. .38-55
26" Half Round - Half octagon Bbl.
Takedown
Rifle butt

Win. 1894 Rifle
Ser.# 785,296
Cal. .32-40
26" Round barrel
Full magazine
Rifle butt

Win. 1894 SRC
Ser.# 910,713
Cal. .30WCF
20" Round barrel
Full magazine
Carbine butt
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5339 skeet
Starting Member

USA
3 Posts

Posted - 03/03/2011 :  5:12:12 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi

On your request for model 64 info

1-serial no 1094595
2-32ws
3-checkered steel widows peak diamond
4type 6
5-drilled and tapped [factory?]
6-no
7-winchester proof steel
8-no saddle ring
9-no w
10-no l
14- deluxe carbine model 64 20 in barrel
checkered forearn and buttstock
sling swivels
knurled hammer
small number 40 in front of trigger

hope this helps John

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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 03/03/2011 :  7:50:55 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by 5339 skeet

Hi

On your request for model 64 info

1-serial no 1094595
2-32ws
3-checkered steel widows peak diamond
4type 6
5-drilled and tapped [factory?]
6-no
7-winchester proof steel
8-no saddle ring
9-no w
10-no l
14- deluxe carbine model 64 20 in barrel
checkered forearn and buttstock
sling swivels
knurled hammer
small number 40 in front of trigger

hope this helps John



Hello John,

Yes, it does indeed help, and thank you very much for posting the information for you Model 64.

The Model 64 Deluxe Carbines are the least common of all the variations. The extrapolation table in my survey indicates that Winchester manufactured approximately (5000) Deluxe Carbines, and of that number, approximately (945) were made in 32 W.S.

Edit: Forgot to add... your Model 64 was manufactured in September of 1934, right in the heart of the Great Depression. Undoubtedly somebody who was quite well off ordered and purchased it.

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Edited by - Bert H. on 03/03/2011 7:53:06 PM
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baldwinpond
Starting Member

USA
2 Posts

Posted - 03/05/2011 :  10:29:48 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have a World War II Model 94
#1332281
-30 W.C.F.-
serrated steel butt plate
Type 7
Not tapped and drilled
No
On top of the barrel and receiver about a 1/2 inch apart is a W with a large I stamped on top of it, both encircled by an oval
No saddle ring
No W or L. there is a #4 stamped just in front of the trigger.

James R. Joyce
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 03/05/2011 :  3:07:21 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by baldwinpond

I have a World War II Model 94
#1332281
-30 W.C.F.-
serrated steel butt plate
Type 7
Not tapped and drilled
No
On top of the barrel and receiver about a 1/2 inch apart is a W with a large I stamped on top of it, both encircled by an oval
No saddle ring
No W or L. there is a #4 stamped just in front of the trigger.



Hello James,

Your Model 94 Carbine was manufactured in May of 1942, and it is right in the middle of the serial number range for the (2500) Model 94 Carbines that were sold to the Canadian Pacific Coast Militia Rangers (PCMR). Does your gun have a braod arrow stamp on the left (forward) side of the receiver frame or on the butt stock?

The stamps in the ovals are a superposed "W" and "P" and indicate the definitive Winchester Proof.


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baldwinpond
Starting Member

USA
2 Posts

Posted - 03/05/2011 :  5:46:59 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
No arrow stamp. And yes under a bright light and with a magnifying glass it is a P, although the loop is very faint and non-existent where the arc would be which is why I thought it was an I.

James R. Joyce
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 03/05/2011 :  7:41:21 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by baldwinpond

No arrow stamp. And yes under a bright light and with a magnifying glass it is a P, although the loop is very faint and non-existent where the arc would be which is why I thought it was an I.



Thank you very much for the update.


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Arbradbury25-35
Starting Member

USA
4 Posts

Posted - 03/06/2011 :  5:14:19 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hello Bert,

I Have a winchester 94 with the following:

1.)s/n# 1678895

2.)25-35win.

3.)Checkerd steel butt plate.

