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The instant they raise their jack-boots to kick in the door of a decent citizen..to confiscate firearms....is the exact instant they cease to enjoy the protections of being called "Americans".
They join the ranks of followers of dictators the entire world over...from one end of history till the Second Coming.
I read your topic, and I was pleased to read that fellow gun owners are concerned about this issue. I am but a simple man, who obeys the laws, and am courtious to my fellow man. I am a peaceful man. I am a strong believer in the second admendment, I trust that the men of long ago knew that the self protection of the people was important. I also believe that this country was founded by men who were tired of a force who over powered the people, and decided to fight for freedom and create a new land that was founded by the people for the people.
It's sad these days that the government that was created to serve it's people to it's best abilitys has become so corrupt in politics that the simple founding elements are being slowly erased and re written in the best interests of the government rather than the people.
So to answer your question, "would I fight ?" your damn rite I would ! ! ! I carry a hand gun every day, not that I need one, I carry one because it's my rite and responsibility as a citizen of this country.
They only the victory win
Who have fought the good fight and have vanquished the demon that tempts us within;
Who have held to their faith unseduced by the prize that the world holds on high;
Who have dared for a high cause to suffer, resist, fight-if need be, to die.
Better to be quiet and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt
Thanks Comengetit. The posts here are informative and even though we disagree, we all share the desire to be free and left alone. My attitude is, it seems, more optimistic than many who write here though our differences in what we want are probably quite small.
I see our government as run by elites who spend more time fighting each other than planning police states. I also see the government as largely incompetent and inefficient in their use of the power they do have.
Conspiracies do exist. They are, however, usually within small tight knit groups and fail as the plot and group get larger. Osama bin Laden's conspirators numbered 21?
There were many more than 21, that number represents those who carried it out.
Anyway, I think it's great that you can be optimistic just don't be blinded by your optimism and get caught with your pants down. I agree that as a whole, the government is stupid and inadequate and largely inept but, that does not preclude them from carrying out such a miniscule plan in the grand scheme of things. Sure it's monumental in it's long term effects, but the plan, as it were, itself is not that difficult to carry out and yet they stumble daily. This blatant ineptitude is why I fear for our guns. What happens when someone becomes extremely frustrated when trying to achieve a goal? They become desperate and, as we know, desperate people do desperate things.
Seems to me that the BATFE may have been given the responsibility of getting our guns. That would explain the intimidation of law abiding citizens, wouldn't it? What other motivation, besides being p u s s i e s in High School and getting their * kicked all of the time and seeking some kind of demented payback, can these * possibly have? It's certianly not pride in their work, Ruby Ridge & Waco, they're just plain and simple, out to get us. How many agents are in every city? If that's too broad a question, how many would be in an average size city like Denver? A simultaneous knock-off would probably do it. JUST KIDDING, BATFE!
This day is called the feast of Crispian:
He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
Will stand a tip-toe when the day is named,
And rouse him at the name of Crispian.
He that shall live this day, and see old age,
Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
And say 'To-morrow is Saint Crispian:'
Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars.
And say 'These wounds I had on Crispin's day.'
Old men forget: yet all shall be forgot,
But he'll remember with advantages
What feats he did that day: then shall our names.
Familiar in his mouth as household words
Harry the king, Bedford and Exeter,
Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester,
Be in their flowing cups freshly remember'd.
This story shall the good man teach his son;
And Crispin Crispian shall ne'er go by,
From this day to the ending of the world,
But we in it shall be remember'd;
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition:
And gentlemen in England now a-bed
Shall think themselves accursed they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.
I posted this in another thread but thought it should be placed here.
At my age I have to say yes, I'll fight, too darn old to play solider but young enough to be sneaky. We all have to die sometime, best to die for what you believe in than in bed. If it comes to that decision the "they's" will divide and defeat us in the long run.
Do you believe in a higher power ?
Do you believe that a higher power aided the Founders in setting up the greatest experiment in human freedoms ever seen on the face of the earth ?
Do you believe that that the leaders of America have for 140 years been operating in the best interests of decent Americans ?
Where am I going with this ? If you believe freedom is right and good..then you are fighting on the side of a higher power.
If INSTEAD you believe that higher power is government...then you are beaten before you fire the first shot. Because they WILL KILL YOU... you are fighting on the wrong side, and you will hesitate in the clutch.
Get this straight in your head. That which promotes freedom is GOOD..that which takes away from freedom is BAD. Government, by its very nature, is evil...that is precisly why the founders insisted upon the citizens being armed and prepared to resist tyranny.
Highball- If you were referring to me: I've never hesitated in my life, I'm not about to start now! If'n you were speakin' to the other feller, carry on.
Comengetit;
please don't be so quick to take offense. Wasn't addressing you at all. Have seen nothing to indicate any sign of brain-dead in you...
