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gunshow A.D.
Justjump
Member Posts: 644 ✭✭✭✭
Well I'm curious about yalls opinions about an argument I got in today.
Saturday morning my father and I were standing in line to get in a gunshow. We were about 15 feet outside the first set of doors to the convention center when just inside the first set of doors a loud gunshot. Seems some ignorant jackwagon didn't check his 12 gauge SXS and let one go at the ground. The tile floor exploded and at least one person was pretty badly schrapneled <sp> The above mentioned was immmediatly disarmed by someone else. The police were not gentle at all during the arrest. Moron was crying like a 9 YO girl when he saw the police coming. I believe said moron was charged with 3 low end felonies which I'm sure he will plee down.
Today in a local gun store another patron pipped up and said the police were to harsh and he shouldn't be charged because it was an "accident". I nearly snapped. It is only by the grace of god that no one was killed. I explained that when you pick up a firearm you are held to a higher standard and said idiot should be beaten then charged then sit his happy * in a jail to ponder his ignorance for a period of time. I was pissed that someone would defend this behavior. Argument was that it was like a car accident and it just happens. He said like when you maybe have a drink and drive. I cant believe my ears. I know that this person is carrying a small revolver in a crown royal bag in his front pocket (loaded) So I would question his intelligence in the first place I guess even the morons have constitutional rights.
Am I to harsh in my response or is an A.D. in a crowd just a big "OOpssieee"
Saturday morning my father and I were standing in line to get in a gunshow. We were about 15 feet outside the first set of doors to the convention center when just inside the first set of doors a loud gunshot. Seems some ignorant jackwagon didn't check his 12 gauge SXS and let one go at the ground. The tile floor exploded and at least one person was pretty badly schrapneled <sp> The above mentioned was immmediatly disarmed by someone else. The police were not gentle at all during the arrest. Moron was crying like a 9 YO girl when he saw the police coming. I believe said moron was charged with 3 low end felonies which I'm sure he will plee down.
Today in a local gun store another patron pipped up and said the police were to harsh and he shouldn't be charged because it was an "accident". I nearly snapped. It is only by the grace of god that no one was killed. I explained that when you pick up a firearm you are held to a higher standard and said idiot should be beaten then charged then sit his happy * in a jail to ponder his ignorance for a period of time. I was pissed that someone would defend this behavior. Argument was that it was like a car accident and it just happens. He said like when you maybe have a drink and drive. I cant believe my ears. I know that this person is carrying a small revolver in a crown royal bag in his front pocket (loaded) So I would question his intelligence in the first place I guess even the morons have constitutional rights.
Am I to harsh in my response or is an A.D. in a crowd just a big "OOpssieee"
Comments
The word is "Negligent"
They scare the Hell out of me, too.
No sir, you are quite correct, an accidental discharge is when a gun malfunctions, this was clearly a negligent discharge and should be punished accordingly.
It's a sad fact that things like that happen. He should be charged with terminal stupidity. It's even worse when a dealer has a loaded weapon on his table, and it happens.
Have seen 3 discharges at gun shows .
Have yet to see any charges filed .
Even if there were ,it would happen again .
Before leaving the house your guns should be opened and you check them. All of them. Before you ever get to that gun show you know the status of your guns from just before you left the house. You know they are empty before you case them up and head out.
At the gun show how do you show your gun is unloaded? Dry fire it at the floor? Reach into a case and drag it out with your finger on the trigger?
Or do you handle it like it's loaded, keep your fingers the hell clear of the trigger and open the action carefully, deliberately and safely?
The cops handled him properly. Hope they bruised him up and pummled his dignity down to a greasy spot. A lesson he will never forgot, and should not be allowed to forget.
Hope the shrapnel victim is going to be alright. Just imagine if that'd been a bit worse, the gun not pointed downward. Or somebody's kid got hit.
Nothing scares me more than the damned fool peckerwoods in our own midst.
He should be fined a few thousand dollars and pay restitution to the person who he harmed. If he does not pay the restitution he should be jailed for a year. NO FELONY.
It was a dumb accident. It was an accident and not intentional. Not felony type action or behavior.
My rights come from God and not the Constitution by the way.
probably did it on purpose just to bring bad light to a gunshow, damn gov.is involved somehow.
Now ,don't think that it has not been tried .
We caught one guy at a AGCA show trying to slip shells in 38 revolvers on tables .
Watched the law haul him off .
Never did here the end of it though .
I read an article about a guy that got caught out West doing the same thing .
yes, people should be able to load and unload their firearms without shooting something. thats in a perfect world. last i checked, this world wasnt perfect, so there are inevitably morons walking around with guns. forcing them to take them out and mess with them gets you tis result.