4.)Upper tang is blank (also only has one screw?)...

5.)Yes it is D&T. for peep sight. (has williams peep installed!)...

6.)No.

7.)Winchester Proof Steel.

8.)No saddle ring.

9.)No.

10.)Yes kind of looks like an L. but can tell it's a "1".

11.)Milled band.

12.)Long? (9"long aprox.)....


Also, it has a 20" barrel with a mag almost as long as the barrel, Overall langth is aprox. 37.5" long....

arbradbury25-35
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 03/06/2011 :  8:51:52 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Arbradbury25-35

Hello Bert,

I Have a winchester 94 with the following:

1.)s/n# 1678895

2.)25-35win.

3.)Checkerd steel butt plate.

4.)Upper tang is blank (also only has one screw?)...

5.)Yes it is D&T. for peep sight. (has williams peep installed!)...

6.)No.

7.)Winchester Proof Steel.

8.)No saddle ring.

9.)No.

10.)Yes kind of looks like an L. but can tell it's a "1".

11.)Milled band.

12.)Long? (9"long aprox.)....

Also, it has a 20" barrel with a mag almost as long as the barrel, Overall langth is aprox. 37.5" long....



Thank you very much for posting the information on your 1950 (mid-year) vintage stanadard Sporting Carbine. It appears to be completely standard with the exception of the drilled & tapped receiver.


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Arbradbury25-35
Starting Member

USA
4 Posts

Posted - 03/06/2011 :  10:30:45 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bert,

So would the fact of it pos. being drilled&tapped effect the value of it in any way? Also I'll try and post some pics. soon. The gun as far as I can tell is in realy good shape, The blue on receiver is about 75% there, Barrel still has about 85%+-, Wood shows some signs of wear,but still has good color and min. skuffs & dings(no big gouges,or chips out of stock at all), also the bore is still in great condition,(love the 25-35win. "Very accurate"). Also I would like to ask you if you would happen to know if there might be a .25cal. pointed tipe bullet,"like Hornady's XTP." That I could use for hand loads? Thank you very much for any and all info you can provide!!!

P.S. Sorry for all the questions!
Thanks, ADAM..

arbradbury25-35

Edited by - Arbradbury25-35 on 03/06/2011 10:32:45 PM
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 03/07/2011 :  10:09:19 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Arbradbury25-35

Bert,

So would the fact of it pos. being drilled&tapped effect the value of it in any way? Also I'll try and post some pics. soon. The gun as far as I can tell is in realy good shape, The blue on receiver is about 75% there, Barrel still has about 85%+-, Wood shows some signs of wear,but still has good color and min. skuffs & dings(no big gouges,or chips out of stock at all), also the bore is still in great condition,(love the 25-35win. "Very accurate"). Also I would like to ask you if you would happen to know if there might be a .25cal. pointed tipe bullet,"like Hornady's XTP." That I could use for hand loads? Thank you very much for any and all info you can provide!!!

P.S. Sorry for all the questions!
Thanks, ADAM..



The only way the drilled & tapped holes will affect the value is if they are not factory work, and then it will be a negative hit to the value. The only way to positvely determine if the holes are factory work, is to temporarily dismount the sight and inspect the quality of the hole entrances.

In regards to your question about a .257 FTX type bullet, I am not aware of any being made.


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n/a
deleted

766 Posts

Posted - 03/13/2011 :  10:01:18 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
How can you say Winchester never did or did not do something. Unless you have inspected every firearm manufactured by Winchester it is just theory. Am I correct?

Sage 1
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 03/14/2011 :  3:54:39 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Sage1

How can you say Winchester never did or did not do something. Unless you have inspected every firearm manufactured by Winchester it is just theory. Am I correct?

Sage 1



What exactly are you referring to in your question? There are many things that can be stated with complete assurity concerning what Winchester did and did not do... and there are many things that can not be said with 100% assurity.

