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Guns in Virginia state parks
Josey1
Member Posts: 9,598 ✭✭
Guns in Virginia state parks
Virginia Attorney General Jerry Kilgore is considering whether to allow Virginians who are lawfully entitled to carry concealed weapons - and who, in order to get their permits, have already undergone both extensive background checks as well as gun-safety courses - to do so in state parks. Currently, it is unlawful even for those who are entitled to carry concealed weapons to carry them into state parks. Gun control special-interest groups and the state's Department of Conservation and Recreation oppose the idea of lifting the ban, and are urging Mr. Kilgore to issue a formal opinion in favor of retaining it. "More guns in state parks will mean more gun deaths and injuries," said Lorraine Price of the Million Mom March, one of the gun-control groups lobbying Mr. Kilgore to retain the ban. Republican lawmakers, including Delegate Richard Black of Loudoun County, have stated they will push for passage of a law to lift the ban in next year's session of the General Assembly. Kilgore spokesman Tim Murtaugh said in mid-August that the attorney general would "make his decision based on the law and nothing else."
Well, the law says that any Virginia resident who files the appropriate forms, passes a thorough background check and undergoes the specified gun-safety training is entitled to carry a concealed handgun. And while there are some reasonable restrictions - firearms may not be taken into courts or government buildings, etc. - it doesn't make any sense at all that trained and thoroughly vetted people should not be allowed to carry their firearms into parks, where there is a more than passing chance that they may encounter a would-be rapist or other thug. The backwoods trails and dense cover of parks provide a perfect setting for an attack or abduction. Women are especially vulnerable. There are no 911 call boxes in most parks, and park rangers are often miles away.
Seneca Park in Loudoun County, for example, has miles of trails where one can hike for hours without encountering another soul. Rangers patrol infrequently, and the area is so rural that an attack could easily be carried out without anyone hearing a thing. In such a circumstance, it is very much the case that the only thing standing between another victim lying in a pool of blood - or another unsolved "missing persons" report - is that potential victim's ability to defend himself. In the case of women being assaulted by typically much more powerful male offenders, the availability of a handgun for self-defense becomes all the more determinative. Who would deny women and other park-goers the ability to defend themselves - and on what basis?
The tired old line trotted out by gun-control advocates that "guns kill" - and that the mere presence of firearms will result in a Wild West-style shoot-'em-up - is silly demagoguery that won't bear intelligent scrutiny. The possession of firearms by law-abiding people has never resulted in gun-violence. It is and always has been the criminal element - people who do not apply for permits, or take firearms safety courses, or buy their guns retail for that matter - who cause the problems. It is they, not law-abiding citizens who have already passed extensive checks and gun-safety courses - who need to be "controlled."
Mr. Kilgore should support the right of ordinary citizens to self-defense, especially in parks - where they are unusually vulnerable. The mere fact that people walking alone in the woods might be armed is a deterrent all by itself. (The deterrent effect of concealed-carry laws has been demonstrated time and again by such as criminologist John Lott.) In the final analysis, nothing should trump the right of law-abiding citizens to self-defense via the exercise of their Second Amendment rights. The law should concern itself with criminals - not with hamstringing the rights of the law-abiding.
http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20020821-655268.htm
"If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege." - Arkansas Supreme Court, 1878
Virginia Attorney General Jerry Kilgore is considering whether to allow Virginians who are lawfully entitled to carry concealed weapons - and who, in order to get their permits, have already undergone both extensive background checks as well as gun-safety courses - to do so in state parks. Currently, it is unlawful even for those who are entitled to carry concealed weapons to carry them into state parks. Gun control special-interest groups and the state's Department of Conservation and Recreation oppose the idea of lifting the ban, and are urging Mr. Kilgore to issue a formal opinion in favor of retaining it. "More guns in state parks will mean more gun deaths and injuries," said Lorraine Price of the Million Mom March, one of the gun-control groups lobbying Mr. Kilgore to retain the ban. Republican lawmakers, including Delegate Richard Black of Loudoun County, have stated they will push for passage of a law to lift the ban in next year's session of the General Assembly. Kilgore spokesman Tim Murtaugh said in mid-August that the attorney general would "make his decision based on the law and nothing else."