Hvae read your posts re a higher being. One of the beauties of 'freedom'..is you believe this and I believe that. All well and good. Will defend such till the death.
Where I draw the line...as you seem to...is the steady erosion by government of EVERY RIGHT GUARANTEED US by the Constitution. Let us keep our eyes firmly upon the real enemy here....
You say: "Where am I going with this ? If you believe freedom is right and good..then you are fighting on the side of a higher power.
If INSTEAD you believe that higher power is government...then you are beaten before you fire the first shot. Because they WILL KILL YOU... you are fighting on the wrong side, and you will hesitate in the clutch"
Is all government evil? Is anarchy and no authority better? No sanitation department, police, fire or sewer authority? No interstate highways, border protection or air traffic control? What would you have?
I will fight tyranny, but to say all government is tyranny is wrong headed and destructive. Let me say again, I will fight tyranny and am vigilant and will not turn in a single gun, but, I believe we are a long way from that. We obviously disagree.
If a person believes the government is the "higher power" then he is guilty of idolatry, is a fool and is probably a democrat.
Here's what God says about government:
Romans 13:1-3 1Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and he will commend you.
God instituted government and gave us all free will.
We are all going to die one day, in bed or at the point of a gun. (or for me, in a car on a sales call) The question for you is, what then?
What is missing in all the preaching about 'obeying government'...is obeying JUST governments...those that govern least and with an eye towards justice.
The ultimate aim of the Founders was to elect "Citizen Legislators"..people coming from across the street, going to Washington for 2 to 6 years, then going back home to actually LIVE under the laws they passed.
Naturally, some measure of 'government' is absolutely necessary to the continuing function of civil society. History ABSOLUTELY teaches us that said government will turn evil..turning upon the very citizens that feed it. The Founders left us with the means to thwart this ageless cycle. Unfortunately...attitudes such as yours infect most of the populace..the inability to see the greed of the power-mad elites running this country.
Shield: Welcome and I think you will be happy to find that on the Gun Rights board you are preaching to the choir. We are all on the same page, our biggest challenge is not identifying the problem, but rather how to rectify it. May I suggest you read some of our Cut & Paste (C&P) posts of the last few days, you may find them quite compelling. Nice to have another gun rights and constitution fan.
Joey Has Been Freed!
[/IMG]
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
quote:Originally posted by quikdraw67
I didn't post on this before so the answer is yes.
We do not have childern, our parents are elderly (2 out of 4 sick, one of them in a home). Mrs quikdraw is as adamant about gun rights (and liberty in general) as I am, she is an Army vet, and knows her way around an AR15 very well.
So yes, we would have nothing to lose but our lives, and neither one of us would want to live in a US with our freedom.
"Mongo only pawn in game of life"
LOL, people in glass houses...[:D][:D][:D]
Joey Has Been Freed!
[/IMG]
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
How do we solve the problem? Just keep acquiring firearms and ammo.
If nothing happens, great collection. If something happens, great arsenal of liberty!
I do have two little boys, 6 & 8. They do need to know that there are things worth standing up for, a lady entering the room, our God and faith, our country and our constitutional rights.
Now put those into order of importance. We are constantly trying to come up with ideas, right now we may be focusing on a movie to get the TRUTH out there. Read the "pissed" thread, it tells alot about our mindset here at GB.
Neo-Jedi Council
Member
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
quote:Originally posted by Hokkmike
What guns? I don't have any guns officer!
Would I kill over this? naw.....
I will die (at least I think I would, but I am a coward) for family. God, country and preservation.
Sako Fan
What do you think we're all willing to die for? Three of the four reasons you mentioned are at the forefront of our concerns. Do you know what tyranny is? Have you any idea how that will affect your Family, Country, and Preservation? When they come to your door asking for your guns they already know you have them. Do you know why they want your guns? If you think this is about your gun in and of itself you better start catching up on your history. Every time, that's EVERY, time there have been Gun Confiscations there has been tyranny and mass murder (genocide) that followed. Australia is relatively new, so we'll see. England is just going through another gun grab, they will and are suffering for it. Their crime rate is up 47%. Read a few of the threads here in GR and you will be rapidly educated.
Neo-Jedi Council
Naboo Sniper
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
Defender
It is of like mind that so many of us show up in the same place. This my friends is the only thing that will ever work.
The people they will send are us. The BATFE is them.
Stay tuned for the new UPIN (Unique Personal Identification Number)for your 4473, The new white one . It starts on Oct 17,2005.
The one who shoots first wins.[8D]
"The best way to deal with the problem is to go directly after the politicians and bureaucrats where they live and fight them at their own houses. The same goes for the Judges that ignore our Constitutional rights. This kind of battle can only be won if the people responsible are made to suffer. Sooner or later they can learn that imposing their extreme control on others will bring an extreme response.
