Was the hero flight shot down over PA.?

guns-n-painthorses

I read on another thread that flight 93 (I think that was the #), was really shot down. Where did that come from?

Got Guns?

interstatepawnllc

Do bears void in the woods?

96harley

Will we ever know. If it was shot down what would have happened had it not been? A new era is dawning. Americans need to wake up.

Gordian Blade

The government keeps us in the dark and feeds us pure BS, no wonder rumors grow like mushrooms.

allen griggs

When Flight 800 went down off New York in 1996 there were all kinds of witnesses who saw an orange colored light flash up from the sea and hit the plane just before it exploded. I heard an interview with one witness, a Reserve fighter pilot, who had himself fired many air to air missles and who had seen many ground to air missles fired. He said it was a missle strike. The govt never came up with a satisfactory explanation for that crash and they have dismissed all the missle witnesses. That deal is fishy as hell. It does lead one to mistrust the govt. I have never heard of the shoot down theory of the Penn. crash, but if the govt thought it best to lie about it I am sure they would.

"Not as deep as a well, or as wide as a church door, but it is enough."

4GodandCountry

The size of the crater that the Penn. crash left would suggest that the plane was intact and impacted at a near 90 degree angle. If the plane was shot down it is likely that the fighters would have blown the plain out of the sky and the debree would have been scattered accross the ground and left little or no impact crater.

When Clinton left office they gave him a 21 gun salute. Its a damn shame they all missed....

offeror

Supposedly 800 was far too high an altitude to be reached by a ground missile, certainly anything shoulder fired.

As far as 93 is concerned, the rumor comes from speculation about 2 things. One, there was apparently a small separate debris field some distance from the hole in the ground, and two, we know fighters had been dispatched to interdict the plane, but have always been told they were still too far away to have made contact because they had been dispatched from near-coastal locations.

- Life NRA Member
"If cowardly & dishonorable men shoot unarmed men with army guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary...and not by general deprivation of constitutional privilege." - Arkansas Supreme Court, 1878

Gordian Blade

I have read an extensive article in an engineering journal about TWA 800 with supporting evidence for a fuel vapor explosion touched off by faulty wiring. Physical evidence points to the location and cause of the explosion. There is no physical evidence for a missile in what was released to the public. Nobody can disprove the missile/conspiracy theory (or any conspiracy theory for that matter), but a lot of people would have to be involved to keep it secret.

guns-n-painthorses

Just how bad would the airlines have suffered if the truth did get out about 800. I mean, lets face it, if word got out that someone had the capability to shoot down planes, would you fly? Hell no! Cover it up at all cost. Is that what happened, I don't know, but the guy on TV also told me we could take a trolly to never ever land, or some crap like that. Belive half of what you see and none of what you hear.


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dads-freehold

greetings, governments are notorious for keeping people in the dark or lying to them, not only that but different branches lye to each other. but even more diabolical is the half truth, deseption with enough truth to be believed, or at least seem reasonable. there used to be an old saying " if you walk in to a room with a group of people look around and see if you can find the stooge, if you can't , guess why you where invited?" respt. submitted dads-freehold

rodney colson

competentone

I hadn't heard the suggestion about 93 being shot down; anybody have a link about it? I think there could be a problem with a shoot-down theory, considering the calls the passengers were making to their loved ones. The calls/events are consistent with the cockpit voice recordings.

As for Flight 800; that was a "directed energy" weapon experiment that "went bad". The target drone was fired (that's "the missile" the witnesses saw), the weapon system just locked on to Flight 800 instead of the drone--the whole event happened "at the speed of light", quite literally. The government is "telling the truth" to the extent that: No missile was fired in the area. (It was a target drone.) And the plane did have a fuel tank explosion. (They don't tell you the fuel was superheated by the "directed energy" that hit the plane.)

The world of propaganda is a funny place--the government is actually supporting some of the web sites dedicated to "the missle theory" for flight 800. It hides the real truth and satisfies those who know "the official explanations" are lacking.

Wild Turkey

My brother in law was deeply involved in trying to release all the information about the "Roswell Incident." He's a historian, and really wanted to make sure that every rumor/report was tracked to its source.

Hasn't slowed it down a bit. Some people want to believe something and will ignore any facts necessary to hold to their belief.

I heard the report about the smoke trail from flight 800 -- it was the front part of the plane going down while the wings kept the rest up until it disintigrated. Eyes and minds will play tricks on us.

What I find really funny is that for some of these "cover ups" to work a lot of people would have to keep a lot of secrets.

Ain't worked yet!

just my too scents!

Wild Turkey"if your only tool is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail"

Highball

Some of you folks really need to study history a little better.Keeping secrets indeed won't last forever...just until your masters don't need to any more.....

God,Guts,& GunsHave we lost all 3 ??

Iconoclast

Wild Turkey . . . as to secrets, Lee Harvey Oswald shot JFK, right? All the contrary evidence, even the later House investigation which refuted the Warren Commission, was buried on the back pages. In time, people forget or lose interest. Waco and flammable tear gas. Never happened. Vince Foster committed suicide. Right. Etc. Personally, I don't think Flight 93 was shot down by the government. The debris and the phone calls are strong circumstantial evidence in support of the official story. And probably Flight 800 is as reported. But I wouldn't accept the conclusions of *any* government report at face value without a large helping of salt.

Highball

Please explain to me how phone calls from passengers 'prove ' that the flight was'nt shot down ?
Wouldn't it be ironic if that flight was actually in the hands of the real militia when it was shot down ? The real militia is ordinary citizens,just for the uninformed amongth us.....

God,Guts,& GunsHave we lost all 3 ??

alledan

Fighters from the 185th tactical fighter group here in Fulton county Ohio were dispatched to the Penn. area. Whether they made it or not I wouldn't know.

