In order to participate in the GunBroker Member forums, you must be logged in with your GunBroker.com account. Click the sign-in button at the top right of the forums page to get connected.

.338 WIN MAG or .30-378 WEATHERBY MAG

instrumentofwarinstrumentofwar Member Posts: 1,545 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited January 2002 in General Discussion
just wanted to get some of your opinions on this pair. i'm looking into one for my upcoming move to alaska. i want something with enough "OOMPH" (like those technical terms?) for a coastal griz or moose, and the ability to download the load's for sheep or goats. i think better of using it on blacktail, whatever the load.
Rule #1: there is no easy wayRule #2: if,in fact, there is an easy way, it's mined (especially in Afghanistan or Kosovo!)
· Share on FacebookShare on Twitter

Comments

  • beachmaster73beachmaster73 Member Posts: 3,011 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Both are great but also look at the .338 Lapua. Slightly flatter trajectory might make the difference between a trophy at extreme range and a miss. Beach
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    As far as being versatile for a range of game weights, the 30-378 would be the best choice. The weights of bullets available in the .30 cal. allow all types of loading. The 30-378 is flatter than the 338win also. You don't need the 338 for the griz. It will kill it very effectively, however, so will a 200gr partition cruising at 3400fps out of a 26" barrel in 30-378. without a problem.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • idsman75idsman75 Member Posts: 13,398 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    instrumentofwar--Is it official? Is AK going to be your next home? You just KNOW that you-know-who and I are going to have to make it up there for a hunting excursion. I see that you are already spending that extra deployment money in your head. I did the same thing when I was in Honduras. You make me proud!
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • agloreaglore Member Posts: 6,012
    edited November -1
    338 win mag will be quite suffecient. Bullets from 160 graon to 310 grain. I have used one in Alaska off and on for the past 27 years, very good cartridge. The problem with the 30-378 is trying to find ammo in some bush village store after you forgot to pack yours from home. The 338 will be on almost every store shelf in Alaska.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • beachmaster73beachmaster73 Member Posts: 3,011 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Aglore....Very very good point. Beach
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • 5db5db Member Posts: 1,621 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    .338 Win. Mag.
    If you have one shot...Accu-Shot Website
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • R WallerR Waller Member Posts: 35 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    you guys read too many magazines, the 30-378 is NOT versatal, the 338 is, the 30-378 was designed strictly for the "horsepower wars" it is not a close range weapon, look at normal shooting ranges in alaska, which is better, a 22"-24" barrel 338 ? or a 30-378 w/ a 26"er ?? the 30-378 is best with a 30" barrel, do you really want one of those ?think bullet weights..now, if you want a weatherby, lets talk 340, now thats a gun designed for alaska,...
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    sorry guys, I'm young enough to tote the 30" barrel all day. Funny though, never had to track anything with a 30-378. I guess this is a mass vs bullet placement issue. I go for placement and it works for me, plus I like the range capability. If it's my last day in Alaska, Wyoming, etc, and I havn't got my bag yet, then big daddy steps out at 350-400yds, I trust that flat weatherby round to get their undaunted and on target.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • R WallerR Waller Member Posts: 35 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    the 30-378 shows little real world advantage at reasonable shooting ranges, I consider reasonable shooting ranges, based on my training and experience to be 400-500 meters. a 300 weatherby will do very nicely to that range, you cannot judge long distances close enough to make an ethical shot. 350-400 yards is nothing for any of the 300's, you certainly dont need a 30-378 to make a quarter mile shot.very few bullets will hold up to the velocity of a 30-378, the barnes X is about the only one up close,shoot a grizzly with a 200 grain partition @ 3400 fps during a 20 yard shot would totally fragmate on entry, kiss your @$$ goodbye.JustC, please tell me your not loading up a 30-378 with anything less the 180's??you shoot alot of 110 grain bullets ? do you know what blue streaking is ??Ross Seyfried extensively tested the 30-378 when it was formally introduced by weatherby, after many years of being a wildcat, his very educated opinion and experiences told him the 30-378 was best with a 30" barrel, problem is no one offers a 30" barrel for it from the factory.the question from instrumentofwar was, whats the best gun for alaska, between the two, the answer is, the 338 winchester. I have a 300, 340 and 30-378 weatherbys, i would carry the 340 in a heart beat over the 30-378 to alaska, bullet weight, frontal diameter will out penetrate our 30-378's and hit much harder. I would like to invite you over to the accurate reloader forum, please submit your ridicule of the 338 and the blind admiration of the 30-378 there, I will enjoy the blood bath to follow... we have several dozen posters from alaska, canada and africa, they will enjoy the debate. http://www.serveroptions.com/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/Ultimate.cgi?action=intro oh yea, the word for the day is:...overbore, look it up.