Keep tabs on where the politicians live. Send correspondence to their homes, instead of their offices. They may rethink their positions. All politicians must prove they live in the districts they claim to represent. Visit your local election departments for this information." (Defender)
Would I Fight, d**n Right. I don't know about how things are were yall are from, but her in south central KY, our local sherrif's deputy would not be coming door to door to take our guns, that would probally be left up to the state police. The local deputy's would probally call us and let us know when they were coming[8]
quote:Originally posted by KYfatboy
Would I Fight, d**n Right. I don't know about how things are were yall are from, but her in south central KY, our local sherrif's deputy would not be coming door to door to take our guns, that would probally be left up to the state police. The local deputy's would probally call us and let us know when they were coming[8]
parabellem
I'd like to think it would be the same here in SouthEast Phoenix area but, I don't think so. I could be wrong, the local police could become normal citizens again if that ever happened, but I tend to think they would TRY and do their job. If you are as passionate about these issues as some that are here, it would be beneficial to read some of the threads start to current. There is some good stuff in them. And welcome again, Bubba Fats.
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
would I fight, d*mn right. Here in south central KY our local deputy's would not be the one's coming and taking or guns. They would probally call us and let us know they are a comming
Its all a matter of where to draw the line. And once our firearms are taken, we cannot draw a line on what the government can and cannot do. Once we rollover and take our 2nd amendment loss, what else will they take away.... whatever they want.... how can we stop them once the guns are gone, and an even better question- how do we defend ourself against those who have unregistered (black market) firearms? Simple answer: oh yeah, i'll fight.
Gentlemen, It looks like we have three more^^^guys to add. Bubba Fats (KYfatboy), yearofspider, and GUNKEEPER. Welcome to all three, may I suggest a little bit of reading within the gun rights forum. There are several must reads in here, have a look.
I would fight, as would all my brotheren in the Militia I belong to. Saddy I live in Pennsylvaina in a pretty libral anti-gun town. But if the police were going around confiscating all fireams I would fight with everything I had. Our militia is small (only a dozen) and we only have 6 guns between all of us (we are age 15-17). We are all patriots who have sworn to defend the Constitution. When the "kings man" comes to my door I will be waiting with my best weapon, a sword. The only thing is we would have to fight off an enemy with much more men and firepower than us. If such a thing happend my "unit" would have to flee down south, where the real Americans are.
quote:Originally posted by CommissarRob
I would fight, as would all my brotheren in the Militia I belong to. Saddy I live in Pennsylvaina in a pretty libral anti-gun town. But if the police were going around confiscating all fireams I would fight with everything I had. Our militia is small (only a dozen) and we only have 6 guns between all of us (we are age 15-17). We are all patriots who have sworn to defend the Constitution. When the "kings man" comes to my door I will be waiting with my best weapon, a sword. The only thing is we would have to fight off an enemy with much more men and firepower than us. If such a thing happend my "unit" would have to flee down south, where the real Americans are.
CR- I'd like to ask you, if I may, what kind of curriculum the schools are teaching now? You seem to be pretty well educated thus far in the ways of the Constitution and Bill of rights. Would you say that is an accurate assessment? Are they spending time on these subjects and are they also teaching with a tendency to criticize the government and assess where we are headed? Just curious thought maybe you could help me out. Thanks and welcome. By the way, you guys need to get more guns. What do you have now?
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
Comissarrob, it is really good to see such A spirit in A man, however fight smarter, not harder. Never bring A knife,(or A sword), to A gun fight. Keep up the spirit[}:)]
In PA they spend almost all of 7th grade history on the Constitution, Bill of Rights, and government, but I also am into politics and such more than most. They didn't really teach to criticize the goverment or assess it, I think they might do that in my class next semester. Although my teacher was a flamming liberal (with a vendeta against me) and constantly made thinly vailed comments on guns, religion, Bush, republican, ect.
Right now I have all blades, but I just ordered a K98. Includding my new (well old, bu you know) rifle we have; 2 K98's, 1 .22 cal magnum rifle, 1 Russian SKS, 1 12 gauge pump shotgun, and the mainstay of our force, a semi-auto[;)] BAR.
Hey comissarrob, liberal teachers are a terrible thing. Dont take what i am fixin too say word for word, but you might try while engaged in debate with this bleedin heart to remind her that as a teacher she is supposed to teach fact's, not opinion. While it is ok for her to play devil's advocate during debate,( this helps one to look at both sides of the story, and helps you learn to think, and be prepared for any argument) her own theolgy is just that theology. Good luck, and keep of the good fight[}:)]
Right now first and foremost on the JBT's mind is, keep us from organizing. This is the only thing they truly have to fear. I don't mean organize like everyone meet here and we'll all go fight them. They would love that, the whole thing would be over in an hour. No, they are afraid of our ideals, if we get those organized and everyone on the same page, we would be their worst nightmare. They gave us back the "Assault Weapons" because they knew it would lull us into a false sense of security.
