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H&R Leatherneck

SpaceCowby43SpaceCowby43 Member Posts: 12 ✭✭
edited January 2019 in Ask the Experts
Anyone here knowledgeable on the H & R Model 165 "Leatherneck" 22 caliber semi-automatic rifle? Like which ones would have been training rifles and which ones would not. Mine has a VERY low serial number but is in too good a condition to have been used a training rifle. I am thinking it might have been "liberated" before being put into service.
Any info and/or insights would be appreciated.
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    SpaceCowby43SpaceCowby43 Member Posts: 12 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Picked this rifle up the other day. I had not seen one of these before. Anybody know anything about them. 22 cal, rear peep sight, flip up rear dovetail sight, mag is marked Riesling[sp] 22 cal. Thanks
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    charliemeyer007charliemeyer007 Member Posts: 6,579 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0F_tltxO7k
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    rufe-snowrufe-snow Member Posts: 18,650 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    No likely used as a trainer. It was made, after the end of W W II. A number of companies, made 22 rifles with a military appearance, after the war. Probably to appeal to returning servicemen.

    H & R did make a military trainer, during the war though. Model 58 C. It was a semi-auto. It had the same dimensions as the M 1 Grand. And marked "U. S. Property.
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    11b6r11b6r Member Posts: 16,588 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Think the actual military trainer was the MC 58. For Marine Corps.

    https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/56/1798/harrington-richardson-inc-mc58-rifle-22-lr
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    SpaceCowby43SpaceCowby43 Member Posts: 12 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Originally posted by rufe-snow
    No likely used as a trainer. It was made, after the end of W W II. A number of companies, made 22 rifles with a military appearance, after the war. Probably to appeal to returning servicemen.

    H & R did make a military trainer, during the war though. Model 58 C. It was a semi-auto. It had the same dimensions as the M 1 Grand. And marked "U. S. Property.

    From what little I have been able to find, there is quite a bit of disagreement on whether the Model 165 was ever used as a training rifle or not. Found a coupke that said that some or all of the very early manufactured model 165's were contracted to the military but used very little because, as you mention, the war was ending by the time they were being delivered. Found a message on a forum from a person that claimed to have one he got from his father. Found another that said the 165's used as training rifles never had any US Property markings like other training rifles. I did find a lot of collaboration that the Model 58's were used prior to the end of the war as training rifles.
    What I didn't find was any information from owners of low serial numbered Model 165's, which does raise the question...Why are there so many Model 165's with serial numbers above 1000 and so few with 3 digit serials? I was only able to find one rifle mentioned online with a 3 digit serial number and it was just a mention from an enthusiast of the rifle that had it in his notes.

    BTW .... None of these rifles would ever have been used as a training rifle for the Garand. The look, weight, design and feel are nothing like the M1 Garand. If these were trainers, they would have been as trainers for the Reising Model 50 and 55's.

    Thanks for the reply and the insights. I'm certainly not disagreeing with you. It is concerning that it would be in this good condition if it was a trainer, though the auction link posted in one reply showed a US Property marked Model 58 that was in equally good condition. I'll keep trying to garner whatever info I can get.
    Thanks again.
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    SpaceCowby43SpaceCowby43 Member Posts: 12 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Originally posted by 11b6r
    Think the actual military trainer was the MC 58. For Marine Corps.

    https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/56/1798/harrington-richardson-inc-mc58-rifle-22-lr

    Wow. That rifle is in extremely good condition for a training rifle. Thanks for the info.
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    SpaceCowby43SpaceCowby43 Member Posts: 12 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by charliemeyer007
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0F_tltxO7k


    I also found that video. Details a lot about the shooting and disassembly but not much on the history of the rifle.

    Thanks for the reply. I will take any info I can find.
    Rick
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    322nd322nd Member Posts: 82 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I'm no expert but here goes.
    The H&R Model 65's were sold to the USMC as .22 trainers during WW2, in 1944-1945. H&R was able to sell many of these off to the civilian market in 1944-1945-1946 after their military contract was fullfilled. After the war, they did a redesign to the model 65(less weight and different features) and called it the model 165 sold strictly to civilians in 1946-1947 or thereabouts. The MC-58, another redesign, was manufactured and sold to the USMC as a trainer in the 50's.
    I have a Model 65 and it operates similarly to the Model 165.
    Hopefully this is helpful.
    Here are some pics:
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    Kim
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