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High school diploma.....suggestions for situation?
She is going into the 11th grade. It would help if she were driving already, but since she was late getting her permit it will be September before she can get her license. I will check into the college options.....maybe we can get her into a program where she goes half the day and spends the rest of her time in higher courses. I get aggrivated when I think of all the options out there and just how little the schools do to make you aware of these things.
I just want better for her than this school is going to lead towards. There aren't any kids there that I see reaping the benefits of being young and having your entire future ahead. Since we had some trouble....there is also an added twist you only get by living in a small town....she may not be able to get past it all while at this school and it looks likely that she will be "branded" trouble forever in their eyes.
I don't know just what we may do, but I am definately going to speak to councelors with a couple of the colleges nearby....and I will also check into added programs the high school may not be telling me about.
I am fortunate to have gone to a good rural school. The math and English teachers demand the best you could offer. They said college will be easy and less of an education than what I had at Serena High School. When it came to the general education classes, they were right. It was interesting to watch others struggle, and I wondered what kind of lame high school education did they have.
I would probably try and talk to some HR managers in addition to a college counselor. I do a lot of hiring in my position. I can tell you that more times than not they do not know what the real world needs. You need to strike a balance between her high school level and something that matters in the real world. No point in finding a path through high school if it damages her future.
In my professional opinion a GED or omitting your HS on a resume when you are young is a red flag that gets put in the reject pile. Someone who has years of experience can get away with it but not a young 22yr old fresh out of college. The days of a GED getting you in the door to any kind of career track are very limited these days.
After reviewing this thread I've come away with a better understanding of individual opinions and situations. No one is wrong, but no one is right either.
I'm 20 years your senior. I went to a VERY small country school and came from a tiny community where there were NO opportunities. I can truthfully state that, while my schooling was probably done with the best of intentions, it did little to serve me.
I remember so many times looking at the clock and wishing the day gone while some other part of me whispered that I'd regret those lost hours later in life. I'm still waiting to regret. Fact is, what I really regret is not having had the courage to skip a day or two here and there and go hunting or fishing. Most of all I regret not having had the experience or courage to follow my own path.
I remember so many times that admonition... "It'll be good for you." It wasn't. I look back on those years with no fondness. The best I can share as that I endured. Some say that's enough. I say differently.
And so I ask... Is your daughter fluent in the spoken and written word? Does she read? How are her math skills? Does she have an aptitude or skill outside those subjects offered in her school? Have you had a frank conversation with her about her future? How mature (mentally) is she? You say she's bright... How bright?
I walked away from high school 42 years ago with a regents diploma. I didn't get it because I wanted it. I didn't get it because the subject material interested me. I got the diploma because I was told that I had to get it. Believe me, it represented NOTHING that had any bearing on my future life. In fact, I now believe it hurt me in many ways because it placed me in situations which convinced me that I was inferior to the "smart" students around me. It took years for me to realize that I was as smart as they, or much smarter, but in a different way.
I've been on my own since I was seventeen. I left home for a job in another part of the state a month after graduation. There was no option of returning home. As I look back the most important skill I carried (aside from God-given talent) was the ability to read and write. Perhaps second was the ability to add and subtract. In other words, the ability to think and make rational decisions.
That piece of paper I received for having lived through high school has NEVER been an issue... Not even for my first job. The issue has always been what I could do and what I could offer to an employer. And I accepted from the start that certain doors would be closed to me because I refused to conform.
My take on high school is simple:
There are those who will never learn much of anything. Theirs is a hopeless path. We all know such people and we know what their life will be like... Or has been like... Or in many cases was like.
There are those who had the benefit of good looks or were skilled at sports. Every dog has his day they say. Too bad when the pinnacle of one's life is achieved at sixteen and everything is downhill from there.
And there are people who need what school offers and gain something from it. In my case I needed to learn how to read and write and I needed exposure to math. The rest I endured.
Lastly there are the real students. They go to school and sail through with not one problem. Their scores are among the best and they seem to absorb everything. I'd argue that the majority of these "students" would do just as well had they never attended school past their elementary education. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think so.
And have you noticed?... Many of the "students" who flew through school effortlessly have failed in life for all practical purposes.
On the other hand, a good number of what were considered marginal students have done unexpectedly well in life. Go figure!
Have that serious talk with your daughter. Does she have a special interest or skill? If so, help her. If not, it might not be a bad idea to expose her to things she DOES NOT wish to do.
I worked on local farms to earn some extra money in my teens. Working on the farm was a far superior education to high school as the taught me what I DID NOT WANT TO DO. This may be something to consider.
