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Mrmike08075--70-150WCF

my-handymanmy-handyman Member Posts: 298 ✭✭
edited June 2003 in Ask the Experts
I just read your posting.If you still need the info in the 1952 Gun Digest, let me know and I'll pass it along. The info is there! Vernon
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    mrmike08075mrmike08075 Member Posts: 10,998 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    yes, please email/message me and i will send you my mailing adress. a photo copy would be greatly appeciated. i am trying to compile a research/referance file and it is very thin at the present time. best regards, mike.

    What other dungeon is so dark as ones own heart, what jailer so inexorable as ones own mind.
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    my-handymanmy-handyman Member Posts: 298 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Mike - sent you an e-mail. If anyone else is interested in the article, let me know and I will post (retype) the portion for the 70-105 win.
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    IconoclastIconoclast Member Posts: 10,515 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I would deeply appreciate seeing this iformation and thank you for offering to provide it.
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    my-handymanmy-handyman Member Posts: 298 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    From Gun Digest 1952 6th ed Winchester's "Forgotten" Cartidges' 1866-1900 pg173 by Paul Foster. [Probably the most controversial Winchester cartridge ever made is the .70-150. It appears on the 1888 cartridge board, perhaps others. Various stories are told about it, that it was an advertising novelty made for a mammoth Model 76 displayed at the Centennial Exposition, that it was loaded on special order for an English big game double rifle, that a special oversize single shot was chambered for it, and a host of other theories. Actually, the cartridges were made in 1888, as recently discovered factory tool records show. The gun chambered for it. I have discovered, was the Model 87 leveraction shotgun with a special rifled barrel. One of the old Winchester gun men told me that years ago he remembered seeing and puzzling over such a gun in the old company testing range. I think I can reconstruct the thinking behind its manufacture. The Model 87 was the first shotgun made by Winchester, a novelty to the factory. Perhaps echoing faintly, back along the corridor of a time is the conversation between the Chief Gun Designer and the Chief Cartridge Engineer of the period.
    Gun Designer: "Well, there she is, te new Winchester shotgun."
    Cartridge Engineer: "Twon't sell, don't look like a shotgun. Remember the Hotchkiss flop - don't look like a rifle."
    Gun Designer: Course it'll sell - every duck hunter'll want one. Say I'll bet that action would work as a rifle, too."
    Cartridge Engineer: "Maybe - a 12 guage rifle would be a he-gun. Look, you make a rifle barrel, and I'll make some cartridges, and we'll show it to the boss."
    In my reconstruction of this episode, the boss took a dim view of the new gun, sarcastically inquiring about wheels and caissons; so, except for cartridge board novelties and a small quanity of loaded rounds the .70-150 passed into the limbo of forgotten cartridges.]
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    my-handymanmy-handyman Member Posts: 298 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    OK, this is all that I can find on the cartridge...
    From the Winchester Handbook by George Madis, on pg99 under "Chambers"
    [Except for a few experimental guns made for the cartridge department laboratory (later called the ballistics lab) all models 87 were 12 guage guns until number 22,148, the first production 10 guage shotgun. From this number to near 27,000, 10 guage guns predominate; thereafter both 10 and 12 guage guns were produced.
    Since Winchester had received many enquires for a very powerful rifle and the company believed such a gun would sell very well, some models 87 were made to chamber the 70-150 cartridge. Of 70 caliber with a charge of 150 grains of powder and a bullet of 700 to 900 grains, the gun must have been a killer at both ends. Ratchet rifling, located only near the muzzle, was employed for these guns. Two of these rifles are located in England and one in Pittsburgh, PA. Others probably exist.]
    PS Mike did you get my e-mail?
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    IconoclastIconoclast Member Posts: 10,515 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    my-handyman, thank you *very much* for taking the time and effort to post this data!! Very useful and interesting . . . I saved it to my own records for reference.

    Welcome to the forums; I look forward to 'seeing' you around.
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    mrmike08075mrmike08075 Member Posts: 10,998 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    yes, i recieved your email, and responded. i deeply appreciate the time and effort spent in providind this information. we have been contacted by an english fine arms dealer who states that he posseses a MARTINI-HENRY falling block rifle converted to .70-150 WCF and that he is aware or several of these guns being made and exported to india. he has requested an estimate of time/cost for 50 rounds of loaded ammo. he also stated he had handled a GREENER double SXS that had a single BBL .70-150 WCF that had been adapted for use on its frame. this is like peeling an onion. i am glad that others are interested. best regards, and much thanks, mike.

    What other dungeon is so dark as ones own heart, what jailer so inexorable as ones own mind.
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