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    R Waller, any 30cal mag should be loaded with at least 180gr bullets. My buddy likes the 150's in a 300winmag for crop damage but that's not the same. The 180's in the 30-378 for our crop damage shoots on whitetail (any distance you think you can shoot) are great. Laser rangefinders take out the guesswork nowadays. Balistic programs coupled with chrono's give excellent starting points for DOPE TAPES specific to your gun. That being said, PRACTICE!!! We shoot at all distances on the farm to be sure at those distances. Actually we don't go much past 400-450 on occasion. however, if you shoot this distance during the year, it stands to reason that you can do it during the season. This is of course with bench equipment which we build for every shooting blind. Anyone can go get the 300win or weatherby mag and be content with the 300yd potential. I have those calibers and I want more. More=further out kill power. Had the 20yd scenario been given a parameter, like where did the bullet hit, type of bullet, etc, the outcome would be different. I wouldn't shoot a large meat eater in the shoulder, and if I did, it would be with the Barnes 220gr SOLID. So much for the fragmentation theory. And I say, that 450yds IS ethical IF I am accurate at that distance. And where did you see 340 mentioned in the topic? Goes back to the placement issue. Anybody can get guys together who have killed large game with large calibers and say NAH NAH, yours isn't big enough. For every 900000000magnum kill picture you show me, I'll show you 2 whitetail kill pictures with a 22lr. Once again, back to the placement issue. Oh, I must have missed the part about AFRICA in the topic also. Imagine that, you have you own reloading manualoverbore- a term used to describe a case that has more capacity than it can effectivly use with normally available powders. Thought I didn't know that one huh? Let's see, when the experimentation was being done with the 30-378, in the 1950's, the powders weren't what they are today, thus the results of testing. however, anyone who feels that the first caliber to reach 5000 and even 6000fps in testing in the 50's, is lacking in some way, needs more reading time. As for the barrel, I don't recall the thread topic specifying a non-custom barrel. Also, who wants to use the 338, even downloaded, on a goat or sheep. I will take the flat shooter FOR THE QUESTION POSED!sorry for your confusion as to my purposes.[This message has been edited by JustC (edited 01-22-2002).]
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • 5db5db Member Posts: 1,621 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    JustC, you make a good argument for the 30-338. However, for the very reason aglore states; "The 338 will be on almost every store shelf in Alaska" the .338 Win Mag. is the gun to go.
    If you have one shot...Accu-Shot Website
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • agloreaglore Member Posts: 6,012
    edited November -1
    Wel let's see, I have 332 pictures of big game animals killed with Magnums. Si guess we get to see 664 pictures of whitetail killed with 22 lr. Hope they are all differnt animals.Don't remember who it was that did it, but do believe that the trajectory of a 30-06 with 180 grain bullets at 2700 FPS were only about 5 or 6 inches lower than the 30-378 WBY at 400-500 yards.Used to own a custom made 338-378 way before it became a factory round. It would not do anything that the 338 Win Mag would do, so I went back to the 338 Win Mag and saved money on powder. I was getting 3150 with 250 grain Nosler Partitions.Considering the fact that the majority of shots taken in Alaska are probably well under 300 yards with the exception of Caribou, the 338 is all that is needed. Take it from experience that speed does not kill, it's all in shot placement. With the bigger diameter of the 338, you can miss your point of aim by an inch or two and still harvest your animal.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • R WallerR Waller Member Posts: 35 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    well, for all practical purposes I believe aglore has ended this discussion with his logic.my point I'm have a hard time making to you on the 30-378 is, it aint better then any of the modern 300 mags, at any practical range,we're in total agreement with the 180 grain bullet for 300 mags, BUT you mentioned the large bullet selection for the 30 cals.but as my finale, if you think a 300 weatherby is just a 300 yarder, there is no reason to have this discussion, but it does explain why you have a 30-378 for deer hunting.[This message has been edited by R Waller (edited 01-23-2002).]