Think about it, they had passed the UnPatriot Act and the initial shock of 9/11 has worn off, they definitely need to do something to shield their intentions from our view. Voila, they give us back our "Assault Rifles", now people aren't going to be putting 2 and 2 together, it's tough to argue that they are trying to imprison us all when they could have kept the AW's out of our hands with very little effort or consequence. These are some of the most brilliant minds this country has to offer and just because the presidency changes doesn't mean anything else will. The key players are still there even after the president is gone. This is not a presidential decree, no, this is from the minds of the CIA, FBI, BATFE, Treasury Dept., the Federal Reserve, and the heiarchy of the U.S. Military. What president is going to attempt to stand up to those branches of the federal tree? JFK was trying and he was succeeding, so they killed him. His brother was getting rather close to the presidency and rather than go through the near disolution of decades of work, they killed him too. Marilyn Monroe was close to the Kennedys' and they killed her too. The only reason Joe DiMaggio was allowed to live was because they weren't sure what he knew and he was too big to knock off at the time when the others had gone. The president is big no doubt, Jolten' Joe was bigger.
Look how all of those things that were a part of our lives have vanished, the things that held us all together. I'm talking about Baseball, Apple Pie, Drive-In Movies, Malt Shops, Dime Stores, Western Auto, Sears & Roebuck(as it once was), Kats, Smacks, Shakey's Pizza, Player Pianos, weekend barbeques, family outings, evening drives, dinner at 5:30 and everyone was there, the scariest thing about being a kid was being grounded, kick the can, Sorry!, Chutes & Ladders, Monopoly, the Honeymooners, Ozzie & Harriet, Mr. Ed, the Munsters, Taxi, Cheers, the Rifleman, Butch Cassidy & the Sundance Kid, the Duke, the New York Yankees, Roger Maris, Reggie Jackson, Joe Namath, Kenny Stabler, Baseball games on the radio, this Week in Baseball, Mel Allen, Bobby Fischer, the Brady Bunch, M.A.D. Magazine, Comic books, the ads in the back of the comic books, sea horse, the Pet Rock, Elvis Presley, the Monkees, H.R. Puffenstuff, the Wizard of Oz, The Wonderful World of Disney (Sunday's at 6:00PM), the Apple Dumpling Gang, Don Knotts, Red Skelton, Jimmy Durante, the Streets of San Francisco, Marcus Welby M.D., Superstars, the Wide, Wide, World of Sports, "the agony of defeat" (you can see the ski jumper going over the chute), Lost in Space, Shootin' hoops in the driveway, walking to school and not having to worry about being abducted, Bottle Caps candy, Wacky Packages, Topps Baseball Cards, Mickey Mouse Club, Hawaii-Five-O, The Joy of Sex, Jonathan Livingston Seagull, "Love means never having to say your sorry", L.I.F.E., Rock 'em Sock 'em Robots, Friday Night at the Fights, Dean Martin & Jerry Lewis, The Odd Couple, Miracle on 34th Street, Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer, Frosty the Snowman, Christmas Caroling, Tiny Tim, Monday Night Football with Howard Cossell, Bobby Riggs, Jimmy Conners, The Six Million Dollar Man, Championship Wrestling, Bas-Ket, Bubble Gum Cigarettes, Candy Cigarettes, Malt-O-Meal, Tang, Early Times Whiskey, Klondike Kat, Tab, "Ho, Ho, Ho, Green Giant", TeePee'ing Houses, the Pop Shoppe, Dark Shadows, Love American Style and on and on.
Yes, there was a time when life was so much easier and care-free. "Progress", what a crock that is, progress has taken a very proud, wealthy, religious, and patriotic people and turned them into brain-washed sheeple. It's not hard to see how they've done it, they were keeping us busy with all sorts of new gadgets while eroding away our rights, thi Patriot Act is really a ballsy move on behalf of the government, they took a gamble and it paid off for them. I would like to have everyone who voted "aye" on the UnPatriot Act be brought up on treason charges and crimes against our constitution (if it ain't a law, make it one) because they voted on taking away our rights without seeing the laws they were approving. Those were our representatives, Congress, that were manhandled by Donald Rumsfeld to just sign it, time was not on our side.
Those planes that hit the World Trade Center Towers were not flown into those buildings by terrorists, our own government flew those planes with auto-pilot and remote control.(1) They had to have something like 9/11 happen or they would never get their precious Patriot Act through Congress. The Patriot Act allows for:
* Conduct domestic wiretapping without court order for 15 days following a congressional authorization of use of force or an attack on the United States.
