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 MR. Pietro 75
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notnow
Junior Member

USA
324 Posts

Posted - 05/19/2013 :  11:12:34 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I just read the pizza thread. I too have intentions of building an outdoor oven. I've seen plans in books and on line for these, but they all seem to require the heat source to be in the cooking area. I want to build one where the heat is beneath the cooking surface, like a real oven. I owned a pizzeria many years ago. I used Bakers Pride ovens. They used a "stone" cooking deck, about 1 1/4" thick. It was a composition of some sort. Do you have any ideas on what that may be. I was thinking Portland cement, fireclay and an aggregate of some sort or maybe none at all. I'm also not sure if I make it 2'x2' or so that I won't need to reinforce it with some mesh or small bar, and what effect 450 deg. will have on that. I hope this fits in GD, I thought about putting this in ATE but I'm already here. I've seen pictures of the work you've done that you posted on here, and your work looks top of the line.

forgemonkey
Advanced Member

USA
12214 Posts

Posted - 05/19/2013 :  11:17:21 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
,,,,not your typical 'oven',,,,,,but when living in Taos, NM I built a 'horno',,,,,love it for baking,,,,

http://www.caminorealheritage.org/gallery/g2/g2_002.htm
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LaidbackDan
Advanced Member

14160 Posts

Posted - 05/19/2013 :  11:18:29 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
He may be confused, do you want the information now?


I just read "100 things to do before you die" and was quite surprised that yelling for help wasn't one of them.





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notnow
Junior Member

USA
324 Posts

Posted - 05/19/2013 :  11:38:14 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the reply. The Horno is the type I want to improve on. With the fire in the same place as the food, it kind of limits what you can cook and how much and at what pace. What I'm shooting for is a lower chamber for the wood coals, and an upper cooking chamber that I can put the pizza right on the surface, with vent areas between the chambers that I can block off or leave open to regulate heat to direct it to the bottom (deck surface) or the top. On the ovens I used there was an adjustment rod that operated a baffle in the back of the oven. It was labeled "in for top heat- out for bottom heat", And it was necessary.
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pietro75
Advanced Member

USA
6578 Posts

Posted - 05/19/2013 :  11:59:24 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by notnow

Thanks for the reply. The Horno is the type I want to improve on. With the fire in the same place as the food, it kind of limits what you can cook and how much and at what pace. What I'm shooting for is a lower chamber for the wood coals, and an upper cooking chamber that I can put the pizza right on the surface, with vent areas between the chambers that I can block off or leave open to regulate heat to direct it to the bottom (deck surface) or the top. On the ovens I used there was an adjustment rod that operated a baffle in the back of the oven. It was labeled "in for top heat- out for bottom heat", And it was necessary.



I want mine well above 450. When I cook pizzas in my home oven, I turn the gas all the way up 550 with one rack on the very bottom to start the pizzas for the first ten minutes and one rack on the very top to finish for about 4-5 minutes.

My ideal oven will be well over 600 and cook in one shot at about 5 min. tops!

OK, I just got home from running the kids all over. SO, I'm gonna give the short answer and then I will give the details tomorrow night.

Yes, you can build an indirect heat oven to achieve the same results as a direct heat oven. You can use fire brick for the base of the oven and it will be just as heat resistant as the stone sheets that were in your baker's pride.

The draft required for the fire box is a door opening to vault height relationship.

The door to the fire box cannot be over 60% taller than the fire box itself. you can design your oven to build your firebox below the oven. You can then use heat in your oven or the firebox below the oven depending on what you are trying to achieve.

We can go on in more detail as you describe your design for the 2x2 dimensions that you are thinking.

Mine is going to be a bit bigger than 2x2. It will be direct heat and have a side box for indirect heat. So basically a double stacker.

What is popular is not always right, What is right is not always popular!

Parenting is the most difficult,challenging, rewarding, dangerous job on this planet.-bigoutside

Edited by - pietro75 on 05/20/2013 12:02:57 AM
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notnow
Junior Member

USA
324 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2013 :  12:06:24 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote

thanks for the reply. One of my goals in this is to be able to cook outside in hotter months. What I have in mind is a concrete pad, block for a base, firebrick on that, firebrick "splits" around the insides up to the cooking deck. The smoke drafting up the back then out through the top just above the front. I may cast a top in a dome fashion. This will be tricky. I at one time worked with a chimney sweep who relined chimneys. For some applications he'd use a slurry of fireclay, Portland cement and granulated vermiculite. It was light, rigid and would take really high heat. I should stop yakkin about this and get busy on it. It's been in the back of my mind foe about 8 yrs. Once again thanks.
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pietro75
Advanced Member

USA
6578 Posts

Posted - 05/21/2013 :  10:40:17 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by notnow


thanks for the reply. One of my goals in this is to be able to cook outside in hotter months. What I have in mind is a concrete pad, block for a base, firebrick on that, firebrick "splits" around the insides up to the cooking deck. The smoke drafting up the back then out through the top just above the front. I may cast a top in a dome fashion. This will be tricky. I at one time worked with a chimney sweep who relined chimneys. For some applications he'd use a slurry of fireclay, Portland cement and granulated vermiculite. It was light, rigid and would take really high heat. I should stop yakkin about this and get busy on it. It's been in the back of my mind foe about 8 yrs. Once again thanks.



You're on the right track with the cladding. If you keep your opening less than 60% of the height of the vault(firebox) and build a stack outside of the opening you will get draw from that thing.

There are so many ways to build a kicker to arch that dome. I screw together wood forms as a kicker that can be unscrewed and pulled out after I complete the dome with firebrick. Youcan use a fireclay additive with you mortar or just buy pre-blended sear-set refractory mortar. I buy the pre-blend as it is higher temp.

When you complete this project be sure to take seven days of small fires in it to condition it. Ramp up the heat of the fire every day. Start at about 250 and work your way up to 600. This will break it in and keep it from expanding and cracking form heating it up too quick.

What is popular is not always right, What is right is not always popular!

Parenting is the most difficult,challenging, rewarding, dangerous job on this planet.-bigoutside
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