Well, the law says that any Virginia resident who files the appropriate forms, passes a thorough background check and undergoes the specified gun-safety training is entitled to carry a concealed handgun. And while there are some reasonable restrictions - firearms may not be taken into courts or government buildings, etc. - it doesn't make any sense at all that trained and thoroughly vetted people should not be allowed to carry their firearms into parks, where there is a more than passing chance that they may encounter a would-be rapist or other thug. The backwoods trails and dense cover of parks provide a perfect setting for an attack or abduction. Women are especially vulnerable. There are no 911 call boxes in most parks, and park rangers are often miles away.
Seneca Park in Loudoun County, for example, has miles of trails where one can hike for hours without encountering another soul. Rangers patrol infrequently, and the area is so rural that an attack could easily be carried out without anyone hearing a thing. In such a circumstance, it is very much the case that the only thing standing between another victim lying in a pool of blood - or another unsolved "missing persons" report - is that potential victim's ability to defend himself. In the case of women being assaulted by typically much more powerful male offenders, the availability of a handgun for self-defense becomes all the more determinative. Who would deny women and other park-goers the ability to defend themselves - and on what basis?
The tired old line trotted out by gun-control advocates that "guns kill" - and that the mere presence of firearms will result in a Wild West-style shoot-'em-up - is silly demagoguery that won't bear intelligent scrutiny. The possession of firearms by law-abiding people has never resulted in gun-violence. It is and always has been the criminal element - people who do not apply for permits, or take firearms safety courses, or buy their guns retail for that matter - who cause the problems. It is they, not law-abiding citizens who have already passed extensive checks and gun-safety courses - who need to be "controlled."
Mr. Kilgore should support the right of ordinary citizens to self-defense, especially in parks - where they are unusually vulnerable. The mere fact that people walking alone in the woods might be armed is a deterrent all by itself. (The deterrent effect of concealed-carry laws has been demonstrated time and again by such as criminologist John Lott.) In the final analysis, nothing should trump the right of law-abiding citizens to self-defense via the exercise of their Second Amendment rights. The law should concern itself with criminals - not with hamstringing the rights of the law-abiding.
http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20020821-655268.htm
"If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege." - Arkansas Supreme Court, 1878
Comments
By TED COHEN, Portland Press Herald Writer
Copyright c 2002 Blethen Maine Newspapers Inc.
E-mail this story to a friend
ADVERTISEMENT
KITTERY - A controversial referendum to ban hunting in the 72-acre Town Farm Forest was soundly defeated Tuesday.
The vote was 1,093 to 396.
"I think we have made our point," said Town Councilor Mark Sousa, among those in favor of hunting in the forest. Residents had voted against changing the ordinance that governs the forest on two previous occasions.
Nancy Bogenberger, a member of Kittery Wildlife Friends, was upset by the results. "Evil thrives when good men do nothing, and I think the people of Kittery did nothing," she said.
Members of Kittery Wildlife Friends, led by Sue Johnson, had gathered more than 900 valid signatures in June in their effort to overturn the hunting ordinance.
The proposal put them at odds with local hunters and state wildlife officials, who said an abundance of deer in southern Maine poses a threat to local residents.
Lyme disease and automobile accidents involving deer would increase if another town in southern Maine closed a hunting zone, they said.
People who live near the forest supported the referendum, saying they felt threatened by the presence of hunters armed with rifles with a range of nearly a mile.
Bogenberger attributed the defeat to a poor turnout by the town's non-hunters, who are a vast majority of the population.
Among those voting against the referendum was John Eisfeller, a young father and avid hunter. "There's only so much area you can hunt on as it is now," Eisfeller said as he left the polls at Shapleigh School, his daughter perched on his shoulders.
Louise Sprague reflected the other faction. She and her husband Ralph, retirees, voted to ban hunting. "I'm just against killing those beautiful animals," she said.
Johnson and Bogenberger support alternative methods of controlling the deer population.
Johnson, who does not eat meat or dairy products, favors using contraceptives as a way to control the deer population.
Sousa argued that there was little likelihood of controlling the local deer population by using contraceptives, saying the technique has failed to control herd populations elsewhere.
The campaign got ugly in the days leading up to the election.
Two signs that were put up along the Kittery traffic circle - bearing the slogans "Animals Taste Good" and "Target Practice" - urged voters to defeat the hunting restrictions. Animal-rights activists cried foul. No one took credit for making the signs.
The signs were still on the rotary Tuesday, along with many others espousing both sides of the issue.
