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Got Some Heat Over This From U Guys, But..........
tr fox
Member Posts: 13,856
On one of the topics I brought up the fact that I have some worries about shooting foreign govt. military surplus guns and ammo. I think the particular gun I mentioned was a Russian Mosin Nagant made in the 1940's and I was going to try and shot 7.62x54Russian ammo made in Czechoslovakia in the 1960's. I expressed my worries that there could be a possiblilty of injury here. I got some chuckles from the other posters and one even used the term "chicken little" which I assume was directed at me. And this is all ok, because I usually have a good sense of humor regardless of whether the humor is directed at me or at others. But out of consideration of others on this forum, and especially since I have been urging people to take advantage (and encourage their friends to take advantage) of the low, low prices on foreign military surplus guns and ammo, I thought I should come back and post a more specific warning.
When purchasing and shooting a foreign military surplus gun, you have no idea what condition that gun is really in. Maybe the bore was machined slightly too small for the bullet, or the headspacing is way too loose, or maybe the lands are started too close to the bullet when seated, etc. Anyone of these defects can cause the gun to "blow up" in your face. Remember that you have a firearm that was manufactured decades ago in a foreign country by people and conditions which you have no knowledge of.
You also have no knowledge about the mil. surplus ammo. Maybe it was loaded with a double charge, or sabatoged, etc.
So, bottom line, even if you or a gunsmith check the gun out, (headspace gauge, etc.) please do as I did and find someway to shoot at least 5 rounds through the gun WITH THE GUN BEING SEVERAL FEET AWAY FROM YOUR FACE! And EVEN IF THE GUN FIRES FINE carefully check out the spent cartiridge and look for bulged cases (espically around the case head area) or primers pushing out, etc. You, and the people you care about standing nearby only have one set of eyes and only one face. If you agree and need more info, please ask. JMHO.
Quote "When guns were invented everything changed. For the first time in the history of the world a frail woman had a chance to sucessfully defend herself and home. My dream is that one of the anti-gun nuts will need a gun for defense and be unable to have one because of their own actions."
When purchasing and shooting a foreign military surplus gun, you have no idea what condition that gun is really in. Maybe the bore was machined slightly too small for the bullet, or the headspacing is way too loose, or maybe the lands are started too close to the bullet when seated, etc. Anyone of these defects can cause the gun to "blow up" in your face. Remember that you have a firearm that was manufactured decades ago in a foreign country by people and conditions which you have no knowledge of.
You also have no knowledge about the mil. surplus ammo. Maybe it was loaded with a double charge, or sabatoged, etc.
So, bottom line, even if you or a gunsmith check the gun out, (headspace gauge, etc.) please do as I did and find someway to shoot at least 5 rounds through the gun WITH THE GUN BEING SEVERAL FEET AWAY FROM YOUR FACE! And EVEN IF THE GUN FIRES FINE carefully check out the spent cartiridge and look for bulged cases (espically around the case head area) or primers pushing out, etc. You, and the people you care about standing nearby only have one set of eyes and only one face. If you agree and need more info, please ask. JMHO.
Quote "When guns were invented everything changed. For the first time in the history of the world a frail woman had a chance to sucessfully defend herself and home. My dream is that one of the anti-gun nuts will need a gun for defense and be unable to have one because of their own actions."
Comments
81st FA BN WWII...Thanks Dad
U!S!A! ALL THE WAY!!
"Been around the world and seen that only stupid people are breeding.The cretins cloning and feeding,and I don't even own a T.V."---Harvey Danger
Generally milsurps are safe to shoot. They tend to be high quality, you have to remember, these rifles were made by people who knew that the survival of their country was at stake.
In the case of the Mosin Nagant, if the Czar's manager of the Tula Armory started cranking out rifles that blew up, that manager was gonna get a firing squad. In later years, Stalin's manager at Tula knew damn well he better not screw up. After all every rifle was marked with the Tula stamp, and the date.
The Mosin Nagant is a very robust action.
Milsurps from countries that we don't associate as having quality manufacturing, like Chile, are still ok, because they got Germany to make the rifles for them.
The milsurps that I have heard of that had problem are Spanish made rifles that were converted to the CETME cartridge. This cartridge is a mild version of the 7.62 Nato, and the same size as the .308. These rifles develop problems when firing .308 due to excess pressure.
I double load it, propping it up or sticking it into an old tire, tying a string to the trigger to set it off. I always do this twice, inspecting it for any damage to make sure it's ok.
"If they won't give us good terms, come back and we'll fight it out."