GunBroker.com Moderator

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Bert H. - http://www.bbhc.org/explore/firearms/firearms-records/

Real Men own and shoot a WINCHESTER Single-Shot!


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abritincanada
Starting Member

Canada
9 Posts

Posted - 03/18/2011 :  11:20:36 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Gentlemen,

Please excuse me for not being up to date with all there is regarding weapons of this style and history.
I have an old neighbor who has 3 weapons he is interested in trying to find the age etc.This is a daunting task as I know none of the terminology used etc,even though I spent most of my life in the military. So I am trusting you guys,the experts,can help.
I know he has a winchester shotgun 1897 serial 529508 which he said his father pass down to him
There is also a winchester lever action model 92 ?? wcf 25.20 calibre. I have not seen any mention of a 92 any place I have looked

And H&R Plainsman .22 with scope Serial 23481

I dont know if I have found every piece of information needed to research the weapons,I have tried but being a noob it is a maze and have no idea what most of the means.

I am computer literate and have a few digital cameras so could get pics if needed,but you would have to tell me exactly where to look on the weapons
I really appreciate your time on this.

Nigel
Oh forgot to mention if you need to know,these weapons are located in Canada.

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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 03/18/2011 :  11:51:44 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by abritincanada

Hi Gentlemen,

Please excuse me for not being up to date with all there is regarding weapons of this style and history.
I have an old neighbor who has 3 weapons he is interested in trying to find the age etc.This is a daunting task as I know none of the terminology used etc,even though I spent most of my life in the military. So I am trusting you guys,the experts,can help.
I know he has a winchester shotgun 1897 serial 529508 which he said his father pass down to him
There is also a winchester lever action model 92 ?? wcf 25.20 calibre. I have not seen any mention of a 92 any place I have looked

And H&R Plainsman .22 with scope Serial 23481

I dont know if I have found every piece of information needed to research the weapons,I have tried but being a noob it is a maze and have no idea what most of the means.

I am computer literate and have a few digital cameras so could get pics if needed,but you would have to tell me exactly where to look on the weapons
I really appreciate your time on this.

Nigel
Oh forgot to mention if you need to know,these weapons are located in Canada.



Hello Nigel,

Please repost your question(s) as a new topic post in the Ask The Experts forum. This topic string is dedicated to the Models 94, 55, & 64 only.


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Real Men own and shoot a WINCHESTER Single-Shot!


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abritincanada
Starting Member

Canada
9 Posts

Posted - 03/18/2011 :  11:57:04 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Bert,

Opps, have done.
Thanks.
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slugo
Starting Member

31 Posts

Posted - 04/06/2011 :  6:51:15 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
1. 3,414,372

2. 30-30 WIN.

3. FLAT CHECKERED

4. BLANK UPPER TANG

5. DRILLED FOR PEEP SIGHT

6. NO
7. PROOF STEEL

8. NO
9-14. N/A
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 04/06/2011 :  9:05:58 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by slugo

1. 3,414,372

2. 30-30 WIN.

3. FLAT CHECKERED

4. BLANK UPPER TANG

5. DRILLED FOR PEEP SIGHT

6. NO

7. PROOF STEEL

8. NO
9-14. N/A



1972 production, and well outside of the serial range I am surveying.


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Bert H. - http://www.bbhc.org/explore/firearms/firearms-records/

Real Men own and shoot a WINCHESTER Single-Shot!


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Low Friction
Starting Member

USA
1 Posts

Posted - 04/24/2011 :  02:28:28 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Bert,

This is my grandfathers rifle that was passed to my father and then to me. It's in very good condition. I used to take it to the range in the 70's.

1) 234203
2) 25-35 W.C.F.
3) Smooth steel butt plate. Similar to the picture of the carbine but not identical.
4) Type 5. It reads "MODEL 1894 -WINCHESTER- TRADE MARK"
5) Does not have the 2 small screws in the upper right of the receiver like your picture.
6) Looks forged. Not like your picture. My gun has a full octagon 26" barrel.
7) Nickel Steel barrel Especially for smokeless Powder.
8) No saddle ring.

