In order to participate in the GunBroker Member forums, you must be logged in with your account. Click the sign-in button at the top right of the forums page to get connected.

Obama to Push U.N. for Palestine State!

serfserf Member Posts: 8,870 ✭✭✭✭
edited April 2015 in Politics
This is going to start the whole process of WW III and beginning of very hard times for all! It's time for all or nothing!


The French resolution outlines several conditions for peace talks, including a recognition that borders between Israel and Palestine would be "based on 4 June 1967 lines with mutually agreed limited equivalent land swaps."

It calls for an "agreed, just, fair, and realistic solution to the refugee question, including a viable mechanism to provide for repatriation, resettlement, compensation and other agreed measures for a conclusive resolution," a condition that would require Israel's approval but that would nevertheless engender opposition from Netanyahu's likely coalition partners. Jerusalem, in another provision likely to draw immediate Israeli opposition, would be "the shared capital of the two States which fulfils the aspirations of both parties and protects freedom of worship."


  • bpostbpost Member Posts: 31,944 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    A two state solution is no solution as long as one side is sworn to kill the other from birth and as a tenant of their Insanity Masquerading as a Religion, Islam.

    Jews will live in peace with neighbors, Muslims not so much.

    The realistic end is total war in the Middle East until one side is utterly defeated or dead. There is zero difference between the Muslim/Jew issue now and the USA vs Germany/Japan in WWII.

    When the shooting stops only one side will be left standing.

    Obama seems to relish living in narcissistic insanity so his side is clear.
  • spasmcreekspasmcreek Member Posts: 38,925
    edited November -1
    and oblamer would be unhappy if some one told him how to live
  • Waco WaltzWaco Waltz Member Posts: 10,821
    edited November -1
    WWIII is a desired by the bankers who are going to use our country as the shock troops.

    Good luck

  • serfserf Member Posts: 8,870 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Waco Waltz
    WWIII is a desired by the bankers who are going to use our country as the shock troops.

    Good luck

    Their is going to be a lot of dead souls in this last one and civilians will be the biggest loss world wide.

    Next blood moon is coming! April 4th

  • gruntledgruntled Member Posts: 8,402
    edited November -1
    Note that the Zionists complain that the Palestinians will not recognize Israel's right to exist as an apartheid state & then they prevent the existence of a Palestinian state. What a bunch of hypocrites.
    Note their wording. They do not demand the recognition of Israel, they demand the recognition of Israel as a Jewish state. What about not only the Moslems but the Christians in Israel?
    The UN started this mess & the UN should finish it. It's long past time for the so called negotiations to end. The UN should establish a Palestinian state & determine the borders based on established INTERNATIONAL LAW.
    This is in OUR BEST INTERESTS. Any effort we make can never help to end our problems until there is a fair settlement to this issue.
  • burpfireburpfire Member Posts: 1,158 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by us55840

    Most other countries no longer trust the US Administration.

    I'm no bible thumper, but heard once there would a be a thousand year war foretold. IMO, that was had started with the muslims and to date, they are winning because neither the USA nor most of the free world understands the clear, concise words of the muslims that "We are at War ..."


    your close. there will not be a thousand yr war, but 1000 years of peace on earth when Christ sets up his kingdom on earth very soon. make no mistake, ISRAEL going to be the main player in the last war, and war of wars the bible speaks of in revelation. they will be attacked by iran, with Russia, and a few other arab nations. the arabs will be defeated, and Russia pushed back to northern Siberia. then, china marches against ISRAEL with over 200 million men. they too are defeated by ISRAEL. lastly, the WHOLE world goes against ISRAEL, and that's when CHRIST returns to stop those who are destroying themselves and the earth, and he rules and reigns for 1000 yrs.
  • Waco WaltzWaco Waltz Member Posts: 10,821
    edited November -1
    The following is information I have had in my files for some years. They may or may not apply to this situation but the entire history is important to what is going on today.

    Barak's Generous Offers...? ? ? ?
    ? ?

    "A Villa in the Jungle"
    An in-depth analysis of the reasons for the Catastrophe at Camp David 2
    and the major roll former prime minister Ehud Barak had played
    in shattering the peace process.
    ? ?
    Data in this document are based on the maps Barak showed Arafat in December 2000
    and generally termed "Barak's Generous Offers".
    The Israeli public, media and academics use this description unwittingly.
    The "generous offer" is used as a fig leaf that conceals the intentions of those
    who wish to justify this war against the Palestinians.

    The West Bank and the Gaza Strip, captured in 1967,
    comprise 22% of pre-1948 Palestine.
    When the Palestinians signed the Oslo Agreement in 1993
    they agreed to accept only these 22% and recognise
    Israel within the Green Line borders.
    Conceding 78% of the land was a historical Palestinian compromise.