-- Gen. James Longstreet
Heat?! I can tell you about HEAT! I look like Wiley Coyote in the Roadrunner cartoon...all chared and smoking after the cannon he was looking down went off.
Rafter-S (who just took care of a little business)[;)]
The same goes for the rifles. These guns are graded in the catalog excellent, very good, good, fair and gunsmith specials. The dealer should be able to communicate that to a buyer as well. But I'm not disagreeing with you here either. In fact I supported somebody recently who contemplated shooting an old rifle by means of a string initially. It's a common practice with surplus guns. Not everyone has a competent, reasonably priced gunsmith close at hand, so many of us must do the detective work ourselves on $50-$90 rifles.
T. Jefferson: "[When doing Constitutional interpretation], let us [go] back to the time when [it] was adopted. [Rather than] invent a meaning [let us] conform to the probable one in which it was passed."
Quote "When guns were invented everything changed. For the first time in the history of the world a frail woman had a chance to sucessfully defend herself and home. My dream is that one of the anti-gun nuts will need a gun for defense and be unable to have one because of their own actions."
How you doin'!
Quote "When guns were invented everything changed. For the first time in the history of the world a frail woman had a chance to sucessfully defend herself and home. My dream is that one of the anti-gun nuts will need a gun for defense and be unable to have one because of their own actions."
When I get a gun, even a new one I completely tear it down and inspect it, if I see something that don't look right I have a couple pro's that I can go to and I will. Of course I've got many years of experience, some formal "smith" training and some informal.
When I buy surplus ammo and break down a couple rounds to inspect the powder, weigh out the charge, etc. I have seen some grade A crap over the years and personally shy away from the unknown, ultra cheap stuff.
Please, just use your head ... don't take that $49.95 milsup out of the box, peak down the barrel and grab a $3.00 box of mystery ammo to dash off and start blasting. Check things out, especially the firearm as that is what contains the exposive device that is only inches from your face.
If you only have time to do two things so-so, or one thing well ... do the one thing!
Quote "When guns were invented everything changed. For the first time in the history of the world a frail woman had a chance to sucessfully defend herself and home. My dream is that one of the anti-gun nuts will need a gun for defense and be unable to have one because of their own actions."
dheffley: can you tell us why the handgun blew up in your face? (glad you had no permanent injuries). The info might save one of our brother/sister shooters.
Quote "When guns were invented everything changed. For the first time in the history of the world a frail woman had a chance to sucessfully defend herself and home. My dream is that one of the anti-gun nuts will need a gun for defense and be unable to have one because of their own actions."
I bought a used handgun (.45 ACP 1911 Clone, parts gun) from a local pawn shop. As I recall, I gave $125 for it in 1975. Took it to my local gun range at the time (Garland Public Shooting Range) and proceeded to test fire it. I had shot around 30 rounds of ammunition through it. The first 25 or so rounds went OK, but the last magazine had started moving around. I went to a block rest position and fired one more time to see if I could tell where I was hitting. I actually saw the split second that the thing came apart in my hand, and didn't feel the impact of the slide on my face. As it turned out, someone had taken a torch cut slide and welded it back together, then re-machined it and nickel plated it to cover it up. The slide broke in half and the rear piece took out my safety glasses and my corrective lenses which were luckly plastic lenses. Eight stitches in the eyebrow, a very large knot on the forehead, and a few cuts on the hand.
That is why I will either fix a bad gun or disassemble it and sell it for parts rather than "dump" it at the next gunshow the way a lot of people do. I actually rebuilt that gun and still have it. The difference is, I did the job correctly rather than half *.
Honesty matters when it comes to dealing with guns, but we must remember there are a lot of dishonest folks in the world, and some of the deal in guns.
How you doin'!
Quote "When guns were invented everything changed. For the first time in the history of the world a frail woman had a chance to sucessfully defend herself and home. My dream is that one of the anti-gun nuts will need a gun for defense and be unable to have one because of their own actions."
Had a 22 pistol I used for trapping in highschool. The above combination turned out very dangerous. 2 shells went off at the same time and one down the barrel and gone the other the front side of the frame and back at me. Shrapnel cut my lip and stung. Had no idea how bad it was until I got the the mirror on my trusty Trail 90 bike and saw it only grazed me. Took a LONG time to heal. Traded the gun off for a recurve bow and told the dealer the story of what happened so they could fix it or junk it before it went into someone elses hands. Taught me an important lesson.
Quote "When guns were invented everything changed. For the first time in the history of the world a frail woman had a chance to sucessfully defend herself and home. My dream is that one of the anti-gun nuts will need a gun for defense and be unable to have one because of their own actions."