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Investment casting heat treating

chris8X57chris8X57 Member Posts: 1,229 ✭✭✭✭
edited January 2019 in Ask the Experts
I have one of the Numrich M84 Parker-Hale single shot actions. Basically, it is a model 98 Mauser. While finished machined, it appears to be un-treated. I think the steel is an EN9 or 10xx series.
My question is this;
As this is an investment casting and not a forging, would a carburized surface treatment be the best way to go? My heat treating source says they can gas carburize to a depth of .015" to 34-36 Rockwell on the C scale.
I'm wondering what Ruger did on the investment cast M77 receivers??
Any thoughts or input is appreciated..
Thanks
Chris
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    rufe-snowrufe-snow Member Posts: 18,650 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    IMHO due to the legal liability, that is very important factor in the firearms industry. Anything that has been sold by a commercial company, for use as a firearm. Would be heat treated, so that it would be safe to shoot.

    I would contact Numrich/GPC about this. To inquire regarding the above. To ascertain, if any additional heat treating is necessary.
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    charliemeyer007charliemeyer007 Member Posts: 6,579 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Interesting. I wonder if it was intended to be engraved then heat treated. I'm a DIY guy but I don't think I would fool with something holding 55,500+ PSI next to my face. A knife blade or a small part, I'm all for giving it a shot.

    +1 rufe-snow for ask them. Maybe ask the folks at Turnbull.
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    babunbabun Member Posts: 11,054 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Have no direct info, read this. Especially Horseman's post.
    Just something I found, not saying how true.

    https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=378791
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    chris8X57chris8X57 Member Posts: 1,229 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Thank you all for the thought provoking answers.

    The GunBroker ad for this receiver states it 'may' need heat treating.
    And further states that they don't have enough information on them.

    I own several Ruger 77's, and have never questioned their strength or quality.

    I think I will get it Rockwell tested and go from there..
    Thanks again,
    Chris
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    JohnStimsonJohnStimson Member Posts: 448 ✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by chris8X57
    I have one of the Numrich M84 Parker-Hale single shot actions. Basically, it is a model 98 Mauser. While finished machined, it appears to be un-treated. I think the steel is an EN9 or 10xx series.
    My question is this;
    As this is an investment casting and not a forging, would a carburized surface treatment be the best way to go? My heat treating source says they can gas carburize to a depth of .015" to 34-36 Rockwell on the C scale.
    I'm wondering what Ruger did on the investment cast M77 receivers??
    Any thoughts or input is appreciated..
    Thanks
    Chris


    What is your basis for thinking it is EN9 or AISI 1055( which is a comparable steel)? Or that it is an appropriate steel for a rifle receiver? It might be suitable for a .22 rim fire rifle but I would be concerned by its use with a center fire rifle.

    AISI 1055 is not generally considered a carburizing grade steel.
    AISI 1055 may not be a good choice for through hardening depending on the section thickness and the hardness desired. It has no real alloying constituents like AISI 4140 (a chrome molly steel) which is commonly used for barrels and other thought hardened parts.
    While carburizing can produce a hard case the real question is what will the core harden to?
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    chris8X57chris8X57 Member Posts: 1,229 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by JohnStimson
    quote:Originally posted by chris8X57
    I have one of the Numrich M84 Parker-Hale single shot actions. Basically, it is a model 98 Mauser. While finished machined, it appears to be un-treated. I think the steel is an EN9 or 10xx series.
    My question is this;
    As this is an investment casting and not a forging, would a carburized surface treatment be the best way to go? My heat treating source says they can gas carburize to a depth of .015" to 34-36 Rockwell on the C scale.
    I'm wondering what Ruger did on the investment cast M77 receivers??
    Any thoughts or input is appreciated..
    Thanks
    Chris


    What is your basis for thinking it is EN9 or AISI 1055( which is a comparable steel)? Or that it is an appropriate steel for a rifle receiver? It might be suitable for a .22 rim fire rifle but I would be concerned by its use with a center fire rifle.

    AISI 1055 is not generally considered a carburizing grade steel.
    AISI 1055 may not be a good choice for through hardening depending on the section thickness and the hardness desired. It has no real alloying constituents like AISI 4140 (a chrome molly steel) which is commonly used for barrels and other thought hardened parts.
    While carburizing can produce a hard case the real question is what will the core harden to?


    I read it somewhere, but can't remember where exactly. This casting appears to be high quality, is finished machined, serialized and stamped with Parker-Hale's logo.
    I doubt that Parker-Hale would use a poor quality steel to build complete rifles, so it very well could be 4140 alloy?
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    XXCrossXXCross Member Posts: 1,379 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    ....have you had the heat treat source give it a Brinell or Rockwell test? That should give a good idea what the condition of the material really is.
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