* Secretly detain citizens.
* Deport any alien, including green-card holders, who are convicted of drug possession or an aggravated felony.
* Access a citizen's credit reports without a subpoena.
* Abolish federal court "consent decrees" that limit police surveillance of non-criminal organizations and public events.
* Criminalize the use of encryption software in the commission or planning of a felony.
* Apply strict gag rules to those subpoenaed by a grand jury.
* Collect DNA from suspected terrorists and indeed from any individual whose DNA might assist terror investigations.
* Extend authorization periods for secret wiretaps and Internet surveillance.
* Ease restrictions on the use of secret evidence.
In other words, stick a fork in us, we're done. These guys have it so just being a member of this site allows them to declare you a terrorist, with that comes the designation of being a foreign threat. Now they can treat you how ever they feel like and you've got no recourse. I can't believe how naive people are. Truly pathetic that our congressmen were so alert that they signed a bill into law that they had never seen. I think Donald Rumsfeld could be charged with Treason and Obstruction, I'd love to see it. We need to quit embracing the "rights for safety" BS and call a spade a spade. This law is rotten to the core and the only ways to stop it are immediate judicial hearings on all involved, or brute physical force.
This is all going to play out over the course of the next 18 months, by the time May of 2007 rolls around there will be many dead Americans at the hands of JBT's. They will be killed for terrorist activities, for doing such things as going out shooting on the weekend with a friend, or chatting on a gun web forum. Watch, it's going to go down exactly how we would expect it too. There's no new revelation or 9/11, they don't need one. Now if the people wise up, there will be another Hiroshima on American soil, it won't be averted, due to it's absolute necessity in the face of tyrannical madmen gone power crazy. It is all so surreal but you better believe it because it's coming for you.
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
Comments
The instant they raise their jack-boots to kick in the door of a decent citizen..to confiscate firearms....is the exact instant they cease to enjoy the protections of being called "Americans".
They join the ranks of followers of dictators the entire world over...from one end of history till the Second Coming.
It's sad these days that the government that was created to serve it's people to it's best abilitys has become so corrupt in politics that the simple founding elements are being slowly erased and re written in the best interests of the government rather than the people.
So to answer your question, "would I fight ?" your damn rite I would ! ! ! I carry a hand gun every day, not that I need one, I carry one because it's my rite and responsibility as a citizen of this country.
Welcome to the forum.
The gene pool needs chlorine.
Who have fought the good fight and have vanquished the demon that tempts us within;
Who have held to their faith unseduced by the prize that the world holds on high;
Who have dared for a high cause to suffer, resist, fight-if need be, to die.
Better to be quiet and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt
I see our government as run by elites who spend more time fighting each other than planning police states. I also see the government as largely incompetent and inefficient in their use of the power they do have.
Conspiracies do exist. They are, however, usually within small tight knit groups and fail as the plot and group get larger. Osama bin Laden's conspirators numbered 21?
Anyway, I think it's great that you can be optimistic just don't be blinded by your optimism and get caught with your pants down. I agree that as a whole, the government is stupid and inadequate and largely inept but, that does not preclude them from carrying out such a miniscule plan in the grand scheme of things. Sure it's monumental in it's long term effects, but the plan, as it were, itself is not that difficult to carry out and yet they stumble daily. This blatant ineptitude is why I fear for our guns. What happens when someone becomes extremely frustrated when trying to achieve a goal? They become desperate and, as we know, desperate people do desperate things.
Seems to me that the BATFE may have been given the responsibility of getting our guns. That would explain the intimidation of law abiding citizens, wouldn't it? What other motivation, besides being p u s s i e s in High School and getting their * kicked all of the time and seeking some kind of demented payback, can these * possibly have? It's certianly not pride in their work, Ruby Ridge & Waco, they're just plain and simple, out to get us. How many agents are in every city? If that's too broad a question, how many would be in an average size city like Denver? A simultaneous knock-off would probably do it. JUST KIDDING, BATFE!
This day is called the feast of Crispian:
He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
Will stand a tip-toe when the day is named,
And rouse him at the name of Crispian.
He that shall live this day, and see old age,
Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
And say 'To-morrow is Saint Crispian:'
Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars.
And say 'These wounds I had on Crispin's day.'
Old men forget: yet all shall be forgot,
But he'll remember with advantages
What feats he did that day: then shall our names.
Familiar in his mouth as household words
Harry the king, Bedford and Exeter,
Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester,
Be in their flowing cups freshly remember'd.
This story shall the good man teach his son;
And Crispin Crispian shall ne'er go by,
From this day to the ending of the world,
But we in it shall be remember'd;
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition:
And gentlemen in England now a-bed
Shall think themselves accursed they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.
