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Springfield Armory M2

Mullen CoinsMullen Coins Member Posts: 25
edited August 2013 in Ask the Experts
Here are images of a Springfield Armory M2 .22 Cal. in excellent condition. I am not an expert on gun finishes but wonder if this gun is original or if it has been re-blued at some point. What is the best manner to detect re-bluing and how does that impact the value?

m2.jpg
m22.jpg
m23.jpg
m24.jpg
m25.jpg
m26.jpg
m27.jpg
m28.jpg
m29.jpg

Comments

  • perry shooterperry shooter Member Posts: 17,390
    edited November -1
    Hello These are great rifles . Stock has been modified and refinuished We need much better quality pictures Try outside natural light Hazey days are best . Then we might be able to help EDITMuch better pictures. My opinion is either original finish on metal[^]or someone of very high skill level did a refinish. Not the same person that did IMHO an awful job on the stock. Al freeland was a man and his company that made many products to serve Target shooters for many many years. You have a very nice early Target rifle you should get a high quality wood work gun smith to try to restore the stock .
  • Hawk CarseHawk Carse Member Posts: 4,365 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Well, MY M2 was Parkerized.
    This one looks like it might have been blued over the Parkerizing which gives that nice flat black finish.

    The stock has had the black grip cap added and refinished glossy.

    The globe front sight is not Springfield, but was a common add-on.
  • Mullen CoinsMullen Coins Member Posts: 25
    edited November -1
    Here are additional images of the M2 - hope these help.

    m210.jpg
    m211.jpg
    m212.jpg
    m213.jpg
    m214.jpg
    m215.jpg
    m216.jpg
    m217.jpg
    m218.jpg
    m219.jpg
    m220.jpg
  • HerschelHerschel Member Posts: 2,035 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    The way to tell if the metal finish is original is to remove the bolt and look at the bolt well,(the round channel the bolt travels in). When these rifles left Springfield Armory as new items the bolt well was left in the white. Parkerizing or blue in this area indicates the rifle metal was refinished. When #1458 was produced in 1933 it would have had the early M2 bolt that was not adjustable for headspace. The bolt is a replacement. Bolts were numbered to the receiver. The number was placed on the bottom of the bolt with some digits on either side of the line where the front and back parts of the bolt meet. The bolt number on #1458 may have been put there by a new employee who didn't know the proper location for the number, he may have come to work drunk, or no telling what other explanation there may be. In my opinion the bolt on #1458 was etched by someone that assumed the bolt number would be on top of the bolt like was done on the early 1903 NRA Sporters and National Match 1903's. You might look for a number on the bottom of the bolt or for a flat spot that indicated a number had been buffed off. The black metal finish looks like the black parkerizing done by SA in the 1930's. It might have been done by SA or an arsenal when the bolt and barrel were replaced. I can see a seven on the barrel. That has to mean 1937. The barrel is a replacement. I concur with those above who commented on the modification to the stock. The rifle does look good and would probably be misdescribed by a seller as "original finish."
    From my experience I estimate that less than 5% of the M2 Rifles escaped refinishing of the metal. Of course the refinished metal well make the rifle worth less. The worst problem with the rifle is the stock modification.
  • Mullen CoinsMullen Coins Member Posts: 25
    edited November -1
    I sincerely appreciate the helpful comments... I am learning. Here are photos of the bolt. I found what appears to be another hand engraved serial number on the opposite side of the bolt. The bolt channel shows signs of reblueing. Also, the number on the barrel is a 1 not a 7. There are also numbers near the end of the barrel SA 5-37 with logo - image below.

    bolt1.jpg
    bolt2.jpg
    barrel.jpg
  • HerschelHerschel Member Posts: 2,035 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    The number seven I saw is part of the 5-37 barrel date. The number on the bottom of the bolt is in the correct location to have been done by by the arsenal or armory doing the bolt upgrade. The serial number on the top of the bolt is too neat to have been done by bubba. Perhaps it was done by the arsenal/armory also. I would say the metal was reparkerized by an arsenal or armory when the barrel was replaced and the later type M2 bolt was installed. No way to know for sure but it looks like the black parkerizing from the 1930's. If the rifle was mine I would look for an M2 stock for it.
  • Hawk CarseHawk Carse Member Posts: 4,365 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    But wasn't this one built as an M2?
    If an upgrade it would have been marked M II, wouldn't it?
  • perry shooterperry shooter Member Posts: 17,390
    edited November -1
    The first models had TWIN firing pins The fired case will have 2 INDENTS in the rim.
  • HerschelHerschel Member Posts: 2,035 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Hawk Carse, I have probably caused confusion by saying the change from the early type M2 bolt to the later type M2 bolt was an upgrade. M2 Rifle #1458 came with the early type M2 bolt that lacked the headspace adjustment feature. Since #1458 now has the later type M2 bolt, with the headspace adjustment feature, we can safely say that the later type M2 bolt was installed in the rifle and the rifle sn etched on it. It was made as an M2 and is still an M2 with a later type M2 bolt in it.
    When the 1922M1 Rifles were upgraded by installing the later type M2 bolt a B was stamped after the serial number and an additional I or 1 was stamped after the model number.

    Perry Shooter, The 1922 Models were the ones that came with the twin striker firing pin. There were some 2,020 of them made in 1922 through 1924. The 1922M1 went into production in 1925 and the 20,000+ of them had the single striker firing pin.

    The M2 Rifle went into production in 1933. The first 4,500 or so of them were built using an M2 bolt that lacked the headspace adjustment feature. Of these 4,500 or so, most had the bolt replaced with the later type M2 bolt with the headspace feature. This adjustment was to facilitate manufacture or rebarreling the rifle. It was not meant as a means of changing headspace by the user.

    I hope this clears up some confusion as to the history of #1458.
  • andrewsw16andrewsw16 Member Posts: 10,728 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    OT, but I have to add in, GREAT PHOTOGRAPHY!! The lighting and focus are outstanding. You should give lessons to 99% of the folks listing their guns on the auction side. [:D]
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