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 Help with .310/300 Rook info
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1fisher
Member

USA
885 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:16:27 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Okay -- I have a beautiful old Alex Henry rook rifle in all original condition. The barrel is stamped ".300".

The problem I am having is that .300 Rook is supposed to be a true .300" bore, but when I slug mine, I keep getting .307-.308". A cast bullet at .300 just falls down the barrel.

However, a .308" bullet in the correct 300 Rook brass is too fat to fit in the chamber. I have fired the rifle with .300" bullets and it is obvious that they are not gripping the rifling (it just flings them all over the place.)

On the internet, I see a few references to a .310/300 Rook, also known as a .305 Rook or .300 Rook Special. But I cannot find any dimensions or other info on the cartridge.

Does anybody here have History and Development of Small Arms Ammunition Volume 3 by George Hoyem? That is the book referenced on the web, but I don't want to buy the book if it just mentions it but doesn't give any specifics.

I keep thinking that this gun needs a heeled bullet to work with the chamber/bore dimentions that I am measuring. I would like to get any info possible before I spend the time and effort to have a custom mold built.

ANY info on these Rook cartridges would be really appreciated! Thanks

There ain't many troubles that a man can't fix with seven hundred dollars and a thirty-aught six -- Lindy Wisdom (daughter of Jeff Cooper)

grumpygy
Advanced Member

USA
31946 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:21:32 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
or could it be a

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.310_Cadet
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grumpygy
Advanced Member

USA
31946 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:26:45 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
HAve you checked the Libray for the book. I found a few for sale, but they cost what I would pay for a rifle.
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retroxler58
Advanced Member

Burkina Faso (Upper Volta)
27284 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:28:44 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Could original bullets have been hollow base like the 50 cal Maxi Ball for a muzzle loader??
The base would expand, gripping the rifling of the barrel...

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1fisher
Member

USA
885 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:31:32 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
You are right about the cost of the book, that's why I am hoping to find somebody who already has it.

An empty brass for a .310 cadet will not even go into the chamber on my Alex Henry rifle. (I load the .310 for a BSA Martini Cadet -- that is why I am familiar with heeled bullets and think that this unknown Rook must use one.) The Cadet bullet has an outside diameter of .323", so it is way too big.


There ain't many troubles that a man can't fix with seven hundred dollars and a thirty-aught six -- Lindy Wisdom (daughter of Jeff Cooper)
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retroxler58
Advanced Member

Burkina Faso (Upper Volta)
27284 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:32:47 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by grumpygy

or could it be a

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.310_Cadet

Very good point...
Using a heeled bullet (like a 22LR is) would allow a larger caliber bullet in a smaller caliber case...
See the image in this wiki post... Web Link

Quite possibly this is the case...

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gesshots
Advanced Member

USA
13467 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:34:27 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Cartridges of the World ~

300 [295] Rook bullet dia. - .300 //// bore dia -.295

310 Cadet - .316 bullet dia.

gesshots

The human race has only one really effective weapon, and that is laughter. - Mark Twain

It is just like man's vanity and impertinence to call an animal dumb because it is dumb to his dull perceptions.
~ Mark Twain

Well. We'll see what the man's sellin'. THEN we'll shoot him. ~ Hub

Load six... if your gut, tells you too !
~ J. B. Books


Edited by - gesshots on 11/13/2011 3:37:44 PM
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retroxler58
Advanced Member

Burkina Faso (Upper Volta)
27284 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:39:40 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by 1fisher

You are right about the cost of the book, that's why I am hoping to find somebody who already has it.

An empty brass for a .310 cadet will not even go into the chamber on my Alex Henry rifle. (I load the .310 for a BSA Martini Cadet -- that is why I am familiar with heeled bullets and think that this unknown Rook must use one.) The Cadet bullet has an outside diameter of .323", so it is way too big.


Likely would require a special casting mold set... unless you can find something elsewhere.
Be sure to check Midway and possible Lee, Lyman or RCBS directly...
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grumpygy
Advanced Member

USA
31946 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:42:01 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Found another cheaper book on the Rook It may have some info for you.

http://www.amazon.com/Classic-British-Rook-Rabbit-Rifle/dp/1861268807


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Tflogger
Senior Member

2288 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:43:28 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Just to throw another log on the fire, George Nonte's book "Home Guide to Cartridge Conversions" Lists a 305 Rook.
It does call for a .300 bullet using a 32-20 case with 5gr. of unique with a 100gr. bullet.
John Donnlly's book,"The Handloader's Manual of Cartridge Conversions" Calls the .295 Rook and the .300 Rook the same cartridge and recomends using .32 colt brass for a short version. Again with a .300 bullet.
A heeled bullet or a hollow base sounds like your best bet.
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grumpygy
Advanced Member

USA
31946 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:44:17 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Rook


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grumpygy
Advanced Member

USA
31946 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  3:47:01 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Found this too.

http://forums.GunBroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=535464
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1fisher
Member

USA
885 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  4:02:32 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the info so far!!

I wondered about a hollow base bullet also - I might try to make a couple by drilling out the base of a .300" bullet and see how that works.

I have looked at all the lists for Lyman, RCBS, etc. molds that I can find, and don't see what I am looking for. I may just have to get a custom mold built.

This is turning into a little bit of a mystery, but that is the fun of antique guns!

There ain't many troubles that a man can't fix with seven hundred dollars and a thirty-aught six -- Lindy Wisdom (daughter of Jeff Cooper)
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gesshots
Advanced Member

USA
13467 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  4:12:36 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
http://britishmilitariaforums.yuku.com/topic/9764

British military forum discussing rook ctgs.

gesshots

The human race has only one really effective weapon, and that is laughter. - Mark Twain

It is just like man's vanity and impertinence to call an animal dumb because it is dumb to his dull perceptions.
~ Mark Twain

Well. We'll see what the man's sellin'. THEN we'll shoot him. ~ Hub

Load six... if your gut, tells you too !
~ J. B. Books

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hillbille
Advanced Member

5742 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  7:00:00 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
one of the new gun magazines had a pretty good article on the rook and reloading for it, saw it at work the other day, just cant remember the title of the magazine.... its hell gettin old.
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The Ginral
Junior Member

USA
150 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  8:34:51 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Rifle Firearms Sporting Journal, Nov. issue. Shooting the .300 Sherwood.
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MIKE WISKEY
Advanced Member

7959 Posts

Posted - 11/13/2011 :  9:05:35 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
"The problem I am having is that .300 Rook is supposed to be a true .300" bore"........well a .300" BORE would take a .308" bullet.I have used a .31 cal. muzzel loading pistol bullet for the .310, this is a 'heeled bullet and works ok.

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