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30-30 crimp

geeguygeeguy Member Posts: 1,047
Loading for a Winchester Mod 94 - 20" barrel.

I will be using a 170 gr. "what cheer" bullet (170 gr. jacketed SP - flat end) without a Cannelure.

What do you recommend for the crimp? Hvy, light? How tight do I need to make the bullet so I assure it doesn't move during loading and use? Will be using RCBS 2 die set, so I don't have a Lee final crimp die for this one.

Also, planning to start with 28.5 grains of IMR3031 (I show 32 max). Any other pet loads? This is for normal "brush shooting" for a friend.

Comments

  • geeguygeeguy Member Posts: 1,047
    edited November -1
    First time reloading a 30-30. Used FN 170 gr. non-cannelure bullets.

    Bullets keep sliding back when cycling with the tube magazine (Win 94). Normally use Lee final crimp die for other rifle rounds, but using Lyman dies (FL 2 die set) for this load. 1/3 turn down from brass lip, any more seems to effect the shoulder. Questions:
    1. Do I need to use cannelure bullets?
    2. Am I setting the tapered crimp to tight?
    Recommendations: (if not I'll just buy a final crimp die)
    Thanks
  • MG1890MG1890 Member Posts: 4,649
    edited November -1
    30 two times are fussy about crimping. Cases are thin and will buckle at the slightest provocation.

    Trim all cases to the same length. Crimp slightly, since the bullet has no cannelure.

    Go outside and make sure a crimped cartridge will fully chamber before you ruin the whole batch. Shoulders can bulge out slightly during crimping.
  • charliemeyer007charliemeyer007 Member Posts: 7,348 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    CH made a tool to roll in cannelure's. A handy guy could likely Gerry rig something up. I would just shoot them single shot or doubled until I got bullets with a crimp location.

    http://www.corbins.com/hct-1.htm

    You will need a good crimp to resist movement in the tube magazine, especially if you keep the mag topped off after shooting a round or two.

    Added I'd use the 40 good bullets for a lifetime supply guy. I'm not sure bullet construction for a 30-06 target bullet is correct for a 30-30 hunting bullet.

    Oh to be cursed with 1000's of target bullets. I shot a 5 gallon bucket of pulled 172 grain boattails. They were a penny a piece, the primer and the powder was 2 more cents. 60 cents a box for full tilt 06 ammo, those were the days.
  • geeguygeeguy Member Posts: 1,047
    edited November -1
    Charlie: I have several bullet types with the cannelure, both round nose 170 gr. and 150 gr. plus some 170 gr.Bighorn SPFP. But I was trying to use up the "what cheer" since these are .30-06 target bullets and I have several thousand that I really don't use much.

    The only lever action I've loaded for was mag fed or a pistol round (.44 mag). I am concerned because these are for a good friend and I want to assure the bullet will not slide back in the case.

    Based on what I am hearing I guess I'll have to use some of my "good" bullets (he is a good friend). I'm only going to load about 40 rds. which will be a life time supply for him.

    Edit: Nononsence, I did try to sell these on GB and local CL at a very reasonable cost, no action, so I just use them for .30-06 when I need a plinker bullet (although they are excellent target bullets).
    Ambrose, I read that you want the 30-30 to be over 2000FPS, I'll bump that to 31.5 and still be under max, thanks for the info.
  • nononsensenononsense Member, Moderator Posts: 10,576 ******
    edited November -1
    geeguy,

    quote: But I was trying to use up the "what cheer" since these are .30-06 target bullets and I have several thousand that I really don't use much.

    I would think that you could work up some sort of trade with some of our members (through proper channels, of course) in order to get more of the bullets you need for some of the bullets you have thousands of. Maybe someone local has the bullets you need and is willing to trade?

    Crimping .30-30 cases needs a careful hand as pointed out above.

    Best.
  • Hawk CarseHawk Carse Member Posts: 4,296 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    The Lee collet type Factory Crimp die will hammer the case mouth into the side of the bullet. It will MAKE its own cannelure. Won't buckle the case neck because it is not forcing it down.

    Probably not worth the cost for 40 rounds, squander some normal bullets on him.
  • AmbroseAmbrose Member Posts: 2,708 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    One of my hobbies is reloading and shooting over chronograph screens (Oehler 35P). I have 6 or 7 .30-30 rifles and shoot them regularly. Factory 170 gr. loads run 1900-2150 fps. I got some older 170 gr. Western silver tips at a yard sale and they ran only 1900 fps but 5-shot groups from my Remington 788 were well under an inch! I have fired 31.5 gr. of IMR3031 with the 170 gr. Sierra FP from a 20" Marlin 336 and they averaged 2059 fps for 20 shots. Your load of 28.5 of IMR3031 with a 170 gr. bullet is going to run about 1825 fps; a good bit on the slow side. I'd bump it up a couple grains and you'd still have a conservative load that would run close to 2000 fps.

    Just my .02!
  • AmbroseAmbrose Member Posts: 2,708 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    My Marlin is not a tack driver and its 4-shot groups averaged 2.88" with the above load. Well within "minute of deer". I would think that your friends Winchester would do as well or better. (A coffee cup at 100 yds. would be in mortal danger!)

    By the way: Now that your friend has you to load cartridges for him, he should be able to shoot a lot more. A LOT more!
  • 243winxb243winxb Member Posts: 257 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    With proper neck tension, no crimp is needed. Seating the bullet should expand the case neck .002" or more on seating, this will give plenty of neck tension. Check the neck before and after seating the bullets.
    [url] https://saami.org [/url]
  • EhlerDaveEhlerDave Member Posts: 5,158 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    An old fella here in town has a worn out tubing cutter, he uses it to make cannelure in bullets. I will say they look good when he is done, plus he moves the groove to the area he wants for OAL. I have no clue where or how he came to have about a 5 gallon bucket of the bullets he uses. [:)]
    Just smile and say nothing, let them guess how much you know.
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