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-----sales tax for interstate gun purchase-------

moredesmoredes Member Posts: 53 ✭✭
edited November 2001 in General Discussion
Guys, I need some help! I had a gun shipped from Michigan to an FFL in California. The FFL holder wouldn't release the gun until I paid tax on it ($192!!). He just ignored me when I cited examples--Amazon.com, Ebay, etc. He said I was "just getting away with it". Does anyone have a link to documentation that proves interstates sales (specific to guns if possible) are not taxable?Thanks very much.
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  • AntiqueDrAntiqueDr Member Posts: 691 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    That's a state-law thing. Check with whatever agency is responsible for collecting sales tax in California.
    We buy, sell and trade quality guns and scopes!Ask us about Shepherd Scopes!Visit our website at www.ApaxEnterprises.com
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  • moredesmoredes Member Posts: 53 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Thanks, Doctor, I know--In PRK, it would be the State Board of Equalization, but I've been at their site for a couple of hours and can't find anything remotely related. I found plenty of news reports, etc. about the Governor's actions, but nothing directly from BOE that swings either way.I'm hoping someone in the state has had to deal with an * like this, and can help me.
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  • salzosalzo Member Posts: 6,396 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Technically, depending on the state law, you are supposed to pay sales tax, even when you order something from another state. And with the heavy regulation of guns, I am sure the states will make the extra effort to make sure no one tries to get away with not paying sales tax.I bought something via mail order from another state, and when I got the invoice I saw Pennsylvania sales tax. I always thought that you did not have to pay sales tax on an item purchased from another state(a constitutional misunderstanding on my part). I called the company, and they said they had an agreement with my state to collect sales tax. I called my state and asked them why I had to pay sales tax. They informed me that you alweays have to pay sales tax on out of state purchases. He told me I am supposed to send the state a check for the sales tax amount. I got kind of loud, and told him I purchase items all of the time and have never been required to pay sales tax.He asked me what my phone number was.I hung up the phone.
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  • gruntledgruntled Member Posts: 8,218 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    This is the answer I recieved when I asked that question.First off, please refer to Publication 110, "California Use Tax Basics". It describes how California residents may be liable for use tax when they purchase items from out of state. It is a generic document and pertains to all types of tangible personal property (firearms included). Here's a link to download the publication: http://www.boe.ca.gov/pdf/pub110.pdf California customers wishing to report Use Tax Liabilities may do so with Publication 79-B, "California Individual Use Tax". Here's a link to download the publication: http://www.boe.ca.gov/pdf/pub79b.pdf If you wish to provide copies of this publication as a courtesy to your clients purchasing firearms from out of state (where you are only filing paperwork through the California Department of Justice...and not a retailer of the firearm), please feel free to provide them with a hard copy of Publcation 79-B. If you are considered the reatailer of the firearm, then you must collect sales tax on the transaction. If you are acting in the capacity of submitting the paperwork (to meet the State and Federal requirements)on behalf of a separate buyer and seller, you generally would not be liable for the sales tax on the sale. Please read on:Per Sales and Use Tax Annotation 295.1675.600: "It all depends upon whether the the company is the retailer of the firearm. If an the owner of the firearm and a purchaser have negotiated the terms of the sale in advance and then bring the firearm to the company to meet the statutory requirements of the Penal Code, the company is not the retailer of the gun and does not owe any tax...for the firearm. If, however, an owner of a firearm brings the the gun to the company and requests the company to find a buyer, the company is the consignee and retailer of the firearm, and is liable for sales tax on the sale"If you are not selling the firearm on a consignment basis, but are only helping to transact the sale between the out of State seller and the California buyer(in order to meet State and Federal Statutes), you should not be liable for any sales or use tax on that sale. Hopefully, I have answered your questions. If you have any questions regarding a specific transaction, feel free to address them to this website.Thank you for contacting the Board of Equalization with your inquiry. If you have further questions please e-mail us again or call the Information Center at (800) 400-7115, Monday through Friday, 8AM to 5PM (Pacific Standard Time). We wish you success in your endeavors. Thank You, RZ
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  • moredesmoredes Member Posts: 53 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Guys,Thanks very much. I think I've got enough to go on here. Gruntled, I appreciate your copying the communique verbatim. Do you mind posting the email address of the BOE contact so I may question them directly? Thanks a lot.