Tom

Edited by - Low Friction on 04/24/2011 12:03:00 PM
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 04/25/2011 :  11:58:17 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Low Friction

Hi Bert,

This is my grandfathers rifle that was passed to my father and then to me. It's in very good condition. I used to take it to the range in the 70's.

1) 234203
2) 25-35 W.C.F.
3) Smooth steel butt plate. Similar to the picture of the carbine but not identical.
4) Type 5. It reads "MODEL 1894 -WINCHESTER- TRADE MARK"
5) Does not have the 2 small screws in the upper right of the receiver like your picture.
6) Looks forged. Not like your picture. My gun has a full octagon 26" barrel.
7) Nickel Steel barrel Especially for smokeless Powder.
8) No saddle ring.

Tom



Hello Tom,

Your Model 1894 is a 1904 vintage Sporting Rifle, and the upper tang stamp is the Type-2 marking.

The Cody Firearms Musuem has the original factory ledger data for your Rifle, and the Research Office can provide a factory letter (cost is $60) that documents the exact date it was received, the configuration and the sold date.

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Ambrose
Senior Member

2339 Posts

Posted - 09/25/2011 :  10:48:20 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bert: Here's a couple more 94's for your history:

#1 202046
#2 30 W.C.F.
#3 carbine
#4 MODEL 1894
-WINCHESTER-
PAT. AUG 21, 1894
#5 NO
#6 NO
#7 YES
#8 YES


#1 232541
#2 32-40
#3 Hard Rubber (w/widow's peak)
#4 Not sure (has tang sight)
#5 NO
#6 NO
#7 NO
#8 YES
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 09/25/2011 :  12:39:43 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ambrose

Bert: Here's a couple more 94's for your history:

#1 202046
#2 30 W.C.F.
#3 carbine
#4 MODEL 1894
-WINCHESTER-
PAT. AUG 21, 1894
#5 NO
#6 NO
#7 YES
#8 YES


#1 232541
#2 32-40
#3 Hard Rubber (w/widow's peak)
#4 Not sure (has tang sight)
#5 NO
#6 NO
#7 NO
#8 YES



Thanks, but both of those serial numbers are too early in the production run for what I am specifically looking for.

The Cody Firearms Museum has the original factory ledgers for both of your Model 1894s and can provide a factory letter for them.


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Real Men own and shoot a WINCHESTER Single-Shot!



Edited by - Bert H. on 09/25/2011 12:41:00 PM
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Ojinaga
Starting Member

Afghanistan
2 Posts

Posted - 11/09/2011 :  7:02:08 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Bert, I saw this site and sent you a email. Later I saw the correct way to ask
1) 1308902 , the one looks normal
2) one hole in tang with screw.
3) Metal butt plate with horizontal metal lines
4) rear sight looks like the one in the picture for 7
5) Gun came from a Texas Ranger
6) No proofs or marks on wood or metal
7)) 30 WCF
Thanks for the help
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kylew
New Member

USA
86 Posts

Posted - 12/08/2011 :  1:31:33 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bert, Kyle here.. I have not posted in some time. Here are two 94's I have picked up. Answers to you questions in order

#1 Model 1894 sporting rifle
1. 287830
2 .32 W.S.
3. crescent
4. MODEL 1894
-WINCHESTER-
trade mark (i cannot see the photos anymore)
5. Not drilled
6. No (too early)
7. Nickel steel
8. No (rifle)
9. thru 14. NA

Notes. full length mag. full oct barrel. finish 90+% inc case color. has rec and barrel proof marks and it also has a Browning Brothers roll stamp on top of barrel (cool). unmolested. March 1906 I think

#2 Model 1894 sporting rifle
1. 1159897
2. 32 W.S. (the other one has a .32 this one just 32)
3. Crescent
4. Type 7 i think? cant see photos anymore.
WINCHESTER (script type tilted)
trade mark
MADE IN U.S.A.
5. Not drilled
6. No
7. Nickel steel
8. No (rifle)
9. - 14. NA
Notes. 1/2 round 1/2 oct barrel. button mag. (lite weight). Rec and barrel have proof marks. finish about 80% unmolested. Feb 1938 I think.

