In order to participate in the GunBroker Member forums, you must be logged in with your GunBroker.com account. Click the sign-in button at the top right of the forums page to get connected.

38-40 colt or 38WCF??? Anyone make this ammo?

ammomakerammomaker Member Posts: 69 ✭✭
edited March 2008 in Ask the Experts
Got an old Colt model 1878 DA and would like to try shooting it. It says it is chambered in .38 WCF. I am told this is the same as 38-40 colt. Is there anybody here that can give me an education as to where to get this ammo?
· Share on FacebookShare on Twitter

Comments

  • peabopeabo Member Posts: 3,098
    edited November -1
    There were only 1600 1878DA's chambered in 38=40wcf caliber and the Blue Book indicates that these are scarce. It was also chambered in the 38 colt. These are two entirely different rounds. What is marked on the barrel, 38 colt, or 38wcf or 38-40wcf? Does the chamber seem to be for a bottle-neck cartridge? If the chamber is straight, it is for the 38 colt cartridge.
    I am not an expert on the old colts, but this is what my references tell me.

    Thanks---Peabo
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • perry shooterperry shooter Member Posts: 17,105 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Hello as the other post stated a 38-40 is a bottle neck case with a very large base & rim. You can still get ammo for this in gun shops and are loaded for cowboy type shooting . If you try a 38 special and the case looks like a 20GA. shell in a 12Ga shotgun the your pistol is a 38-40 I think the reason they were also called 38WCF was Winchester Center FIRE was the first gun chambered for this cartridge the WINCHESTER 1873. but BERT H or ammo expert might correct me on that.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • shooter93shooter93 Member Posts: 322 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    38WCF is the 38/40. It would be marked 38 Colt otherwise. The new Windhester ammo is loaded to blackpowder pressures as well as anything marked Cowboy Action.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Bert H.Bert H. Member Posts: 11,281 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by perry shooter
    Hello as the other post stated a 38-40 is a bottle neck case with a very large base & rim. You can still get ammo for this in gun shops and are loaded for cowboy type shooting . If you try a 38 special and the case looks like a 20GA. shell in a 12Ga shotgun the your pistol is a 38-40 I think the reason they were also called 38WCF was Winchester Center FIRE was the first gun chambered for this cartridge the WINCHESTER 1873. but BERT H or ammo expert might correct me on that.


    Nope, you got it right[^]. Winchester introduced the 38 W.C.F. (a.k.a. 38-40) in the 1880 catalog, and it was first chambered in the Winchester Model 1873 lever-action rifle. It was also chambered in the Model 1885 single shot rifle right from the start. The real interesting thing about the 38-40, is that it is .401 caliber and was loaded with 38 grains of black powder. The designation "38-40" was backwards in relation to other cartridges of that era. Colt adopted it for the same reason they adopted the 44 W.C.F. ... so the owner could shoot the same ammo in his pistol as his rifle.

    WACA Historian & Life Member

    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • IconoclastIconoclast Member Posts: 10,515 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    ammomaker, just to pick a nit . . . there ain't no such thing as a ".38-40 Colt" . . . there are many Colt firearms chambered in the .38-40 Winchester (a.k.a. .38 W.C.F.), but the Colt name is not associated with this cartridge design.

    Now if this is as rare a revolver as peabo's post suggests, you may want to give some serious thought to this before shooting . . . or at least have some serious physical examining by a quality gunsmith.

    Nice piece - enjoy!
    Ike
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ammomakerammomaker Member Posts: 69 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    It is 38wcf as indicated on the barrel. My mistake about the 38-40 colt reference. I do have one loaded cartridge of 38 wcf that fits the cylinder perfectly. I don't know how old the round is so I would like to obtain some fresh loads to shoot. Mechanically, the gun is 100% sound. Everything functions as if I just pulled it out of the box brand new.

    It originally belonged to my wife's grandfather who was a gunsmith. At some point he polished the gun. Although not original, it is a beautiful piece. Does anyone know of a way to obtain info from Colt on the original finish by serial number without paying the $100 for a letter of authenticity??
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • v35v35 Member Posts: 12,710 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    The 38-40 WCF was first loaded by Winchester in 1879.
    Colt first used this chambering in 1884.
    It has an advantage in loading and unloading a lot faster in revolvers than its' predecessors, the .45 Long, the .44 Henry and the .44-40.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Fourth HorsemanFourth Horseman Member Posts: 516 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    .38-40 Winchester (.38WCF) is available from Black Hills Ammunition in "Cowboy" loads with 180Gr. flat plain lead bullet. It produces around 800FPS. Go to the following link and click on Cowboy Ammunition in the left hand menu.

    http://www.black-hills.com/
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Bert H.Bert H. Member Posts: 11,281 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    The currently made Winchester 38-40 ammo is anemic stuff, and it should be perfectly safe in any mechanically sound firearm... but as Iconoclast stated, you should have an expert (gunsmith) inspect it first.

    WACA Historian & Life Member

    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • v35v35 Member Posts: 12,710 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I would use the lead bullet Cowboy loads and not copper jacketed commercial loads. While both are anemic loads, these old Colt barrels are soft and will wear fast.
    The 38-40 in full power black powder loads has about the same ballistics as the 40 S&W so there is nothing new there.
    Besides being faster loading in revolvers it was flatter shooting than the 44-40.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
Sign In or Register to comment.