416rcm???

joshmb1982

i was watching a huntin show on tv tonight tracks across africa mabye. and the owner f hornady was on. (steve hornady??) he had a ruger mark 77 frontier or compact not sure which chambered for the experimental 416. anyone else hear about this? seems like it would give a hell of a kick from such a short light rifle.

dfletcher

http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=339399

Supposedly Ruger has necked up their RCM cases for the 416. I think I'll stick with the 416 Rigby, already have the CZ 550. Long & heavy gun lessens the recoil. I'd imagine that nice light Ruger has quite the kick.

Sig220_Ruger77

When Ruger designed the .375 Ruger, they were aiming at a Lighter rifle that had a standard length action and produced velocities of the .375 H&H. Problem is, Ruger's rifle tips the scale right around 8 pounds. This fairly light for a large bore rifle, but my Remington 700 .375 H&H tips the scale at 7 pounds. It is a pound lighter, has a 4" longer barrel and balances much nicer then the Ruger. It also has a much nicer recoil pad and because of this recoil is similiar if not less, even though it weighs a pound less. Also, with the larger bores like the .375's or 416's, velocity is not really of importance to me. I really don't want to push the envelope because these cartridges were designed to hunt big/dangerous game and the pressures kept lower to make sure there are no pressure issues, resulting in misfires, etc. An elephant isn't going to be able to tell you the diffence of a 300 grain solid moving at 2500 fps as compared to 2700 fps, but I can guarentee your shoulder can.[;)]

Point I am trying to make is that I think Ruger is going to strike out with these "compact big bores". I will stick with my .375 H&H.[;)]

Jon

nononsense

My suggestion would be to check the information regarding the cartridge being released on the RCM case as I think that's incorrect.

My last conversation with Ruger was that the .416 Ruger would be on the .375 Ruger case not the Compact Magnum case. Using the RCM case would be a little silly since the case capacity would only be something in the area of 68 gr. of H2O. The .375 Ruger case would yield about 99 gr. of H2O.

Besides, it's not experimental since they are in the process of bringing it to the market.

Best.

tsr1965

I have gathered the same thing that Nononsense has. I watched that show last night, and they said it was a standard length action rifle(will handle anything up to the 300 or 338 Win mag length). The RCM will work in a 308 length action. The Hippo only took one round while they wanted to make sure that big tom cat was expired with 3 rounds. Basically Ruger was aiming on getting an iron with a round with its name on it that was suitable to use in area's that do not allow sub 40 caliber rifles.

Best

nononsense

Quite a few of us have been involved in trying to solve a couple of the problems that have been discussed so vehemently on the internet and in the rags. The castigation of and the all out rebellion against the belted magnum combined with the embracing of the 'shorter magnums' as a viable alternative to the cartridges already available as the norm for big game and dangerous game hunting have led the way to the current level of development. In order to have an acceptable cartridge for use in hunting dangerous game, we have been left with the extra long H&H length cartridges in the H&H length actions which usually carry hefty price tags. This is a market limiter by price alone.

Enter the Ruger/Hornady joint venture with the design and manufacturing capabilities to produce a cartridge with the necessary power in a case designed for a standard length action with standard magnum diameters that avoid some problems in the magazines. This opens the market to a substantial number of users that have been ignored simply because of the prices commanded for 'Safari' length actions and rifles. Now you have ammunition and components suitable for use on dangerous game and big game that can be used in standard rifles at affordable prices. The conversions from standard belted magnum rifles to the .375 and .416 will be easy. It is seen as a expansion of the existing market by a sizable amount, more money in a longer time line.

In a secondary line of thought, the newer .375 Ruger is a positive correction for the .376 Steyr cartridge and rifle designs from quite a few years ago. It was an abomination from the start but an attempt to solve the same supposed problems.

The .416 Ruger is a beltless replacement for the belted .416 Taylor and the disappearing .416 Remington Magnum. It will also provide a viable alternative to the premium priced .416 Rigby rifles and ammunition.

The drawbacks that I see is the lack of quality in the Hornady produced brass. They are also controlling the market with this proprietary brass. None of the other component manufacturers will be able to produce cases for either market competition or an improvement in quality. Then there will be the problem with the proprietary powder that is part of the performance from these cartridges. We do not have access to this powder and most likely will not have a reasonable substitute.

Best.

Sig220_Ruger77

Nononsense,

Very good points in your post. I am still not sure if this will catch on though. Guess we will have to wait and see. There are a couple of companies that have brought us very affordable .375 H&H's in the past(Remington and Savage) and they just don't seem to take off. There just isn't a huge market for these larger calibers because the average hunter or enthusiast just don't need or want a big bore rifle. I think that one place these cartridges will gain popularity, is in people who currently own a .300 WinMag, .338 WinMag, etc. who re-barrel their favorite little rifle.

Jon

nononsense

Yes we did get the Remington M700 and the Savage LA in the H&H length and chambers. However, the one part that's missing is that sneaky little misstatement about Controlled Round Feed as opposed to Push Feed actions. The general public has been brainwashed to absolutely reject and ignore any rifle chambered for the H&H cartridges and some others if they weren't CRF. Hence the failure of the Remington and the Savage. I know that I originally fell victim to the same ideas many years ago.

I routinely ignore those that like to propagate this misinformation now. Even though I am a diehard Mauser fanatic, I carry a .300 H&H in an original Remington M721 as a backup rifle now. It's well made with a very accurate 26" barrel which is suited to this cartridge. I've killed a lot of game with this rifle and they are most certainly just as dead from this push feed as they would be from a CRF.

Part of my point about the acceptance of these two cartridges should include the fact that this design makes the conversion of existing rifles much easier and less costly. This is a comparison to having an M98 Mauser and spending several hundred dollars on action, magazine and feeding modifications in order to use a cartridge with an H&H length.

New cartridges, no matter how logically developed and marketed always have a potential for failure. I hope that these two cartridges and several others achieve success and establish a deep following in order to hang around for many more years to come.

Best.