Both from Paul V. Both are really nice with lite use and no abuse. Let me know if you have other questions. Kyle

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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 12/08/2011 :  2:56:11 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by kylew

Bert, Kyle here.. I have not posted in some time. Here are two 94's I have picked up. Answers to you questions in order

#1 Model 1894 sporting rifle
1. 287830
2 .32 W.S.
3. crescent
4. MODEL 1894
-WINCHESTER-
trade mark (i cannot see the photos anymore)
5. Not drilled
6. No (too early)
7. Nickel steel
8. No (rifle)
9. thru 14. NA

Notes. full length mag. full oct barrel. finish 90+% inc case color. has rec and barrel proof marks and it also has a Browning Brothers roll stamp on top of barrel (cool). unmolested. March 1906 I think

#2 Model 1894 sporting rifle
1. 1159897
2. 32 W.S. (the other one has a .32 this one just 32)
3. Crescent
4. Type 7 i think? cant see photos anymore.
WINCHESTER (script type tilted)
trade mark
MADE IN U.S.A.
5. Not drilled
6. No
7. Nickel steel
8. No (rifle)
9. - 14. NA
Notes. 1/2 round 1/2 oct barrel. button mag. (lite weight). Rec and barrel have proof marks. finish about 80% unmolested. Feb 1938 I think.

Both from Paul V. Both are really nice with lite use and no abuse. Let me know if you have other questions. Kyle





The first was serialized in December of 1905. It will undoubtedly letter as being received in the warehouse in early 1906. The Browning Bros. marking on the barrel does make it a bit special.

Serial 1159897 was serialized in January of 1938. You must have just bought this one, as I had my hands on it at the Big Reno show just a few weeks ago.

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kylew
New Member

USA
86 Posts

Posted - 12/09/2011 :  10:20:31 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I was not at this last show, But I was at the one before. Paul picked the one you saw for me. He always keeps an eye out for one's he thinks I will like. It's like I get the benefits and don't even have to go. I can stay home and try to earn a few pennies to pay for all this. The Day boys also will keep an eye open for me. Kyle
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AirCommando
New Member

USA
61 Posts

Posted - 12/16/2011 :  9:17:40 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bert, here is the info on my 1894 SRC.

1. 870481
2. 25-35 W.C.F.
3. Carbine
4. MODEL 1894
-WINCHESTER-
Trade Mark, (etc) (Can't see your pics of types)
5. No
6. No
7. Nickel Steel
8. Yes
9-14 N/A

Hope this helps, Terry


Edited by - AirCommando on 12/16/2011 9:36:15 PM
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spider65
Starting Member

USA
32 Posts

Posted - 01/01/2012 :  10:08:46 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have 2 mdl 94s both are 32win spl #1753958,#2543919

lyle g brown jr
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 01/01/2012 :  11:52:40 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by spider65

I have 2 mdl 94s both are 32win spl #1753958,#2543919



Hello Lyle,

Serial number 1753958 is a late in the year 1950 vintage gun. It was manufactured during the transition from the long forend stock to the short forend stock. Which type does it have?

Serial 2543919 is a 1962 vintage gun.

Thank you for participating in my research survey

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Edited by - Bert H. on 01/01/2012 11:55:55 PM
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spider65
Starting Member

USA
32 Posts

Posted - 01/02/2012 :  01:05:57 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
it has the short one almost identical to the other
quote:
Originally posted by Bert H.

quote:
Originally posted by spider65

I have 2 mdl 94s both are 32win spl #1753958,#2543919



Hello Lyle,

Serial number 1753958 is a late in the year 1950 vintage gun. It was manufactured during the transition from the long forend stock to the short forend stock. Which type does it have?

Serial 2543919 is a 1962 vintage gun.

