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 1894 WINCHESTER 32 SPL. VALUE?
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ENBLOC
Junior Member

228 Posts

Posted - 01/07/2018 :  01:55:13 AM  Show Profile
I briefly viewed an old 32 Win. Spl. Winchester 1894. Looked up serial # here and it says Oct. 1902, other sources say 1899? It is in fair condition with some rust, light pitting in bore, scattered dings/dents in stock. Prior Owner I assume hand stamped three letters in butt stock. Has 20 inch octagonal barrel. Iron sights are still original, but the rcvr. has been drilled & tapped left side and has three screw Williams side mount for small scope that's on this Rifle? Tube magazine does not go all the way to muzzle, but is half tube with metal end cap. Very little finish left on rcvr. Wood is straight grain and besides digs is still solid. Value in this condition?

tsr1965
Advanced Member

USA
7858 Posts

Posted - 01/07/2018 :  04:42:30 AM  Show Profile
The value is most likely as a shooter, if it shoots. Collector value is nil, unless it was a special order, as I do not believe they made carbine length barrels(20"), as a factory rifle. That said, it most likely has been modified to 20"(cut off), and sounds to be in poor condition. As such, the value is $300.00-400.00 max.

Take a look at these auctions on the otherside...
http://www.GunBroker.com/Auction/BrowseItems.aspx?IncludeSellers=484399

http://www.GunBroker.com/All/BI.aspx?IncludeSellers=716063

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Mod1892
Junior Member

102 Posts

Posted - 01/07/2018 :  10:08:17 AM  Show Profile
Hello,

Winchester most definitely made octagon barrel in 20 inch lengths. The standard length for a Model 1894 was 26 inches but barrel lengths were available from 36 to 14 inches. Was the end of the magazine rounded or was it flat faced. Just based on the description of the gun it may well have had the barrel and magazine cut down. In any case the collector value is zero. Then it just comes down to what some one is willing to pay. If highly altered then the parts value is also shot.

Michael


Model 1892 Collecting, Research, Valuation
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11345 Posts

Posted - 01/07/2018 :  5:03:23 PM  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by ENBLOC

I briefly viewed an old 32 Win. Spl. Winchester 1894. Looked up serial # here and it says Oct. 1902, other sources say 1899? It is in fair condition with some rust, light pitting in bore, scattered dings/dents in stock. Prior Owner I assume hand stamped three letters in butt stock. Has 20 inch octagonal barrel. Iron sights are still original, but the rcvr. has been drilled & tapped left side and has three screw Williams side mount for small scope that's on this Rifle? Tube magazine does not go all the way to muzzle, but is half tube with metal end cap. Very little finish left on rcvr. Wood is straight grain and besides digs is still solid. Value in this condition?



The "other sources" are not accurate. Winchester first introduced the 32 Winchester Special cartridge in October of 1901, and announced it in the June 1902 catalog.

Based on your description of the rifle, my bet is that the barrel and magazine tube have been shortened (cut-down). As Michael pointed out, Winchester did (on special order) manufacture Sporting Rifles with shorter than standard barrels. The most common short length was 20-inches or 22-inches. The Cody Firearms Museum records office can (for a fee) provide a factory letter that will provide the "as built" information.




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Bert H. - http://www.bbhc.org/explore/firearms/firearms-records/

Real Men own and shoot a WINCHESTER Single-Shot!


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ENBLOC
Junior Member

228 Posts

Posted - 01/10/2018 :  1:21:57 PM  Show Profile
I went out to look this Winchester over as it comes up for Auction next week. The barrel has "32 W.S." stamped on top flat over the chamber area. Front blade sight has "Western" stamped on it and is dovetailed 5/8 inch back from muzzle. Barrel measures 19-3/8 muzzle to front of rcvr. Tube magazine is flat on end with eyelet for swivel on it measures 13-1/8 to rcvr. Muzzle to metal end cap of forearm is 9" Has "Williams" scope base with three holes, scope is Weaver K-2.5 60-B El Paso, TX fine cross hairs with dot in center. Was canted to the right. Looking into bore with light I can see some pitting down by chamber area. There is a metal screw in eyelet for the rear swivel screwed into butt 2" up from butt plate. Metal butt plate has a trap door that is stuck half open and someone tried to start filing cross hatching on this. On left side of forearm is stamped 1-6-35 and on right rear of butt is stamped "CBR" This Auction has a mark-up of 16% for "Buyer's Premium" + Our State Sales tax is 6% so 22% will be added to the bid and then $15 for the transfer. When I walked in another fellow was looking this 1894 over and I said that's the one I'm interested in too. He proclaimed "Well....it's all original!" "Are you bidding?" I said "Yes, but I'm not gonna get crazy over this..." I did note that you can use the iron sights or the scope being mounted left. What would your top bid be here for this 1894 with the 22% + $15 added? I.E. How much $$ before you stop and walk away.....
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Grasshopper
Advanced Member

11607 Posts

Posted - 01/10/2018 :  6:53:34 PM  Show Profile
IMO, stay away ...it will go for much more than true value,,bet on it.
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duckhunter
Advanced Member

8807 Posts

Posted - 01/10/2018 :  7:15:37 PM  Show Profile
$400.00.
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11345 Posts

Posted - 01/10/2018 :  11:45:18 PM  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by ENBLOC