I posted this in another thread but thought it should be placed here.
All societies fail eventually. Ours will too.
Do you believe that a higher power aided the Founders in setting up the greatest experiment in human freedoms ever seen on the face of the earth ?
Do you believe that that the leaders of America have for 140 years been operating in the best interests of decent Americans ?
Where am I going with this ? If you believe freedom is right and good..then you are fighting on the side of a higher power.
If INSTEAD you believe that higher power is government...then you are beaten before you fire the first shot. Because they WILL KILL YOU... you are fighting on the wrong side, and you will hesitate in the clutch.
Get this straight in your head. That which promotes freedom is GOOD..that which takes away from freedom is BAD. Government, by its very nature, is evil...that is precisly why the founders insisted upon the citizens being armed and prepared to resist tyranny.
please don't be so quick to take offense. Wasn't addressing you at all. Have seen nothing to indicate any sign of brain-dead in you...
Hvae read your posts re a higher being. One of the beauties of 'freedom'..is you believe this and I believe that. All well and good. Will defend such till the death.
Where I draw the line...as you seem to...is the steady erosion by government of EVERY RIGHT GUARANTEED US by the Constitution. Let us keep our eyes firmly upon the real enemy here....
You say: "Where am I going with this ? If you believe freedom is right and good..then you are fighting on the side of a higher power.
If INSTEAD you believe that higher power is government...then you are beaten before you fire the first shot. Because they WILL KILL YOU... you are fighting on the wrong side, and you will hesitate in the clutch"
Is all government evil? Is anarchy and no authority better? No sanitation department, police, fire or sewer authority? No interstate highways, border protection or air traffic control? What would you have?
I will fight tyranny, but to say all government is tyranny is wrong headed and destructive. Let me say again, I will fight tyranny and am vigilant and will not turn in a single gun, but, I believe we are a long way from that. We obviously disagree.
If a person believes the government is the "higher power" then he is guilty of idolatry, is a fool and is probably a democrat.
Here's what God says about government:
Romans 13:1-3 1Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and he will commend you.
God instituted government and gave us all free will.
We are all going to die one day, in bed or at the point of a gun. (or for me, in a car on a sales call) The question for you is, what then?
The ultimate aim of the Founders was to elect "Citizen Legislators"..people coming from across the street, going to Washington for 2 to 6 years, then going back home to actually LIVE under the laws they passed.
Naturally, some measure of 'government' is absolutely necessary to the continuing function of civil society. History ABSOLUTELY teaches us that said government will turn evil..turning upon the very citizens that feed it. The Founders left us with the means to thwart this ageless cycle. Unfortunately...attitudes such as yours infect most of the populace..the inability to see the greed of the power-mad elites running this country.
Molon Labe
What HighVolumeOfFire said. [:D]
The gene pool needs chlorine.
Joey Has Been Freed!
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
I didn't post on this before so the answer is yes.
We do not have childern, our parents are elderly (2 out of 4 sick, one of them in a home). Mrs quikdraw is as adamant about gun rights (and liberty in general) as I am, she is an Army vet, and knows her way around an AR15 very well.
So yes, we would have nothing to lose but our lives, and neither one of us would want to live in a US with our freedom.
"Mongo only pawn in game of life"
LOL, people in glass houses...[:D][:D][:D]
Joey Has Been Freed!
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
you know what I meant.....[^]
"Mongo only pawn in game of life"
I know, I couldn't resist. lol
Joey Has Been Freed!
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
If nothing happens, great collection. If something happens, great arsenal of liberty!
I do have two little boys, 6 & 8. They do need to know that there are things worth standing up for, a lady entering the room, our God and faith, our country and our constitutional rights.
amscray ithway ethay unsgay
Neo-Jedi Council
Member
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
Would I kill over this? naw....
I will die (at least I think I would, but I am a coward) for family. God, country and preservation.
Sako Fan
What guns? I don't have any guns officer!
Would I kill over this? naw.....
I will die (at least I think I would, but I am a coward) for family. God, country and preservation.
Sako Fan
What do you think we're all willing to die for? Three of the four reasons you mentioned are at the forefront of our concerns. Do you know what tyranny is? Have you any idea how that will affect your Family, Country, and Preservation? When they come to your door asking for your guns they already know you have them. Do you know why they want your guns? If you think this is about your gun in and of itself you better start catching up on your history. Every time, that's EVERY, time there have been Gun Confiscations there has been tyranny and mass murder (genocide) that followed. Australia is relatively new, so we'll see. England is just going through another gun grab, they will and are suffering for it. Their crime rate is up 47%. Read a few of the threads here in GR and you will be rapidly educated.