Thank you for participating in my research survey


lyle g brown jr
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mikey888f
Starting Member

USA
22 Posts

Posted - 02/15/2012 :  6:07:21 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
bert, i'm looking for a 1939 year 94. does 1,202,446 fit that year? thanks, mike
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TRAP55
Advanced Member

USA
6953 Posts

Posted - 02/15/2012 :  10:14:29 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Mike, yes it does, serial numbers for 1939 started at 1,198,406 and ended at 1,216,165.


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kylew
New Member

USA
86 Posts

Posted - 03/05/2012 :  6:49:12 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bert, Here is one I got from Paul.V today. I've been working on this one for a while and you may have seen it before. I been staring at it for a couple of years.

Model 1894 rifle
32 W.S. Ser # 403,358
26 round matted barrel, matting stops at the rear sight dovetail
sling swivels, engraved factory for sure as the rec proof mark is down off the side to avoid the engraving. Barrel proof is in a circle in the engraving that goes forward to the rear sight. We think it was matted and engraved at the same time.
Full length mag tube.
Straight grip checkered stocks. Type H. 3X wood.
Nickel or silver plated crescent butt plate
Front sight. One I have never seen before. It is a blade type with a thin blade with a round rod at the top. Half of this blade is copper/bronze plated to make it appear as a bead sight when looking down the barrel. The address on the sight says W.F. SHEARE TACOMA WASH. on the other side it has a patent date PAT. JUNE 12,1900.
Rear sight is a ramp type with a thin globe and a very small v notch in the center of the globe. The bottom half of the globe has a plate with the notch in it. Much like a Beech sight. No name or date that i can see. It is 2-3/16" from the center of the dovetail to the back if the globe.

We think it went to the factory for an R&R It received a new barrel and the matting and engraving then. Finish on all is 90% or so. Very nice gun. The prettiest one I own. The Days have looked it over and they thought it all looked correct. I wonder about the sights though. I just don't know enough.
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 03/12/2012 :  09:35:05 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Kyle,

I seem to remember the rifle... vaguely.

The Sheard front sight is correct. Winchester installed them on special order right around the turn of the century. Sheard eventually sold all of his patents to Marbles, and they continued to make the sights. I am not sure what type of rear sight you are describing. Please post a picture of it, or send pictures directly to me (Win1885@msn.com)


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potree
Starting Member

USA
1 Posts

Posted - 03/19/2012 :  10:13:52 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hello - I am researching a 1894 Winchester SRC in 30WCF with no visible serial number. The barrel inscriptions are nearly worn off, so while I could believe the serial number was scrubbed off, the receiver contours compare well enough to the pictures in your posting, I believe it could have left the factory without a serial number.
2. Caliber marked on barrel is 30 W.C.F. The "3" is almost worn off.
3. The steel buttplate is crescent shaped, no diamond around screw.
4. The pictures describing tang markings 5,6,7 are no longer available. Between the two tang screws and dashes, all caps is "WINCHESTER" . Under WINCHESTER, all caps is "TRADE MARK REG.IN U.S. PAT. OFF."
5. Never been drilled or tapped.
6. No visible martial marks that I'm familiar with, no cartouches in wood.
7. ? steel. Only letters readable on barrel are "N U.S.A." AND "3 AUGUST 2"
8. Does have saddle ring.
12. Solid frame
13. Uncheckered wood. one sling loop in butt. Wood has varnish on top of dirty, unprepared wood. Milled front barrel band. Bright new front barrel band (non-original). Flaking blue under both bareel bands, magazine tube under forend dull blue. Older style rear sight, numbers and graduations worn off.