They guy is a complete moron and DOES NOT DESERVE A FELONY!
He should be fined a few thousand dollars and pay restitution to the person who he harmed. If he does not pay the restitution he should be jailed for a year. NO FELONY.
It was a dumb accident. It was an accident and not intentional. Not felony type action or behavior.
My rights come from God and not the Constitution by the way.
I'm gonna have to disagree with you on this one. I think he does deserve at least one felony charge for his actions. His neglegence could've easily caused loss of life and should be handled as such. That man should NEVER be allowed to own a firearm again. That guy gives responsible gun owners a bad name, should hook his balls up to a car battery...
After reading your post at this show you do not have to check your weapons at the door and get the tie wrap put on them?
We had not yet reached the check in table. He was about 8 feet from the table.
He wasn't manipulating weapon for inspection. He was mindlessly diddling the trigger while yapping at the guy with him.
I would not be in a show if people were not required to display an unloaded weapon. To much bumping going on.
Respectfully Kev. You cant seriously think that you should not be held responsible for acts of outright negligent behavior??
How can one persons ineptness be blamed on another?
Then we should all know what comes next.
The prosecutor's office determines charges. The defense haggles, maybe they plea it out and no trial. Or maybe there's a trial and then a jury decides. Or a plea fore goes a jury trial and it goes to the judge. Then for any guilty decision the judge decides the punishment.
It's a long road ahead for someone who was inexcusably careless, at best.
The "at worst" part is what all the charging, plea'ing, jury'ing and judging will be figuring out.
quote:Originally posted by barbwired
After reading your post at this show you do not have to check your weapons at the door and get the tie wrap put on them?
We had not yet reached the check in table. He was about 8 feet from the table.
He wasn't manipulating weapon for inspection. He was mindlessly diddling the trigger while yapping at the guy with him.
I would not be in a show if people were not required to display an unloaded weapon. To much bumping going on.
Respectfully Kev. You cant seriously think that you should not be held responsible for acts of outright negligent behavior??
How can one persons ineptness be blamed on another?
Thank you , I was just wondering if he had to check his weapon.
quote:Originally posted by storm6490
I'm gonna have to disagree with you on this one. I think he does deserve at least one felony charge for his actions. His neglegence could've easily caused loss of life and should be handled as such. That man should NEVER be allowed to own a firearm again. That guy gives responsible gun owners a bad name, should hook his balls up to a car battery...
Thank you!!!! I think that would be a good start. I think if security had not isolated him so quickly he would have been beaten soundly. Most were checking for wounds.
I'm not the court system and I was 15 feet away so I only looked after the bang!! But I think a felony should be on the table at least
It seems alien to me,for someone to NOT do it,even if the person handing the arm to them just did...
The guy that fired into the floor at the show,to me, isn't a "FELON" but, he is a very naive and untrustworthy gun owner.Maybe untrustworthy enough to never handle firearms again..
still shouldnt have happened, and likely wouldnt have if we didnt have to clear our weapons at the door.
to my eyes, you're either qualified to carry a gun or your not. if you're qualified, then having to clear it before entering a gun show is stupid. if you're not, then you shouldnt have a gun to begin with.
Keep your booger hook off the bang switch fellers, unless you plan on destroyin' sumpin'.
+1
Plus I have a habit of checking the chamber of any firearm I pick up, even if I know it is not loaded, I still check.
Keep your booger hook off the bang switch fellers, unless you plan on destroyin' sumpin'.
LOL
They guy is a complete moron and DOES NOT DESERVE A FELONY!
He should be fined a few thousand dollars and pay restitution to the person who he harmed. If he does not pay the restitution he should be jailed for a year. NO FELONY.
It was a dumb accident. It was an accident and not intentional. Not felony type action or behavior.
My rights come from God and not the Constitution by the way.
I agree with you.
He's an idiot and should pay for the damage and the injuries sustained including compensation to those harmed beyond their injuries.
When I go to gun shows I'm amazed at how often you get a gun pointed at you.
I don't appreciate it and flinch every time some yahoo starts swinging a rifle round.
If somebody were behind me I would make sure they weren't pointing a gun at me.
Apparently the guy had it pointed at the ground so he's not completely stupid.
What state was this in Justjump?
if we werent forced to manipulate our firearms unnecessarily, these types of incidents would dramatically decrease. by requiring us to remove a loaded gun and fiddle with it, they cause this to happen.
yes, people should be able to load and unload their firearms without shooting something. thats in a perfect world. last i checked, this world wasnt perfect, so there are inevitably morons walking around with guns. forcing them to take them out and mess with them gets you tis result.