Were she to be my child, I'd probably look into an alternate school for her last year. This based on your comments about her past behavior. The diploma? I wouldn't worry too much. Social activities would not be forbidden, but I can guarantee that she'd have a job. A car? Not forbidden, but she'd pay the freight. I mean everything.
At this point you've parented about all you can. You can still guide and assist, but this young lady will now make the final choices. Don't be afraid to discuss the outcome of poor choices. Tell her why you're doing what you are. Insist that your rules are the only rules and lovingly explain why. Tell her that you don't want to see her with five kids at the age of twenty five with a drunk toothless husband. Don't be afraid to point out those who have made that choice.
Then say a prayer and hope that she'll listen. The piece of paper? It's not important right now. I wish you all the best and I expect this young woman will do you proud... After she's given you a lot of gray hair.
Is there a mandatory number of days that she has to be physically in the highschool per year? If not maybe she could get assignments/homework ahead of time and stay home and do it. I started that as a Junior and when I was a Senior I was only at school 1-2, maybe 3 days/week.
Also, work toward early graduation. All 3 of my girls graduated just after Christmas in their Senior year. Don't let the "they'll miss so many social benefits" argument bother you. Our high school was all cliques-the jocks, the hyper-religious, those into name brand clothes, the stoners, with a common thread of meanness and bullying. Our girls were into hunting, fishing, rodeos, jobs/money, not offending anyone. They've never been to a class reunion and are doing far better marriage wise and financially than most of their classmates.
Around here thay have a program called Running Start. If 16 and 17 year olds test high enough in school, they can start going to our community college and taking classes instead of high school.
LF I can somewhat relate to what your going through. Ever since the no kid left behind crap the schools just don't seem to care about a single kid. My youngest has switched to a small passage school and now he loves to go to school again. The oldest is looking into the online school, I don't know to much about this one but I have seen commercials on TV so I know there not blowing smoke at me. Might want to do some checking of your own about online schools, just a thought.
quote:Originally posted by 1911a1fan
Kodiakk is the very first person i have ever heard having a problem with a g.e.d., and i only here from graduates that a diploma is better
bobski i was 16 had no choice but to work, go to school or eat
i could see if she had aspirations to be a lawyer or doctor, but if she did you wouldn't be asking this question today
I was on my own at 16, got a GED in 1975. If you go on to college or trade school and do well a GED is as good as a diploma.
Well when i went to HS, I was like your daughter. I hated the place, and was a baby sitter for the parents. I also ended up with 1 credit shy of the diploma.Had to get the GED. If you know that your daughter WILL go onto a collage or tech school, then I would say just let her drop out and get the GED. If she can show some collage work after HS, then I think it shows she has a brain and will be less likely to hurt her in the future.
Also, if the area where you are is a backward and rural as you say, then not having a diploma will not be as big of a problem as it would in the city or rich suburbs. If she is that miserable, then let her quit. And if the school ias as useless as you describe, then most people around there know it is a waste, and so is the diploma she would get if she stayed.
Just sharing my own experience. My oldest son, 19, scored 137 (120 - 140 - Very superior intelligence) in a Binet (IQ) Scale in middle school and we were advised that he can advance to a higher grade. We opted not to, we just want him to be a normal kid. Was he bored? Absolutely! Did we encourage him to explore challenging endeavors? You bet! Are there challenges for us in dealing with him? Of course! We have been labeled by friends and family as "MEAN PARENTS" but we managed to steer him accordingly.
As a military brat, he was exposed to lot of diversity, domestic and abroad, that made him appreciate life in general. My late Mom only had a 6 grade education but instilled on us early on the importance of education. She was very business savvy and was very successful on her own business. She made me promise to finish a degree and pursue challenges as far as I am willing to take it. Two masters later, I am debating for a while now if I should take on a doctoral program - this is more for personal achievement than anything.
Parents can only provide the best guidance they know how but the child(ren) have the ultimate decision, especially when we are no longer around to remind them. The "SELF" factor is very instrumental in her young career (this applies to us adults too). She must have the SELF-determination, SELF-discipline, SELF-drive, and so on in order to achieve their goal in life.
My wife and I told our son to decide on a career that he would truly enjoy doing. There is nothing worst than getting up in the morning going to work that you hate (I am sure there something else worse but please stay with me on this). We cannot be all like Tiger Woods, Kobe Bryant, or other stars that are paid millions of dollars playing the field of interest they enjoy the most. Our sons were not born on a silver platter and they must work on everything they want.
My oldest have this 25-year plan. I did not have the heart to tell him that my wife and I never had such a plan and still don't. His goal is high but is achievable. When we asked him two years ago on how he plan to get there? He said via the USAFA or USNA. When we asked him how he plan to get there, he said, stay in school, high GPA, high ACT/SAT scores, leadership, extra curricular stuff, etc.. He knows that smarts alone will not get him there. He needs to fill the right blocks to get there.