Is there an internal serial number that I can look for or a means of finding the year of production? Thank you
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 03/21/2012 :  10:36:27 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by potree

Hello - I am researching a 1894 Winchester SRC in 30WCF with no visible serial number. The barrel inscriptions are nearly worn off, so while I could believe the serial number was scrubbed off, the receiver contours compare well enough to the pictures in your posting, I believe it could have left the factory without a serial number.
2. Caliber marked on barrel is 30 W.C.F. The "3" is almost worn off.
3. The steel buttplate is crescent shaped, no diamond around screw.
4. The pictures describing tang markings 5,6,7 are no longer available. Between the two tang screws and dashes, all caps is "WINCHESTER" . Under WINCHESTER, all caps is "TRADE MARK REG.IN U.S. PAT. OFF."
5. Never been drilled or tapped.
6. No visible martial marks that I'm familiar with, no cartouches in wood.
7. ? steel. Only letters readable on barrel are "N U.S.A." AND "3 AUGUST 2"
8. Does have saddle ring.
12. Solid frame
13. Uncheckered wood. one sling loop in butt. Wood has varnish on top of dirty, unprepared wood. Milled front barrel band. Bright new front barrel band (non-original). Flaking blue under both bareel bands, magazine tube under forend dull blue. Older style rear sight, numbers and graduations worn off.

Is there an internal serial number that I can look for or a means of finding the year of production? Thank you



Your Model 1894 orignally had a serial number on it (as did all of them that left the factory for commercial sales). From your description, your gun has heavy wear to the metal surfaces, or it has been buffed & polished at some point and refinished.

The upper tang marking on your gun was in use between serial numbers 450,000 - 750,000 (1910 - 1915).


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32-20onr
Starting Member

USA
5 Posts

Posted - 04/15/2012 :  5:35:12 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I have a Model 1894 winchester 38-55 serial LL47L3, crecent steel buttplate 26" octagon barrel. Trying to find the year it was made. Can not find any info on the serial number at all. Please help. Thanks

Edited by - 32-20onr on 04/15/2012 9:13:02 PM
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 04/16/2012 :  01:11:07 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by 32-20onr

I have a Model 1894 winchester 38-55 serial LL47L3, crecent steel buttplate 26" octagon barrel. Trying to find the year it was made. Can not find any info on the serial number at all. Please help. Thanks



The serial number is actually "114713", and it was manufactured in May of 1901.


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32-20onr
Starting Member

USA
5 Posts

Posted - 04/16/2012 :  8:57:40 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Wow! That is impressive! Thank you. Now my next decision is to decide whether to restore this nice rifle. At some point in time someone tried to remove the bluing. It still looks nice and functions very well with nice rifling. The forword stock is in good condition for the age but the butt stock has been repaired long ago and does not look safe to shoot, though I do not know how much this rifle kicks to make a good judgment on that.
It was a retirement gift from my grandfather who received it as partial payment on a 1952 International pickup. He never shot it. It has been in a gun cabinet for decades.
I would love to put down a nice Alabama buck with it in the near future. What a story that would be!
Thanks again.
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rwg
Starting Member

USA
14 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2012 :  2:16:17 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hello Bert,
I would like to enter my recently aquired Mod 94 into your database so here goes.
1 1520272
2 30 WCF
3 flat checkered steel
4 blank
5 drilled & tapped, very neat appearing in proper location with plug
screws. Not factory?
6 no
7 proof steel
8 no
9 n/a
10 n/a
11 flat band
12 n/a
13 n/a
14 n/a
Would like to add that the forend on my 94 is of the long style and extends approx. 2" past the center band.
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2012 :  11:11:48 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by rwg

Hello Bert,
I would like to enter my recently aquired Mod 94 into your database so here goes.
1 1520272
2 30 WCF
3 flat checkered steel
4 blank
5 drilled & tapped, very neat appearing in proper location with plug
screws. Not factory?
6 no
7 proof steel
8 no
9 n/a
10 n/a
11 flat band
12 n/a
13 n/a
14 n/a
Would like to add that the forend on my 94 is of the long style and extends approx. 2" past the center band.



The drilled & tapped receiver holes could be original (special order), but I can not say for sure without examining them. Everything else about your 1948 vintage flat-band carbine is normal.