Nighthawk

I thought the same thing Highball but the Goverment could have edited the phone calls to make them sound the way they wanted.Dont get me wrong each and every American who died on thatnot one died in vane,except the Highjackers.IT pulled America together,brought prayer to our schools.In NY you didnt speak to anyone for fear they would cut your throat.Now strangers hug each other,and our Nations Military wanted to go after BIN Ladden.I just hope we dont forget and go back to our old snobish ways.

Best!!!

Rugster

salzo

I rmemeber the day that plane went down in PA, immediately after there was speculation and rumors that the plane was shot down. It seemed that the speculation stopped, only after the governent claimed that was not the case(if the government says so, then it must be true).And what better way for the government to void this speculation, then to portray the people on the flight as heroes who brought the plane down.Americans would much rather believe that the downing of the plane was the results of heroism, rather than being shot down.And the "hero" angle would certain deflect attention from the possibility that it was shot down. Who would want to smear the heroism of those on the plane with speculation that the plane was shot down.
I dont know enough about the evidence, but it would not suprise me that the government shot it down, and that they covered it up afterwards.
Remember that Bush and his buddies did say that they would shoot a hijacked plane down(but would not arm pilots).And if anything would cause the government to shoot a plane down,it would be the fact it was heading for the whitehouse.

"The powers delegated by the proposed constitution to the federal governmentare few and defined, and will be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace negotiation, and foreign commerce"
-James Madison

dads-freehold

greetings, i agree that any thing the government tells us should be taken in the context of the lies it has been caught in. the ministry of truth may not be forth coming with the facts and when they say that it is a matter of national security, it may be decades before the facts are presented to the people. your government don't trust you why shoud you trust it? respt submitted dads-freehold

rodney colson

Big Sky Redneck

I don't live far from where the plane went down here in PA and I can tell you this, we are less than 200 air miles from DC. Now correct me if I'm wrong but air to air missles can be fired at 200 miles, some further some shorter. I remember watching the deal on TV and when the plane was reported hijacked the cameras where in DC showing the evacuation, they then reported that fighters had "scrambled" from the area. Now those planes can cover alot of ground fast and if the missles can be fired at that distance, the chances are very very possible it could have been shot. Would the plane blow to pieces when hit? Maybe, maybe not. it is something we will never know. I wondered the same thing because the time frame fromo when the fighters left to the time it went down was only around 15 minutes. We have Navy fighters flying over here all the time running the mountains to Raystown Lake and back. They can be at Raystown from Norfolk VA in 25 minutes. Raystown Lake is not very far from the crash site.



Edited by - 7mm nut on 08/04/2002 12:05:22

Varmintmist

Sidewinders are about 5 mi
Amrams 25 mi approx
no 200 mi missles air to air, mud to air, maybe

I dont think it was shot down, but for arguments sake.....

Ok, it was shot down. Whats the point? I hate to be callous, but that day the death toll was already estimated at 10K people. That plane could have been in DC in what? 20-25 min? Pittsburgh in 15 or less? Even Harrisburg was closer than that. If it was shot down, it was probably a good call. Armchair Qback if you want. Think about how many that missle might have saved.

Those people who see nothing but grey areas, no black and white, are lost in the fog.

Gordian Blade

It's really a shame that in the past (and present) politicians have so abused our trust that we can't rely on what they say. This rumor will never die. If you believe it, you have to believe that it was purely a coincidence that Flt 93 went down just minutes after the passengers decided to take on the hijackers, this is known by cell phone conversations. You also have to believe that the air traffic controllers are in on the conspiracy, since they would have seen the fighters and missiles on radar.

As I recall, the longest range air-to-air missile commonly carried by U.S. warplanes is the AIM-54 Phoenix Missile carried by the F-14 Tomcat. ("Top Gun") It has a listed max range of somewhat over 100 nautical miles and was designed to meet the cold war threat of massed Russian bombers launching anti-ship missiles at U.S. carrier groups. The Phoenix achieves that range by going very high, then "gliding" (like a rock) into the target. I don't believe that type would be carried by the F-16s that were scrambled on 9/11; they would have had the shorter-range missiles previously mentioned. http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/factfile/missiles/wep-phoe.html

allen griggs

Salzo, well put. The govt. would lie to play up the hero angle and then no one could blame the govt for dead civilians, also stops chance of lawsuits {govt. kills innocent passengers}. However, the plane should have been shot down and had I been in charge I would have ordered it shot down. I want to know why some of the others werent shot down. You may remember, under Clinton a Cessna deliberately crashed into the White House, pilot killed, no one else hurt. The Secret Service showed two agents on the roof with Stingers. The Secret Service said, don't worry, we have this building protected by Stingers. Yeah, Stingers my *. I bet, fifteen minutes after the Cessna hit the Secret Service chief said, Get down to the basement and unpack some of those Stingers and get up on the roof before CNN gets here.

"Not as deep as a well, or as wide as a church door, but it is enough."

Big Sky Redneck

I wasnt 100% sure about the range but I do remember one of the discovery shows that had long range missles being fired from aircraft.

But I do have to wonder, what difference does it make if that plane was shot down?

Highball

'What difference does it make' ?????
A guv. by the people,for the people...the president walks up to the plate and says.."My fellow Americans,today I made a decision which will cause me grief for the rest of my life...to preserve innocent life on the ground,and possible catrstropic damage,I ordered an American passenger jet shot down.I accept full responsibilty."
People like me would have deep and abiding respect for that man.
Why would it be difficult to believe that the plane was in the hands of the passengers..and the message not getting thru the channels in time to prevent that missile.
After all,shooting the plane down was the only viable thing to do,giving the info extant....

God,Guts,& GunsHave we lost all 3 ??