He just finished his first year in the USAFA and is in the honor roll. He is enjoying the challenges and opportunities at the USAFA.
Parenting will always be a challenge. Good luck and best wishes!
I was home-schooled through high school back in the late 80's. Back then there was no option that would allow me to get a diploma, it was GED only.
In Missouri at that time, I had to wait until my 16th birthday to take the test. Then, since I was only 16, I had to have a school counselor sign a letter stating that they approved it. Since I had not attended a public school for high school, I had to get a special waiver from the State Sec. of Education. Six months later I was allowed to take the test.
My scores were high enough that I was offered a full tuition scholarship to a junior college in the area and to the local state university. The only catch was that the state university required me to wait until I would have normally graduated.
I have never had to explain my GED to anyone. I have also never had any difficulty getting a job. In my early 20's I realized that I really enjoyed sales and have been doing it since.
Every situation is different, but it has never been an issue for me.
My wife used to give refreasher courses for people wanting to take their GED. Here in PA you can't get a GED before your class graduates. Most were older people in or just out of the work force that felt a "diploma" would help them get better jobs. It is not easy to get a GED, much easier to stay in school.
Comments
I just want better for her than this school is going to lead towards. There aren't any kids there that I see reaping the benefits of being young and having your entire future ahead. Since we had some trouble....there is also an added twist you only get by living in a small town....she may not be able to get past it all while at this school and it looks likely that she will be "branded" trouble forever in their eyes.
I don't know just what we may do, but I am definately going to speak to councelors with a couple of the colleges nearby....and I will also check into added programs the high school may not be telling me about.
In my professional opinion a GED or omitting your HS on a resume when you are young is a red flag that gets put in the reject pile. Someone who has years of experience can get away with it but not a young 22yr old fresh out of college. The days of a GED getting you in the door to any kind of career track are very limited these days.
bobski i was 16 had no choice but to work, go to school or eat
i could see if she had aspirations to be a lawyer or doctor, but if she did you wouldn't be asking this question today
After reviewing this thread I've come away with a better understanding of individual opinions and situations. No one is wrong, but no one is right either.
I'm 20 years your senior. I went to a VERY small country school and came from a tiny community where there were NO opportunities. I can truthfully state that, while my schooling was probably done with the best of intentions, it did little to serve me.
I remember so many times looking at the clock and wishing the day gone while some other part of me whispered that I'd regret those lost hours later in life. I'm still waiting to regret. Fact is, what I really regret is not having had the courage to skip a day or two here and there and go hunting or fishing. Most of all I regret not having had the experience or courage to follow my own path.
I remember so many times that admonition... "It'll be good for you." It wasn't. I look back on those years with no fondness. The best I can share as that I endured. Some say that's enough. I say differently.
And so I ask... Is your daughter fluent in the spoken and written word? Does she read? How are her math skills? Does she have an aptitude or skill outside those subjects offered in her school? Have you had a frank conversation with her about her future? How mature (mentally) is she? You say she's bright... How bright?
I walked away from high school 42 years ago with a regents diploma. I didn't get it because I wanted it. I didn't get it because the subject material interested me. I got the diploma because I was told that I had to get it. Believe me, it represented NOTHING that had any bearing on my future life. In fact, I now believe it hurt me in many ways because it placed me in situations which convinced me that I was inferior to the "smart" students around me. It took years for me to realize that I was as smart as they, or much smarter, but in a different way.
I've been on my own since I was seventeen. I left home for a job in another part of the state a month after graduation. There was no option of returning home. As I look back the most important skill I carried (aside from God-given talent) was the ability to read and write. Perhaps second was the ability to add and subtract. In other words, the ability to think and make rational decisions.
That piece of paper I received for having lived through high school has NEVER been an issue... Not even for my first job. The issue has always been what I could do and what I could offer to an employer. And I accepted from the start that certain doors would be closed to me because I refused to conform.
My take on high school is simple:
There are those who will never learn much of anything. Theirs is a hopeless path. We all know such people and we know what their life will be like... Or has been like... Or in many cases was like.
There are those who had the benefit of good looks or were skilled at sports. Every dog has his day they say. Too bad when the pinnacle of one's life is achieved at sixteen and everything is downhill from there.
And there are people who need what school offers and gain something from it. In my case I needed to learn how to read and write and I needed exposure to math. The rest I endured.
Lastly there are the real students. They go to school and sail through with not one problem. Their scores are among the best and they seem to absorb everything. I'd argue that the majority of these "students" would do just as well had they never attended school past their elementary education. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think so.