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  • gruntledgruntled Member Posts: 8,218 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    My copy shows I sent the E-Mail to:cats_web@boe.ca.gov The reply came from +CATS Web Requests
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  • moredesmoredes Member Posts: 53 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Gruntled,Thanks a lot! I'm just gonna ask them the same question and print the answer and take it to the FFL holder and hope for the best. "If you are not selling the firearm on a consignment basis, but are only helping to transact the sale between the out of State seller and the California buyer(in order to meet State and Federal Statutes), you should not be liable for any sales or use tax on that sale." This seems pretty definitive to me, I just need it from the source, so it doesn't look like I pulled it off a forum. Thanks very much. I've still got another 2 guns in transit (they were sent 4 days before my meeting with this FFL holder). I'm about to lose ~$400 over this, so I really appreciate your help.
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  • nunnnunn Forums Admins, Member, Moderator Posts: 36,078 ******
    edited November -1
    In Texas, there is no tax on a purchase made out of state. There is tax on services. Therefore, when a buyer has a gun shipped to me, he pays no tax on the purchase, but he pays tax on my transfer fee.
    Certified SIG pistol armorer/FFL Dealer/Full time Peace Officer, Moderator of the General Discussion Board on Gunbroker. Visit www.gunbroker.com, the premier gun auction site on the Net! Email davidnunn@texoma.net Jesus is Lord!
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  • badboybobbadboybob Member Posts: 1,658 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    How things have changed Nunn. When I was in Texas in the early sixties there was no sales tax. It was a great place to live, and likely still is. But a sales tax on service? What ever happened to that great state?
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  • moredesmoredes Member Posts: 53 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Found it! If anyone else in the PRK needs this, go to this link: http://www.boetaxes.ca.gov/business/vol2/annotat/suta-d-g.pdf go to the end of the .pdf file, ( the " >| " symbol in lower left corner) page 188, then backtrack 3 pages to page 185 (using the " < " symbol). Find "Sales and Use Tax Annotation 295.1675.600". [This message has been edited by moredes (edited 11-25-2001).]
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  • M.OpaliskiM.Opaliski Member Posts: 244 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Delaware - Tax Free
    Support your RKBA ... MatthewNRA Life MemberTalk Radio Junkie opaliski@hotmail.com TheFirearmsEnthusiast
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  • gskyhawkgskyhawk Member Posts: 4,773
    edited November -1
    Here's what I do when shipping a firearm out of state, send the receipt direct to the buyer and then in with the firearm just put who the firearm is for, their address and phone number and the information about myself that the dealer would need for the transfer
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  • moredesmoredes Member Posts: 53 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Yeah, my bad luck to run into such an *. The invoices listed me as the buyer, and the package was addressed to me, c/o FFL holder. The receipt was inside the box, and listed my name and address only. Still this jerk wouldn't let go the merch without my paying taxes. Unfortunately, I ended up paying for the second shipment also, so now I have to go back and fight for the whole $400.
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  • nunnnunn Forums Admins, Member, Moderator Posts: 36,078 ******
    edited November -1
    My question is, how does the dealer even know what you paid? Sometimes there is an invoice, but I don't even look at it, just hand it to the customer. It is his after all. Many times, I have no idea what the sale price was.I have lived in Texas since December, 1952. I remember sales tax starting at about 2% when I was just a little kid, late 50s or early 60s. Back then, an item priced at .98 became a buck even with tax. Sales tax has expanded to services, but there is still none on groceries or medicine. No state income tax though.
    Certified SIG pistol armorer/FFL Dealer/Full time Peace Officer, Moderator of the General Discussion Board on Gunbroker. Visit www.gunbroker.com, the premier gun auction site on the Net! Email davidnunn@texoma.net Jesus is Lord!
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  • idsman75idsman75 Member Posts: 13,398 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Next time, ask your seller to send the receipt to you via USPS separately and don't include it with the gun. That way, the receiving dealer doesn't know how much to charge you. Tell him it was a gift from a friend and that the "friend" already paid the sales tax. I haven't paid sales tax on a gun from GB yet.
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  • moredesmoredes Member Posts: 53 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Next time?? Next time?? Momma may have raised an @sshole, but she didn't raise no fool. I ain't evah goin' back there again.
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  • cbxjeffcbxjeff Member Posts: 17,597 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Bogus. As the other guys have said, this dealer is not selling you anything - just taking care of the paperwork (which you pay him to do). Anyone wonder how much of that $192. the state would ever see?
    cbxjeffIt's too late for me, save yourself.
    It's too late for me, save yourself.
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