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    R Waller, I should have made the distinction between crop damage hunting and hunting season. Our crop damage shoots are summer season, long, long, shots. Like I said, If you think you are good enough at 1000yds, you have that option. If you think 1300yds, you have that one too. We plan to be able to cover, not totaly, but close to that distance in the years to come. As it stands we don't shoot past 450-500yds on any given day. But, when skill levels rise, the extra push will be needed to be deadly out there. Therefore, might as well get used to the rifles now instead of later. I wouldn't spend the $$$ for the 30-378 for hunting season shooting due to the fact that after they get shot at a few days, they retreat to the cover. This is now smaller caliber, lighter rifle territory as small elevated stands now must be used. My point hinges on the fact that downloading a 30-378 would be the better (IMO) round for the sheep and goats, while still being capable a large kills. If it were simply an issue of penetration and frontal mass, and not downloading for smaller North American game, then the only real choice is something starting with the number .4-- mag.al gore, I take it when you mentioned the 338-378 ownership before it was a factory round you were speaking of the 60's? 70's? I won't make any assumptions. However, the point about the caribou being 300+, were you saying you need a 338 for that distance on caribou? A member of our lodge shoots them with a .308 every year. He only owns a .308, as he is a smaller gentlemen and does not wish to shoot the magnums. Therefore, the 338 and 30-378 point are mute.I am not trying to sway anyone to buy a 30-378 or 338, I am simply adding another point of view. The simple answer is always, BIG BULLET. But, when applied correctly, other calibers are successful as well. I used to be a big bullet guy, until as some years passed, I saw numerous animals dropped in their tracks by calibers I had written off long ago. The older guys CAN teach you something, they sure did me. Got me started playing with my smaller stuff again and can't say I regret it.I am sure this will be seen as an argument instead of a debate with two opinions leading to the same end, and locked. therefore, I look forward to other threads, gentlemen.[This message has been edited by JustC (edited 01-23-2002).]
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • R WallerR Waller Member Posts: 35 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    oh, we're shooting bean fields, you should have said something, i was still hung up on alaska, in that case your shooting the cats meow, if i was doing anythjing over 600 yards, i would be doing a jarrett custom 30-378 w/ that 30" barrel i keep harping on and the laser range finder..did you go check out the accurate reloader forum ? you really should, there are several 1000 yd shooters there who would love to chat with a bro...
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • 13fister13fister Member Posts: 25 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    155mm shake n bake, if you need to down load just use the 81
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    R Waller, do you mean accuratereloading.com? I have pulled lots of various load data from that site. I like the custom barrels used for the data because lots of times I may have that twist rate and barrel length. I have been trying out a .280 ackley on these shoots, however, I got it finished after they were pretty much over and havn't had a chance to see the effects. I used a 27 1/2" contour .875 in that one. She is heavy, but in the bag, I can't tell it. I copied the data from that site but havn't had enough weather cooperation to try any new loads. The wind blows all winter on the Delmarva peninsula. Ocean on one side, chesapeake bay on the other. One of the guys at the lodge has the 30-378 markV accumark which I have shot quite a bit. He got one first, so I thought I would just use his until I made the decision on the caliber. I knew from the start mine would be built on a custom action/barrel/stock/trigger etc. I like building them just as much as shooting. I havn't decided weather or not to build my own, as I am worried about the erosion. I havn't seen any in his,yet, but I havn't pounded more than 5-7 boxes through it and can't determine any rate of "eat away" yet. Any thoughts from the guys? I figured I was smart testing the caliber on someone else's dime. Seems to be a real bad-a** so far. I have also heard that the lazeroni .30 is almost identicle. Is there any advantage to either, when I do build. Or should I just smoke em' with some sort of new wildcat I have dies cut for, like maybe a 338 ackley? I think, but am not sure, that Redding would cut them for me.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • simonbssimonbs Member Posts: 994 ✭
    edited November -1
    I'm enjoying this.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • R WallerR Waller Member Posts: 35 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    yes, the accurate reloader.com forum is http://www.serveroptions.com/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/Ultimate.cgi?action=intro you do know about the forum ??did you catch the video section ??
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    R waller, sorry it took me so long, I was in court all day yesterday. I did not know there was a video section. My computer at home is a piece of s@*t and it has problems with video and such. What's your thoughts about a BIG wildcat? Like a 338 ackley or something around that caliber? Can I push that big boy across the fields for crop shooting or would it only be a big game gun? If I could build a big game gun in a large bore but still use it for long crop shoots, I would be interested in any ideas the big bore guys have. I havn't ever hunted Africa or anything like that so the BIG stuff is still somewhat new compared to the 7mm's and .30's I have been using for some time now. What about a 340 with a 40degree shoulder?I just went to the forum, how do I get to the video section? I didn't see it listed.[This message has been edited by JustC (edited 01-25-2002).]