Neo-Jedi Council
Naboo Sniper
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
It is of like mind that so many of us show up in the same place. This my friends is the only thing that will ever work.
The people they will send are us. The BATFE is them.
Stay tuned for the new UPIN (Unique Personal Identification Number)for your 4473, The new white one . It starts on Oct 17,2005.
The one who shoots first wins.[8D]
"The best way to deal with the problem is to go directly after the politicians and bureaucrats where they live and fight them at their own houses. The same goes for the Judges that ignore our Constitutional rights. This kind of battle can only be won if the people responsible are made to suffer. Sooner or later they can learn that imposing their extreme control on others will bring an extreme response.
Keep tabs on where the politicians live. Send correspondence to their homes, instead of their offices. They may rethink their positions. All politicians must prove they live in the districts they claim to represent. Visit your local election departments for this information." (Defender)
parabellem
Would I Fight, d**n Right. I don't know about how things are were yall are from, but her in south central KY, our local sherrif's deputy would not be coming door to door to take our guns, that would probally be left up to the state police. The local deputy's would probally call us and let us know when they were coming[8]
parabellem
I'd like to think it would be the same here in SouthEast Phoenix area but, I don't think so. I could be wrong, the local police could become normal citizens again if that ever happened, but I tend to think they would TRY and do their job. If you are as passionate about these issues as some that are here, it would be beneficial to read some of the threads start to current. There is some good stuff in them. And welcome again, Bubba Fats.
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
parabellem
"It's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it."
Here are some:
http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=169582
http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=168085
http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=172334
http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=173064
http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=166428
http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=172690
Some good reading in the thread posts. It'll get you guys acquainted with the folks here in gun rights.
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
When the meekest of men raise their fist at you in defiance, you have lost. It is just a matter then of admitting it to yourself.
Nice to see young blood here.
You are the replacements for us
old farts. The fight is far from over.[8D]
I would fight, as would all my brotheren in the Militia I belong to. Saddy I live in Pennsylvaina in a pretty libral anti-gun town. But if the police were going around confiscating all fireams I would fight with everything I had. Our militia is small (only a dozen) and we only have 6 guns between all of us (we are age 15-17). We are all patriots who have sworn to defend the Constitution. When the "kings man" comes to my door I will be waiting with my best weapon, a sword. The only thing is we would have to fight off an enemy with much more men and firepower than us. If such a thing happend my "unit" would have to flee down south, where the real Americans are.
CR- I'd like to ask you, if I may, what kind of curriculum the schools are teaching now? You seem to be pretty well educated thus far in the ways of the Constitution and Bill of rights. Would you say that is an accurate assessment? Are they spending time on these subjects and are they also teaching with a tendency to criticize the government and assess where we are headed? Just curious thought maybe you could help me out. Thanks and welcome. By the way, you guys need to get more guns. What do you have now?
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?
parabellem
Right now I have all blades, but I just ordered a K98. Includding my new (well old, bu you know) rifle we have; 2 K98's, 1 .22 cal magnum rifle, 1 Russian SKS, 1 12 gauge pump shotgun, and the mainstay of our force, a semi-auto[;)] BAR.
parabellem
Think about it, they had passed the UnPatriot Act and the initial shock of 9/11 has worn off, they definitely need to do something to shield their intentions from our view. Voila, they give us back our "Assault Rifles", now people aren't going to be putting 2 and 2 together, it's tough to argue that they are trying to imprison us all when they could have kept the AW's out of our hands with very little effort or consequence. These are some of the most brilliant minds this country has to offer and just because the presidency changes doesn't mean anything else will. The key players are still there even after the president is gone. This is not a presidential decree, no, this is from the minds of the CIA, FBI, BATFE, Treasury Dept., the Federal Reserve, and the heiarchy of the U.S. Military. What president is going to attempt to stand up to those branches of the federal tree? JFK was trying and he was succeeding, so they killed him. His brother was getting rather close to the presidency and rather than go through the near disolution of decades of work, they killed him too. Marilyn Monroe was close to the Kennedys' and they killed her too. The only reason Joe DiMaggio was allowed to live was because they weren't sure what he knew and he was too big to knock off at the time when the others had gone. The president is big no doubt, Jolten' Joe was bigger.