Thanks

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rwg
Starting Member

USA
14 Posts

Posted - 05/22/2012 :  7:44:49 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Bert H.

quote:
Originally posted by rwg

Hello Bert,
I would like to enter my recently aquired Mod 94 into your database so here goes.
1 1520272
2 30 WCF
3 flat checkered steel
4 blank
5 drilled & tapped, very neat appearing in proper location with plug
screws. Not factory?
6 no
7 proof steel
8 no
9 n/a
10 n/a
11 flat band
12 n/a
13 n/a
14 n/a
Would like to add that the forend on my 94 is of the long style and extends approx. 2" past the center band.



The drilled & tapped receiver holes could be original (special order), but I can not say for sure without examining them. Everything else about your 1948 vintage flat-band carbine is normal.

Thanks


Thanks Bert for your data, much appreciated. Oh, and I need to mention that the carbine and I are the same age! Vintage year no doubt LOL.
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kylew
New Member

USA
86 Posts

Posted - 05/24/2012 :  11:31:08 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hey Bert, I was in Denver last week and found a carbine you may be interested in.
Ser # 1342899 30 WCF
Std eastern carbine, serrated flat butt plate, sling swivels, The front one is missing but it appears that it did not fit the mag tube but was on a second band right behind the forearm barrel band. It does have two Canadian proof marks. It's a "C" with the three lines through the center. The two are different size, one on the bottom front left side of the receiver,(smaller 3/8" dia C). The larger one is on the left side of the butt stock centered 2" from the butt plate.(1/2"dia) Both are oriented (rotated) about 90 deg CCW. I assume from the coast watchers.
Condition about 60%, missing chips of wood and spotted bluing. Missing hood on the front ramp sight. Replaced rear sight. All screws untouched as best I can tell.

I now have an honest WW2 carbine. I met a friend of yours says you stop and see him often. BTW Paul V's health is getting worse. I had lunch with him today. Kyle
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kylew
New Member

USA
86 Posts

Posted - 05/24/2012 :  11:37:08 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Oops, I also picked up an 86 straight grip deluxe 3X matted barrel 85% 33wcf with a box of org ammo and a couple of other treasures. K
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11329 Posts

Posted - 05/25/2012 :  01:08:51 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by kylew

Hey Bert, I was in Denver last week and found a carbine you may be interested in.
Ser # 1342899 30 WCF
Std eastern carbine, serrated flat butt plate, sling swivels, The front one is missing but it appears that it did not fit the mag tube but was on a second band right behind the forearm barrel band. It does have two Canadian proof marks. It's a "C" with the three lines through the center. The two are different size, one on the bottom front left side of the receiver,(smaller 3/8" dia C). The larger one is on the left side of the butt stock centered 2" from the butt plate.(1/2"dia) Both are oriented (rotated) about 90 deg CCW. I assume from the coast watchers.
Condition about 60%, missing chips of wood and spotted bluing. Missing hood on the front ramp sight. Replaced rear sight. All screws untouched as best I can tell.

I now have an honest WW2 carbine. I met a friend of yours says you stop and see him often. BTW Paul V's health is getting worse. I had lunch with him today. Kyle



Hello Kyle,

What you have is a PCMR (Pacific Coast Militia Rangers) Carbine, and it is now the highest serial number in my survey of PCMR Carbines. Per the PR records, it was serialized July 29th, 1942, less than one month before production of the Model 94 was suspended until November of 1944.

Can you send me some pictures of it? Does it have a Type-7 upper tang marking and not drilled & tapped for a tang sight? Please send me an email.

I am sorry to hear the Paul's health is declining so quickly. I just saw and spoke with him in Reno last month.


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kylew
New Member

USA
86 Posts

Posted - 05/25/2012 :  8:44:05 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I will try and get you some photos. I may need to send them directly to you. Paul and Inez were in Sacramento at the antique truck show after Reno and she developed a clot and almost did not make it home. I call her mom. Those two and their boys are some of my very dearest friends. It is very hard to watch their impending exit. Kyle
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