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • R WallerR Waller Member Posts: 35 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    video's..... http://www.accuratereloading.com/videos.html troll the forums, expecially the african and big game areas, the wealth of knowledge there is unsurpased on any forum ive ever seen... shoot me an email and we can chat later...randy@refugemail.combut, for real long range killing, your gonna have a hard time just equaling the 30-378 or the 338-378, forget about noticeabling exceeding them.... if i was doing the 500 yd+ shooting any more, i would be carrying one of them with a heavy X bullet, but thats just me.[This message has been edited by R Waller (edited 01-26-2002).]
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • idsman75idsman75 Member Posts: 13,398 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    13fister--155mm? Isn't that overkill? I wouldn't think that you would need anything above a 105mm. Correct me if I'm wrong. It's been a long time since I pulled the lanyard on a 105mm.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • robsgunsrobsguns Member Posts: 4,581 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    For what its worth, I use a .338 with only Barnes bullets, and I feel confident enough to use it in Alask, or Africa, I bought it after reading and reading and reading. I specificlly give a lot of credit to my decision to buy it to author Craig T. Boddington, from reading his books, and his accounts of game taken in Africa. It is a gun that, from his accounts, is extremely well suited to African game, right up to and including Elephant, but not legal for in a lot of countries. If it will handle Africa, it will handle Alaska, and with the 160 gr. Barnes, it will really get out there nicely. The notes about the .338 ammo being available everywhere you go holds a lot of water with me also. I'd get the .338, you wont be dissappointed. Rob.
    SSgt Ryan E. Roberts, USMC
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • 13fister13fister Member Posts: 25 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    idsman75 I picked the 155 over the 105 mainly because of the extra 6 miles or so of range.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Daddy2B8162Daddy2B8162 Member Posts: 70 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    insturmentofwar, I am debating the same issue that you are, not that I am moving to AK, but for the hunt...I was thinking hands down the 338 win or ultra, but then out came this new ultra mag big boy the 375 ultra mag..Blows away the 375 H&H, and when zero'd at 200 yds, is dropping 7" at 300 yds with a 270 gr swift a frame.. What I have been able to find to read on this , it will be great on the big and dangerous stuff, but not much on down loading for the smaller game. But since I have the 7mm mag and 300 win mag, I was not too conserned about the smaller game. Again, I know that the 375 ultra was not part of your original choices, but it may be something else that you want to look at...gun ownership, its not a priveledge, its our right
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • idsman75idsman75 Member Posts: 13,398 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    13fister---ah yes....6 miles. I can see where that would be useful in Alaska. I guess my experience has been limited hunting environments where only brush guns like the 105mm is suitable. Thank you for the info.NOTE: instrumentofwar is having network problems where he is at and is having a hard time getting through to GB. He thanks you for your input and will keep trying to connect.[This message has been edited by idsman75 (edited 01-27-2002).]
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • instrumentofwarinstrumentofwar Member Posts: 1,545 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    hey guys, thanks for all the help. i haven't been able to log on until today, so this has been the first chance to check out the thread. i'm leaning toward the .338 althouth daddy brings out a valid point about big greens new .375 UM. has anyone had any experience with the Alaskan Wilderness Rifle or the Mountain rifle from rem? the prices vary a good bit but most of their features sound pretty simmilar. at this price i'll probably go with the .338, 'cause it'll be a helluva lot cheaper to download than to get another rifle. (don't judge me too fast the better half has a LARGE say in this, she just wants me to get a "big bear" so we can have a bear skin rug...wink-wink). does anybody have any other exp. with a platform for this cal. has to be synthetic, and i am leaning toward a short barrel (from 22-24"). i'm currently eyeing those two from rem and winchester's harsh enviornment setup.
    The world is full of sheep, run with the wolves and make 'em call ya daddy
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • JustCJustC Member Posts: 16,056 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    cant go wrong with remington.
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Daddy2B8162Daddy2B8162 Member Posts: 70 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I like the Rem , but I am really starting to like my Browny A bolt.Insturmentowar, I have a pic from a buddies hunt to AK about a mth ago that you and the misses may like. If you are interested, just shoot me an e-mail at Daddy2B8162@cs.com and I'll forward it to you
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
Sign In or Register to comment.