    But this compromise was not enough for Barak.
    In his offer to the Palestinians, Barak wanted more:
    ? ? ? ?
    69 settlements are included in this area,
    where 85% of the settlers live.
    It is clearly visible that The blocs create impossible borders,
    which severely disrupt Palestinian life in the West Bank.

    But this too was not enough for Barak.
    more demands were on their way-
    An invention called: "temporary Israeli Control"
    ? ? ? ?
    The "Temporary Control" concept is unique.
    It refers to sovereign Palestinian land that will remain
    under Israeli military and civil control for an indefinite time.
    This area too contains settlements, some of them are the most
    extreme zealots. It is very unlikely that Israel will evacuate them
    in, say, 50 years time.

    This left the Palestinians with what some people call:
    "Barak's Generous Offers"...
    ? ? ? ?
    This is Barak's Generous offer:

    What appears to be territorial continuity is
    actually split up by settlement blocs,
    bypass roads and roI want fees to go ups.
    The Palestinians have to relinquish land reserves essential
    for their development and absorption of refugees.
    They also have to accept Israeli supervision of borders
    crossings together with many other restrictions.
    ? ? ? ?

    This is no generous offer. It is a humiliating demand for surrender!
    Barak's offer gives Israel control over all the border crossings of the Palestinian State.
    No country in the world would accept that.
    The words "territorial continuity" are deceptive -
    No Israeli would agree to travel 50 miles from one town to another,
    if the real distance between them is only 5 miles.This impossible offer, Barak's imperious attitude,
    the ongoing massive construction in the settlements,
    Years of Israel's Delaying tactics and Sharon's provocation -
    all these contributed to the inevitable explosion.
    In December, no maps of the Gaza Strip were shown,
    so we cannot illustrate Barak's intentions there.
    At Taba, January 2001, Barak presented a much-improved map.
    The Palestinians consider it a basis for negotiation.
    Foundation for Middle East Peace (the main source of our maps)A Downloadable version of this document (In zip format)An excellent article by Dr.Ron Pundak (One of "Oslo's" architects)To the Gush Shalom Home Page
  • Waco WaltzWaco Waltz Member Posts: 10,821
    edited November -1
    Israeli Women WatchCheckpoint BehaviorOf IDF SoldiersChecking On The CheckpointsThe Guardian - UK2-2-4
    They're all women, all Israeli and every day they go to West Bank checkpoints to try to stop soldiers harassing Palestinians. Linda Grant went with them. When I came to Tel Aviv last July to find an apartment to rent for a few months, an estate agent introduced me to Yael Boss whom I have come to think of as the DNA of Zionism - one of the tough, fearless women Israel produced in multitudes in the 1950s and who terrified me on my first teenage visit to the country in 1967. Now 65, she married a French non-Jew and lived with him in Paris for 11 years but was so homesick for Israel that she would walk into El Al offices just to hear Hebrew spoken.When one of her sons was doing his military service in Lebanon, and disappeared, she delivered an order to her other son: "Go to Lebanon and find your brother, bring him home on your back if you have to."He did - I don't think he would have dared fail. In our many conversations about the country, she spoke sharply of those who try to harm Israel in Europe."I will not criticise Israel abroad," she said. "I have enough work of this kind to do at home, without letting people abroad read what they want into what I say." There is little Yael can do to alter the policies of her government beyond the ballot box.

    In the autumn she had gone to help Palestinian farmers pick their olive harvest where army roI want fees to go ups separate them from their land. So I asked her if she would come with me to meet the women of Machsom Watch. Machsom is the Hebrew word for checkpoint; organisation was set up in January 2001 in response to repeated reports about human rights abuses of Palestinians at the checkpoints which inhibit the movement of Palestinians not only into Israel but between Palestinian towns.The founders were three Israeli women who set out three goals: to monitor the behaviour of soldiers and police, to ensure that the human rights of the Palestinians were protected, and to record their observations and make them known to the widest possible audiences.Unlike international solidarity volunteers, the members are all women, and all Israeli, from a wide range of backgrounds and political opinions. Yael and I met at the Jerusalem house of Hannah Barag, 68, and together with 74-year-old Ora Ardon, we set off in Hannah's car to Abu Dis where the "separation fence" manifests itself as a massive wall, already covered with political graffiti, slicing through the town. During my time in Israel, my over-riding impression of the current government is of incompetence and corruption which manifests itself in almost every aspect of civil and military life. Hannah and Ora showed us a place where the wall was easily crossed if you were reasonably agile, though difficult if you were old, blind, disabled or carrying a baby.What, Ora asked, was the point of a wall that held up the least likely suspects for suicide bombing and created no difficulty for the fit and determined? We drove on to Qalandia, where the checkpoint divides the town in half. It was a bright, very cold day.A long queue of Palestinians waited with their documents to be checked by a few teenage soldiers. They were of every type: well-dressed businessmen, fashionable young women, hard young men, teenagers, a lot of women carrying babies in their arms.The roads are so rutted round the checkpoints that it is hard to wheel a child in a pushchair. "It's very quiet today," Hannah said, though there was a cacophony of noise.She pointed at a fence a few metres away. "Palestinian children throw stones at the soldiers and the soldiers fire back, a number of children have been killed here. It seems quiet now but when it gets dark it is more violent." "But this is now a different place from what I remember," Pierre, the photographer said. "Since the women volunteers have been coming it's much quieter." Two volunteers, Phyllis and Tamar, were already at the checkpoint. I watched Tamar approach a woman carrying a baby and heavy shopping and escort her to the front of the queue.A female soldier checked her documents and waved her through. They tried to help another young woman who had borrowed her 16-year-old cousin's identity card and had been caught. Despite the intervention on her behalf she was put into a police van and driven off. The attitude of both the soldiers and the Palestinians to the women varies. "The first time I went to Qalandia a soldier at the checkpoint called me a Palestinian whore," Hannah said. "I said, 'Listen, with my looks and my age do you think I still have a future in this profession?'Then I said, 'Do you talk to your grandmother like that?' The next time I saw him he apologised."

