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 Winchester Pre-64 Mod. 70 Featherweight
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hipshoot
New Member

USA
51 Posts

Posted - 01/12/2018 :  1:45:01 PM  Show Profile
I purchased a model 70 in a 308 caliber that has a substantial amount of pitting inside the barrel. Enough that it hurts the accuracy even with hand loads. The wood is what I would estimate 80% and bluing 90%. Mfg. date is 1954.
So my question is?: Should I look into rebarreling it? If so, that obviously will depreciate the value.

charliemeyer007
Advanced Member

USA
5557 Posts

Posted - 01/12/2018 :  1:52:37 PM  Show Profile
What kind of accuracy are you getting? What kind of accuracy would you like? I'm thinking your rifle is a shooter value not a collector, so I wouldn't worry about depreciation and concentrate on increasing accuracy.

added If the new barrel has the same contour and uses the same bolt face, you can always put your pitted 308 back on with no harm done. A 7mm08, maybe a 6.5 or a 6 something. 22-250, 257 AI Roberts Smaller hole is a stiffer barrel.

Have you worked the pitted barrel with JB's bore paste after a really good cleaning with a good copper solvent such as Shooter's choice?. Hard cast Lovern style bullets with JB as the lube.

Edited by - charliemeyer007 on 01/12/2018 9:02:59 PM
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hipshoot
New Member

USA
51 Posts

Posted - 01/12/2018 :  2:08:24 PM  Show Profile
I have 2 other Pre-64 in 30-06 & 270 that will shoot 1" or better 5 shot groups @ 100 yds. This 308 I struggle to get 1-3/4" Most of the time there 2" or worse.
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swearengine
Senior Member

USA
1216 Posts

Posted - 01/12/2018 :  2:45:12 PM  Show Profile
I would rebarrel it. At 80-90% very few are going to consider it a collectible. True collectors are looking for 95% +.

Life is hard, harder for some. Augustus Mcrae
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rufe-snow
Advanced Member

17938 Posts

Posted - 01/12/2018 :  3:39:54 PM  Show Profile
I believe that 1954, was the first year of production for the 308? Because of this, it might have substantial collectors value. Even considering, it's less than excellent condition.

I would hold off rebarreling. Until it could be ascertained what it's present collectors value is. It might be worth, substantially more than you think?





Edit #1,

"Cartridges of the World", says that Winchester brought it out in 1952. For both the Model 70, and Model 88. The U.S. military adopted it as the 7.62 X 51, in 1954.

I guess my original info was wrong.



Edited by - rufe-snow on 01/12/2018 4:59:15 PM
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hipshoot
New Member

USA
51 Posts

Posted - 01/12/2018 :  4:28:45 PM  Show Profile
I believe that 1954, was the first year of production for the 308?
quote:


I looked in my recent "Blue Book of Gun Values" and can't seem to figure out what year the 308 went into production! I thought it was 1952. For what it's worth it does have the aluminum buttplate.
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Okie743
Senior Member

USA
1542 Posts

Posted - 01/13/2018 :  08:31:18 AM  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by hipshoot

I have 2 other Pre-64 in 30-06 & 270 that will shoot 1" or better 5 shot groups @ 100 yds. This 308 I struggle to get 1-3/4" Most of the time there 2" or worse.



Yep, I've seen some 308's (Winchester 70 and Remington 700) which are suppose to be inherently accurate be very fineky about producing the one inch accuracy of a 30;06. I can usually take 1 inch off of a 2 inch group by glass bedding and floating the barrel and reloading, and trying different powders and bullets, H4350, R19, but not limited to these two. Easier to reduce a 2 inch group to 1 inch than reduce a 1 inch group to 1/2 inch. Make sure it's not the scope or mount area.

It's easy to blame a bad barrel, almost done so myself few times when it's just not fed the correct recipe that it wants yet.

and I shoot 3 shot groups out of a hunting rifle, especially a featherweight barrel. (due to heating)When testing a hunting rifle for groups I always pay attention to the first shot out of a cold barrel rifle as compared to the next shots. When You get a hunting rifle to where it will shoot a good cold barrel group consistently this is a good accurate hunting rifle. The first cold barrel shot needs to print with the 2 and 3.

Is your featherweight glass bedded properly AND with the barrel floated?



Edited by - Okie743 on 01/13/2018 08:41:09 AM
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hipshoot
New Member

USA
51 Posts

Posted - 01/13/2018 :  09:50:45 AM  Show Profile
Okie, Thank you very much for your input as I agree 100%. None of my featherweights have the barrel floated or glass bedded. So I believe that will be my next step on this 308 for sure. I have only tried 3 powders so far and one bullet in the 180 grn. One of my other steps is to try some 165 grainers. My 06 likes the 180 grn Nosler Partition with Norma MRP powder. I also do let the barrel cool between shots.

What really bugs me is the condition of the inside of this barrel compared to the exterior. I had stated earlier that I rated blueing at 90% but I feel its closer to 95%. Someone took really good care of the gun's exterior but must have totally neglected cleaning it or it must have gotten moisture inside and they never knew it. I have used J-B compound as "Charlie" mentioned earlier to try removing the pits but they are really bad.

There are several used pre-64 barrels for sale on the internet but what are the chances I won't get stuck with another one without be able to look inside the barrel?
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tsr1965
Advanced Member

USA
7879 Posts

Posted - 01/13/2018 :  11:23:20 AM  Show Profile
As rufe has stated, that rifle could have considerable collector value. I would hold off on doing any modifications, that are not factory, unless you do not care about potential value. Once you hit it with the knife, all value is gone...you might as well rebarrel it too.

Take a look at these auctions on the otherside...
http://www.GunBroker.com/Auction/BrowseItems.aspx?IncludeSellers=484399

http://www.GunBroker.com/All/BI.aspx?IncludeSellers=716063

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Okie743
Senior Member

USA
1542 Posts

Posted - 01/13/2018 :  1:40:49 PM  Show Profile
I would try some lighter bullet weights and more reloading tests. (and do everything possible to make it a shooter like it is)

I really think you are condemning the barrel too soon.
Also after a good barrel cleaning some barrels need few fouling shots to settle down.

You need to decide price wise if you want a hunting gun or a collectors gun before doing any mods to a pre 64. If you start glass bedding and changing the barrel the collectors value goes out the window, other than the pre 64 serial number.

You are looking at: Buying a GOOD pre 64 barrel in 308, head spacing by a trustworthy gunsmith, then testing.

Summary: You need to do more testing first.

If not really familiar with reloading for a 308 you might consider a $10
308 Winchester Reloading Manual LOADBOOKS USA Loadbook, LATEST VERSION
This little book shows several most accurate loads, powders and bullet weights for the 308 Winchester caliber.



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hipshoot
New Member

USA
51 Posts

Posted - 01/13/2018 :  2:16:57 PM  Show Profile
Thanks everyone for the advice.

I guess I am condemning the barrel to soon as you say okie!!
I'll do more barrel cleaning/scrubbing and try working more different loads with lighter bullets and see what happens.
Now after a few peoples advice I do want to keep it as original as possible for sure.
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