Staff Writer Ted Cohen can be contacted at 282-8225 or at: tcohen@pressherald.com
http://www.pressherald.com/news/york/020821hunting.shtml
"If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege." - Arkansas Supreme Court, 1878
Another way to win the State Park gun ban
VCDL VP, Jim Snyder, put together this piece on another tack that we can take
to allow us to carry in state parks:
The Director of the Department of Conservation & Recreation has the
authority to modify the regulations that govern the Virginia State
Parks. Instead of *only* waiting for the Attorney General to rule on
this issue, you should also contact Joseph Maroon and urge him to change
the Park regulations. One bit of leverage we have is that the
Administration is trying to get a park bond referendum passed. So they
need voters to approve it - and we are voters!
Here is a link to the referendum:
Here's a sample letter you for you to send to him. Be sure to include
your name and address.
The Honorable Joseph H. Maroon
Director
Department of Conservation & Recreation
203 Governor Street, Suite 213
Richmond, VA 23219
Dear Mr. Maroon:
I urge you to amend Virginia State Park Regulation 4 VAC 5-30-200 to
remove the gun ban.
The current regulation banning firearms from State Parks harms me and
other law-abiding citizens.
The ban should not apply to citizens who lawfully possess and carry
firearms for the purpose of self-defense. In particular, carrying of
concealed handguns by permit holders and the open carry of holstered
side arms should be allowed in the Virginia State Parks, just as it is
in the General Assembly Building in Richmond and other public areas
across the Commonwealth.
The current Virginia State Park gun ban is bad public policy that
endangers honest, law-abiding visitors to the parks.
Why should I support the Park & Recreational Facilities Bond issue
appearing on the ballot this November if I'm prohibited from carrying a
defensive firearm by the Virginia State Park regulations?
I urge you to repeal the State Park ban on carrying of firearms for
self-defense.
Please let me know what you are going to do.
Sincerely,
Mr. Maroon's e-mail address is:
If you would like to call, the phone number to the Director's office
is: 804-786-2123
3. NOVA Park Gun Ban decision is delayed yet again
Notice our side had *4 times* as many comments as the anti's during
the comment period:
From the Fairfax Journal online -
Gun ban in parks delayed
By SAM HANANEL
Journal staff writer
A plan to ban firearms from hundreds of Northern Virginia parks and
recreation centers has temporarily stalled as officials from two park
agencies hammer out differences about the language of new regulations.
Board members from the Fairfax County Park Authority and the Northern
Virginia Regional Park Authority were expected to vote on the proposed ban
in July. But without an agreement about the precise wording of the rules,
the agencies are creating a joint committee to reach a consensus later this
year, said Fairfax County Park Authority spokeswoman Judy Pedersen.
``I don't think there's any sense that it's insurmountable," Pedersen
said. ``We just need to come up with some very clear language to determine
what we do and don't allow."
Officials have declined to discuss details of the disagreement.
The park authorities, which operate more than 400 parks and recreation
centers on more than 30,000 acres in Northern Virginia, are in the process
of revising rules for the first time in more than 20 years.
Regulations already prohibit park visitors from possessing a firearm
unless it is dismantled or contained within a closed case. The revised rules
are expected to prohibit anyone other than a law enforcement officer from
possessing a firearm or ammunition in a park.
Gun advocates have criticized the park agencies for ignoring a new state
law that prohibits local governments from adopting rules banning firearms on
government property. Park officials said the law does not apply to them
because they are state-created agencies, not municipalities.
Some gun organizations have threatened legal action when the new
regulations are finalized.
``We would basically take them to court," said Philip Van Cleave,
president of the Virginia Citizens Defense League. In 1997, the group
successfully challenged an effort by Fairfax County to ban weapons in
county-owned buildings.
Pedersen said attorneys reviewing the proposed rules have found no
violation of state law.
More than 100 park users voiced opinions during a public comment period
between April and May where opponents of the firearm ban outnumbered
supporters by a 4-to-1 margin.
In addition to handguns, shotguns and rifles, the regulations also would
prohibit patrons from carrying pellet, BB or paintball guns. Anyone
violating the rule would face a fine of up to $250 and immediate ejection.
Violators also could be prevented from using park property or services in
the future.
Thanks to VCDL member Dave Yates for bringing this article to my attention.
BNRVA@aol.comwww.vcdl.org
"It was like that when I got here".
Edited by - 4wheeler on 08/22/2002 22:52:26
If you will blame gun makers for every shooting then blame car maker for every car accident.