    But other soldiers are susceptible to the fact that the women have themselves served in the Israeli army and have sons and daughters or grandchildren who are currently serving."One soldier shouted at me, 'Is your son in the army?'" said Tamar. "I said to him, 'Yes he's a pilot.' He said, 'A pilot! What does he think of you?'I told him, 'He's very proud.' Sometimes the soldiers say to me, 'Why are you doing this?' I say, 'Because I am Jewish and my grandparents were in the Holocaust.'" On the Palestinian side, the women of Machsom Watch are often the only Israelis they ever see who are not in uniform, the only Israelis who exhibit human kindness, and sometimes that is enough even though the women often fail to succeed in persuading the soldiers to open a gate in the fence to let children through to school.Other Palestinians vent their anger against them because they are the only unarmed Israelis available."I tell them, you are at the wrong address," Hannah said. "But some tell us that we are no different, we are part of the same game."When Ora told a group of Palestinians she was a peace activist, one cried out that he wanted war and not peace. The contradictions of their position are plenty. Ten days earlier, a woman suicide bomber at the Eerez crossing at Gaza had managed to persuade a soldier that she was disabled and could not pass through the metal detector because of a metal plate in her leg. She killed four people and the Israeli radio phone-in shows were full of furious callers complaining that the Palestinians were abusing the pressure on commanders to treat women and children more humanely."That woman did a big disservice to her people and her own gender," Ora said. "It's the same as when they transported military equipment in ambulances." I had asked her what she felt about the possibility that she would abet a suicide bomber passing through a checkpoint. "I can't say I've never thought of it," she replied, "but if you sit on a jury you have the same dilemma." She pointed to a small hill beyond the checkpoint. "We call it Tora Bora, it is easy to pass across that way." There is a growing climate of opinion in Israel, including from a former Likud mayor of Tel Aviv, that the checkpoints only exist to harass the Palestinian population and are ineffective at stopping suicide bombers.

    Ora is not opposed to fences on principle. She wants the Israeli government to end the occupation, withdraw to the Green Line and build a border. "There will still be terror," she said, "but we will be justified if we hit back." We drove back to Ora's house in Jerusalem and I asked her why, at 74, she chooses to stand in freezing conditions at the checkpoints."My grandparents came here from Odessa in 1905," she said. "They were idealists, they wanted to create a new Jew who would do moral work. At 13 years old I was a radio operator in the Haganah [the Jewish militias opposing British Mandate rule in Palestine]. I was smuggling radio parts and no one stopped me because I was so small and so young. During the war of independence in 1948 I was a corporal. It was a just war. From the very beginning I was with Peace Now, I was on all the demonstrations, but Ariel Sharon pays no attention to us so one day I went over to a woman whose face I recognised and said, 'I'm desperate, I want to do something other than demonstrate,' and she took me to Machsom Watch. "I am an ordinary member of the organisation, not a spokesperson, but I think I am typical.The settlers call themselves Zionists but they are not Zionists as far as the founders of the state were concerned. I am a Zionist, and this is why the checkpoints are a terrible blow to us Israelis as well as the Palestinians. My daughters are very unhappy, they think I am quite right to go to the checkpoints but they want someone else's mother to go. But I say that only by doing this can we reclaim the humanistic revolution of Zionism.We are calling on the world to help us reclaim our humanistic values." On the drive home to Tel Aviv I asked Yael what she thought about what she had seen. "I already have a shift organised," she said with steel in her eyes. "I will bring all my friends."I thought of Yael multiplied, and wondered if the hard men of Israel could withstand the pressure if thousands of Israeli women created very different facts on the ground. Guardian Unlimited c Guardian Newspapers Limited 2004,3604,1136689,00.html
Sign In or Register to comment.