I went out to look this Winchester over as it comes up for Auction next week. The barrel has "32 W.S." stamped on top flat over the chamber area. Front blade sight has "Western" stamped on it and is dovetailed 5/8 inch back from muzzle. Barrel measures 19-3/8 muzzle to front of rcvr. Tube magazine is flat on end with eyelet for swivel on it measures 13-1/8 to rcvr. Muzzle to metal end cap of forearm is 9" Has "Williams" scope base with three holes, scope is Weaver K-2.5 60-B El Paso, TX fine cross hairs with dot in center. Was canted to the right. Looking into bore with light I can see some pitting down by chamber area. There is a metal screw in eyelet for the rear swivel screwed into butt 2" up from butt plate. Metal butt plate has a trap door that is stuck half open and someone tried to start filing cross hatching on this. On left side of forearm is stamped 1-6-35 and on right rear of butt is stamped "CBR" This Auction has a mark-up of 16% for "Buyer's Premium" + Our State Sales tax is 6% so 22% will be added to the bid and then $15 for the transfer. When I walked in another fellow was looking this 1894 over and I said that's the one I'm interested in too. He proclaimed "Well....it's all original!" "Are you bidding?" I said "Yes, but I'm not gonna get crazy over this..." I did note that you can use the iron sights or the scope being mounted left. What would your top bid be here for this 1894 with the 22% + $15 added? I.E. How much $$ before you stop and walk away.....



I hope you were yanking the other fellow's chain on when you told him you were going to bid on it! That rifle is positively not factory original, and it has been butchered from its original configuration. I would not recommend bidding anything > $200 on it. Cut down barrel, cut down magazine tube, drilled & tapped after the fact for the scope mount, aftermarket sling mounts, etc.

GunBroker.com Moderator

The Largest Auction Gun Store Online including Pistols, Shotguns, and Rifles


Bert H. - http://www.bbhc.org/explore/firearms/firearms-records/

Real Men own and shoot a WINCHESTER Single-Shot!


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oldWinchesterfan
Member

601 Posts

Posted - 01/10/2018 :  11:58:48 PM  Show Profile
From your description, describing that gun as butchered is unfair to butchers. The flat front on a short mag tube is a dead give away that it has been bubbaed, but that's just one glaring hint. Honestly, there's so much messed up on that gun that you can see, I'd worry about what else is wrong with it. I'd certainly pass.
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ENBLOC
Junior Member

228 Posts

Posted - 01/11/2018 :  12:25:33 AM  Show Profile
Well I did put in a bid for next week online. If I win I will come in just over $400 with the mark-up + transfer. I agree this will probably go for more than my current bid. They sold an 1894 this week with side mounted Simmons 3x9 serial #2,089,795 for $690 with the mark-up + transfer it came to $899. Now back to this 1902 .32 W.S., some sites put the serial #1561xx at 1899, others at 1902. If it is 1899 than this has been re-barreled too? Perhaps the Gentleman who was handling it when I walked in calling it ALL Original will take this up to the $900-$1000 level. I'll hang with my current bid one way or the other. Thanks Guys for all your insights on my lookin' over this "deer Rifle."
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tsr1965
Advanced Member

USA
7858 Posts

Posted - 01/11/2018 :  05:01:04 AM  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by ENBLOC

Well I did put in a bid for next week online. If I win I will come in just over $400 with the mark-up + transfer. I agree this will probably go for more than my current bid. They sold an 1894 this week with side mounted Simmons 3x9 serial #2,089,795 for $690 with the mark-up + transfer it came to $899. Now back to this 1902 .32 W.S., some sites put the serial #1561xx at 1899, others at 1902. If it is 1899 than this has been re-barreled too? Perhaps the Gentleman who was handling it when I walked in calling it ALL Original will take this up to the $900-$1000 level. I'll hang with my current bid one way or the other. Thanks Guys for all your insights on my lookin' over this "deer Rifle."



Just so you know, Bert H is "Mr. Winchester", in these forums, and other ones. One of a handful of very best Winchester Experts on the planet. He has written, and co-authored, 4 editions of reference books, that supersede the ramblings of George Madis, and it is the Golden Standard. So go and be an idiot if you must, and jump off the bridge, just because someone else did. Just so you know, the serial number does not matter, unless its pre-1899, as in 1898, classified as an antique. Bert's reference book..."The Red Book of Winchester", is the only true reference that can be trusted with the serial to DOM cross over. At any rate, it is not an original, or in good condition...not a collector.

Take a look at these auctions on the otherside...
http://www.GunBroker.com/Auction/BrowseItems.aspx?IncludeSellers=484399

http://www.GunBroker.com/All/BI.aspx?IncludeSellers=716063


Edited by - tsr1965 on 01/11/2018 05:11:17 AM
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Bert H.
Moderator

USA
11345 Posts

Posted - 01/11/2018 :  12:40:17 PM  Show Profile
quote:
Originally posted by ENBLOC

Well I did put in a bid for next week online. If I win I will come in just over $400 with the mark-up + transfer. I agree this will probably go for more than my current bid. They sold an 1894 this week with side mounted Simmons 3x9 serial #2,089,795 for $690 with the mark-up + transfer it came to $899. Now back to this 1902 .32 W.S., some sites put the serial #1561xx at 1899, others at 1902. If it is 1899 than this has been re-barreled too? Perhaps the Gentleman who was handling it when I walked in calling it ALL Original will take this up to the $900-$1000 level. I'll hang with my current bid one way or the other. Thanks Guys for all your insights on my lookin' over this "deer Rifle."



Serial number 156100 was manufactured in June of 1902. Most of the websites that list Winchester serial number dates of manufacture contain inaccurate information, including the current so-called "Winchester" website, which is actually owned and operated by the Browning Arms Company, a wholly owned subsidiary of FN Herstal.

The only Winchester serial number look-up tool on the internet with accurate information is - https://winchestercollector.org/dates/


GunBroker.com Moderator

The Largest Auction Gun Store Online including Pistols, Shotguns, and Rifles


Bert H. - http://www.bbhc.org/explore/firearms/firearms-records/

Real Men own and shoot a WINCHESTER Single-Shot!


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