Oh, Come on, why would anyone (Moron's included) take a firearm of any type to an event like a gun show loaded. Anyone that has ever been to a gun show knows the drill. Even if you have never been to a gun show in your life why would you not cycle the weapon at home to be sure it's safe. To say that "if we weren't forced to manipulate our firearms unnecessarily" is laughable, OF COURSE IT'S NECESSARY because this crap happens if you aren't forced to do so.
If you go to church on Sunday or to work on Monday, I'm sure that you remember to put on your pants before you leave the house. Well if you go to a gun show then remember to UNLOAD YOUR FIREARM. It should be just as automatic.
And hell yes it should be a felony, lives are at stake.
"Worth what you paid for it"
what im saying is that the mere idea that we HAVE TO unload our firearms at all is ludicrous. if you just leave the gun in the holster, and its in serviceable condition and of quality manufacture, it wont go off. matwor nailed it. keep your finger clear of the trigger and all is well in the world.
requiring us to unload our guns at the door is a rule that punishes the many based on the incompetence of the few. i dont have to unload my gun to walk around the mall, walmart, the market etc and id argue that at their peak times of the day/week they are just as crowded as the gun show.
then again, this entire opinion is based on the fact that im not a moron. those who are cant be helped to unholster their iron at every opportunity and wave it around. these are the jackwagons that evidently cant be trusted with guns to begin with.
all this policy does is move the location of the discharge from the middle of the show to the check in station. clearly, as evidenced in this case and many other i would imagine, this doesnt prevent innocent bystanders from being hurt. it merely serves to inconvenience the many based on the foolish actions of the few. isnt that the primary argument we make against the majority of senseless gun control legislation.
I guess that the worry would be, that many loaded guns in that confined space. The venders and property owners are just trying cover their butts and appease the Insurance companies.
so we're in agreement that, knowing you will need to have your gun unloaded, you should execute that prior to entering the show. i think we're in agreement that it should have to be done. the only other thing to hash out is this statement:
"I guess that the worry would be, that many loaded guns in that confined space."
bs. to my eyes, you're either qualified to carry a gun or your not and if you're not, then you shouldnt have one. if you are, then you should be able to be in any room, big or small, regardless of how many people are there armed or otherwise and be able to go about your life without killing people.
i understand that its an insurance requirement that the guns be unloaded. again, thats a rule that punishes the many for the actions of the few. how about we punish the few and let the many live happy, normal, and free lives?
I don't believe in accidents. Guns, automobiles, or anything else. What people call accidents are nothing more than premeditated carelessness.
i disagree. while i would agree with you if you'd said "most accident are nothing more..."; there are freak accidents that just happen. all safety protocols followed, due diligence taken, etc. most accidents are the result of someones stupidity. some are just freak occurrences.
Those of us that have had weapons training and are licensed to carry, should be able to carry anywhere. It's ridiculous that a gun show, which is clearly aimed at promoting guns and gun sales to civilians and offers classes for legal concealed carry of firearms would ban loaded weapons carried by individuals with state issued permits to do so.
I don't believe in accidents. Guns, automobiles, or anything else. What people call accidents are nothing more than premeditated carelessness.
quote:Originally posted by JamesRK
I don't believe in accidents. Guns, automobiles, or anything else. What people call accidents are nothing more than premeditated carelessness.+1
I have to fight to keep from rolling my eyes every time I hear someone trot out the old negligent vs. accidental statement as if it's profound.
By definition, accidents are a result of negligence.
THAT is the lesson which should be hammered into people instead of playing semantics games.
probably did it on purpose just to bring bad light to a gunshow, damn gov.is involved somehow.
[:D]
No such thing as an accidental discharge. Like the comment above says, it is ignorance and negligence. Just because you didn't mean to, or you thought it was unloaded, or anything - it is just negligence.
Many years ago I bought a kar 98 & when I got home I ran a loaded round through it. As soon as I closed the bolt it fired. At least I was in the back yard & had it pointed at the ground. That was clearly a malfunction & therefore an AD.
but my opinion, while not relevant in this situation, is still quite valid and im sticking to it.
Many years ago I bought a kar 98 & when I got home I ran a loaded round through it. As soon as I closed the bolt it fired. At least I was in the back yard & had it pointed at the ground. That was clearly a malfunction & therefore an AD.
I must respectfully disagree.
We are getting close to changing the subject of this thread, but accidents are close enough to the subject I guess it's not really a hijack.
The incident you describe is most definitely traceable to negligence. Not your negligence in this case, but clearly negligence, and probably fraud, on the face of it.
I've investigated a few accidents, and read hundreds if not thousands of accident reports. I haven't found one yet that could not be traced to negligence at some level, no matter how "freaky" the accident.
People who investigate accidents for a living will tell you accidents are not only always negligence, but if you dig deep enough you can almost always tag a name on it.