And have you noticed?... Many of the "students" who flew through school effortlessly have failed in life for all practical purposes.
On the other hand, a good number of what were considered marginal students have done unexpectedly well in life. Go figure!
Have that serious talk with your daughter. Does she have a special interest or skill? If so, help her. If not, it might not be a bad idea to expose her to things she DOES NOT wish to do.
I worked on local farms to earn some extra money in my teens. Working on the farm was a far superior education to high school as the taught me what I DID NOT WANT TO DO. This may be something to consider.
Were she to be my child, I'd probably look into an alternate school for her last year. This based on your comments about her past behavior. The diploma? I wouldn't worry too much. Social activities would not be forbidden, but I can guarantee that she'd have a job. A car? Not forbidden, but she'd pay the freight. I mean everything.
At this point you've parented about all you can. You can still guide and assist, but this young lady will now make the final choices. Don't be afraid to discuss the outcome of poor choices. Tell her why you're doing what you are. Insist that your rules are the only rules and lovingly explain why. Tell her that you don't want to see her with five kids at the age of twenty five with a drunk toothless husband. Don't be afraid to point out those who have made that choice.
Then say a prayer and hope that she'll listen. The piece of paper? It's not important right now. I wish you all the best and I expect this young woman will do you proud... After she's given you a lot of gray hair.
Also, work toward early graduation. All 3 of my girls graduated just after Christmas in their Senior year. Don't let the "they'll miss so many social benefits" argument bother you. Our high school was all cliques-the jocks, the hyper-religious, those into name brand clothes, the stoners, with a common thread of meanness and bullying. Our girls were into hunting, fishing, rodeos, jobs/money, not offending anyone. They've never been to a class reunion and are doing far better marriage wise and financially than most of their classmates.
Kodiakk is the very first person i have ever heard having a problem with a g.e.d., and i only here from graduates that a diploma is better
bobski i was 16 had no choice but to work, go to school or eat
i could see if she had aspirations to be a lawyer or doctor, but if she did you wouldn't be asking this question today
I was on my own at 16, got a GED in 1975. If you go on to college or trade school and do well a GED is as good as a diploma.
Also, if the area where you are is a backward and rural as you say, then not having a diploma will not be as big of a problem as it would in the city or rich suburbs. If she is that miserable, then let her quit. And if the school ias as useless as you describe, then most people around there know it is a waste, and so is the diploma she would get if she stayed.
As a military brat, he was exposed to lot of diversity, domestic and abroad, that made him appreciate life in general. My late Mom only had a 6 grade education but instilled on us early on the importance of education. She was very business savvy and was very successful on her own business. She made me promise to finish a degree and pursue challenges as far as I am willing to take it. Two masters later, I am debating for a while now if I should take on a doctoral program - this is more for personal achievement than anything.
Parents can only provide the best guidance they know how but the child(ren) have the ultimate decision, especially when we are no longer around to remind them. The "SELF" factor is very instrumental in her young career (this applies to us adults too). She must have the SELF-determination, SELF-discipline, SELF-drive, and so on in order to achieve their goal in life.
My wife and I told our son to decide on a career that he would truly enjoy doing. There is nothing worst than getting up in the morning going to work that you hate (I am sure there something else worse but please stay with me on this). We cannot be all like Tiger Woods, Kobe Bryant, or other stars that are paid millions of dollars playing the field of interest they enjoy the most. Our sons were not born on a silver platter and they must work on everything they want.
My oldest have this 25-year plan. I did not have the heart to tell him that my wife and I never had such a plan and still don't. His goal is high but is achievable. When we asked him two years ago on how he plan to get there? He said via the USAFA or USNA. When we asked him how he plan to get there, he said, stay in school, high GPA, high ACT/SAT scores, leadership, extra curricular stuff, etc.. He knows that smarts alone will not get him there. He needs to fill the right blocks to get there.
He just finished his first year in the USAFA and is in the honor roll. He is enjoying the challenges and opportunities at the USAFA.
Parenting will always be a challenge. Good luck and best wishes!
In Missouri at that time, I had to wait until my 16th birthday to take the test. Then, since I was only 16, I had to have a school counselor sign a letter stating that they approved it. Since I had not attended a public school for high school, I had to get a special waiver from the State Sec. of Education. Six months later I was allowed to take the test.
My scores were high enough that I was offered a full tuition scholarship to a junior college in the area and to the local state university. The only catch was that the state university required me to wait until I would have normally graduated.
I have never had to explain my GED to anyone. I have also never had any difficulty getting a job. In my early 20's I realized that I really enjoyed sales and have been doing it since.
Every situation is different, but it has never been an issue for me.
Mike