Look how all of those things that were a part of our lives have vanished, the things that held us all together. I'm talking about Baseball, Apple Pie, Drive-In Movies, Malt Shops, Dime Stores, Western Auto, Sears & Roebuck(as it once was), Kats, Smacks, Shakey's Pizza, Player Pianos, weekend barbeques, family outings, evening drives, dinner at 5:30 and everyone was there, the scariest thing about being a kid was being grounded, kick the can, Sorry!, Chutes & Ladders, Monopoly, the Honeymooners, Ozzie & Harriet, Mr. Ed, the Munsters, Taxi, Cheers, the Rifleman, Butch Cassidy & the Sundance Kid, the Duke, the New York Yankees, Roger Maris, Reggie Jackson, Joe Namath, Kenny Stabler, Baseball games on the radio, this Week in Baseball, Mel Allen, Bobby Fischer, the Brady Bunch, M.A.D. Magazine, Comic books, the ads in the back of the comic books, sea horse, the Pet Rock, Elvis Presley, the Monkees, H.R. Puffenstuff, the Wizard of Oz, The Wonderful World of Disney (Sunday's at 6:00PM), the Apple Dumpling Gang, Don Knotts, Red Skelton, Jimmy Durante, the Streets of San Francisco, Marcus Welby M.D., Superstars, the Wide, Wide, World of Sports, "the agony of defeat" (you can see the ski jumper going over the chute), Lost in Space, Shootin' hoops in the driveway, walking to school and not having to worry about being abducted, Bottle Caps candy, Wacky Packages, Topps Baseball Cards, Mickey Mouse Club, Hawaii-Five-O, The Joy of Sex, Jonathan Livingston Seagull, "Love means never having to say your sorry", L.I.F.E., Rock 'em Sock 'em Robots, Friday Night at the Fights, Dean Martin & Jerry Lewis, The Odd Couple, Miracle on 34th Street, Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer, Frosty the Snowman, Christmas Caroling, Tiny Tim, Monday Night Football with Howard Cossell, Bobby Riggs, Jimmy Conners, The Six Million Dollar Man, Championship Wrestling, Bas-Ket, Bubble Gum Cigarettes, Candy Cigarettes, Malt-O-Meal, Tang, Early Times Whiskey, Klondike Kat, Tab, "Ho, Ho, Ho, Green Giant", TeePee'ing Houses, the Pop Shoppe, Dark Shadows, Love American Style and on and on.
Yes, there was a time when life was so much easier and care-free. "Progress", what a crock that is, progress has taken a very proud, wealthy, religious, and patriotic people and turned them into brain-washed sheeple. It's not hard to see how they've done it, they were keeping us busy with all sorts of new gadgets while eroding away our rights, thi Patriot Act is really a ballsy move on behalf of the government, they took a gamble and it paid off for them. I would like to have everyone who voted "aye" on the UnPatriot Act be brought up on treason charges and crimes against our constitution (if it ain't a law, make it one) because they voted on taking away our rights without seeing the laws they were approving. Those were our representatives, Congress, that were manhandled by Donald Rumsfeld to just sign it, time was not on our side.
Those planes that hit the World Trade Center Towers were not flown into those buildings by terrorists, our own government flew those planes with auto-pilot and remote control.(1) They had to have something like 9/11 happen or they would never get their precious Patriot Act through Congress. The Patriot Act allows for:
* Conduct domestic wiretapping without court order for 15 days following a congressional authorization of use of force or an attack on the United States.
* Secretly detain citizens.
* Deport any alien, including green-card holders, who are convicted of drug possession or an aggravated felony.
* Access a citizen's credit reports without a subpoena.
* Abolish federal court "consent decrees" that limit police surveillance of non-criminal organizations and public events.
* Criminalize the use of encryption software in the commission or planning of a felony.
* Apply strict gag rules to those subpoenaed by a grand jury.
* Collect DNA from suspected terrorists and indeed from any individual whose DNA might assist terror investigations.
* Extend authorization periods for secret wiretaps and Internet surveillance.
* Ease restrictions on the use of secret evidence.
In other words, stick a fork in us, we're done. These guys have it so just being a member of this site allows them to declare you a terrorist, with that comes the designation of being a foreign threat. Now they can treat you how ever they feel like and you've got no recourse. I can't believe how naive people are. Truly pathetic that our congressmen were so alert that they signed a bill into law that they had never seen. I think Donald Rumsfeld could be charged with Treason and Obstruction, I'd love to see it. We need to quit embracing the "rights for safety" BS and call a spade a spade. This law is rotten to the core and the only ways to stop it are immediate judicial hearings on all involved, or brute physical force.
This is all going to play out over the course of the next 18 months, by the time May of 2007 rolls around there will be many dead Americans at the hands of JBT's. They will be killed for terrorist activities, for doing such things as going out shooting on the weekend with a friend, or chatting on a gun web forum. Watch, it's going to go down exactly how we would expect it too. There's no new revelation or 9/11, they don't need one. Now if the people wise up, there will be another Hiroshima on American soil, it won't be averted, due to it's absolute necessity in the face of tyrannical madmen gone power crazy. It is all so surreal but you better believe it because it's coming for you.
There are two kinds of people in this World....Those who lead....and those who get the hell out of the way...GUT CHECK!...Which one are you?