Would you become a Kamakaize for your beliefs?

Rembrandt

The strength of ones beliefs in their cause has given me much to think about this week. These terrorists no doubt felt their acts were more important than their lives. Japanese pilots were much the same during WWII. Congressional Medal of Honor recepiants have done incredible acts knowing that there was little chance they would survive but acted unselfishly. How many here would say goodby to your wife, kids, and family members for the last time, get in a plane fly it into the enemies hideout, knowing it was a one way ticket.....showing your beliefs were backed up by the ultimate sacrifice? I am so proud of American men and women in uniform, and sobered knowing that some may not come home fighting for our beliefs.

badboybob

No F***ing way. A warrior lives to kill the enemy and survive to fight again. Only crazies immolate themselves. Do you see anyone but Islamic nut cases doing this?

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So many guns to buy. So little money.

Evil ATF

To put it in terms some of us can understand:What if the 2nd Amendment were abolished? A complete and utter ban of ALL firearms nationwide. Then the JBT's start with their security checkpoints, ID's for traveling outside or into a city, beatings, theft of goods, raping of your wives and daughters. Would you give your life to put an end to the maddness? Of course you would. I think that they are wrong, but the Arabs see us as the "Great Satan". When you make a person believe that you are threatening their way of life (as Clinton did with all the CIVILIAN bombings he ordered during his tenure), they will respond in kind. With that said, let's kill some terrorists.

Rembrandt

Thank goodness we have cruise missles to do what the Kamakaise's did. There are many documented cases of soldiers falling on hand grenades to save their comrades and Congressional Medal of Honor recipiants that I wouldn't call crazies for what they did. Would you give your life for your children? Most I know would, but that doesn't mean they're crazy Islamic nut cases .

idsman75

Theres a difference between dying for what you believe in (i.e. a soldier's death) and being a Kamakaize. A Kamakaize is willing to sacrifice his life but, in this case, it was against innocent non-combatants and there was no declared war. Non-combatant death is always a factor during war but non-combatants were the primary target in this scenario. Defending your Constitutional rights against JBT's would not constitute "Kamakaize" warfare. Strapping a bomb to yourself and running into a mall full of women and children would constitute "Kamakaize". Being willing to give your life for a greater cause has absolutely nothing to do with bravery. It can be merely a side-effect of brainwashing and psychotic tendencies. Being willing to give your life in the line of duty or in battle against an enemy that is equally capable of taking it from you in the most painful ways is bravery. Please do not equate "Kamaikaze" warfare with patriotism. Doing so diminishes what our founding fathers did for us in making us a free nation.

Lowrider

A soldier fighting against overwhelming odds, a patriot fighting the Govt. over his constitutional rights... no comparison to the kamakazi pilots or the scumbags from last Tuesday.The latter two have prepared to die, plan to die and want to die.The soldier or the patriot, regardless of the odds against him, believes in his heart he can win and come home victorious.

Rembrandt

Please forgive if I'm wandering around on this topic, but I'm trying to understand something that is contrary to my nature. From the time we are born we are gasping for air, for food, and for life...we all want to live and survive. It goes against all human nature to seek our own demise. Yet these scumbags have been convinced the opposite. In trying to understand how their mind works, I attempted to find similar senarios where people have given their lives for causes they believed in to help me understand this....No disrespect was intended to past or present patriots of our country. I don't believe these people were crazy in a psycological sense....the only conclusion I can find is that they were trained that way, brain washed, or indoctrinated. I guess they did this for the same reason people followed Hitler or drank poison kool-aid. The world is full of good and evil.

alledan

If my family were at direct risk and their very existence depended on my one lone act then I would saddle up a nuke and ride it to it's target if that were the only means to end the bulls**t!

idsman75

Psychotic/Loss of sanity or however the shrinks want to define it is merely a state of being. It matters not how they got there. You can be born with psych problems and you can be conditioned that way. It is the old "nature/nurture" argument which has been beat to death over the years with regards to various topics of discussion. They may have been conditioned and indoctrinated but ultimately they had no conscience and no qualms about killing themselves and others. Being psychotic and psychopathic involves (as I remmber from psych class) having no grasp or regard for the consequences of your actions. It still does not excuse the actions that were taken. P.S. Rembrandt--I wasn't referring to your comments in my previous post. I was trying to straighten something out about an earlier post on this thread regarding a hypothetical armed posture against "JBT's".[This message has been edited by idsman75 (edited 09-15-2001).]

rsnyder55

The problem here is everyone is trying to use western rationalization against non-western cultures and beliefs.To Osama Bin Laden, there is no difference between civilians and military personnel. We are all evil and a target is a target.We are evil westerners. Our ways are decadent and we are doing the devil's work. We are all guilty and must die to preserve the 'true' faith.They truly believe in what they are doing and that it will get them to heaven. No matter how irrational it may seem to us.A bomb doesn't care about the rationality of the hand or mind that launched it.

idsman75

Actually, I took that into consideration when I mentioned brain-washing and conditioning. That's where it starts with these nutjobs. Just because it is a "religion" or a "belief system" doesn't mean that brainwashing and conditioning isn't going on. That is EXACTLY how these fringe groups take young children and raise them to act contrary to true human nature without remorse.[This message has been edited by idsman75 (edited 09-16-2001).]