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plastic not so fantastic...

the loveable rat...the loveable rat... Member Posts: 969 ✭✭✭✭
edited April 2002 in General Discussion
so there's this tv show on last night w/ cops, seals, marines, et al made by the dude from survivor starring "rudy" as camp commandant and they compete for cash. last 3 remaining were 2 swat and 1 seal...doing a run/shoot course to remove 1 from competition. seal's ar locks up like crazy, jambs, frozen bolt- whatever. they blame it on him for not "seating" the mag properly and he's pissed big-time for being forced out due to mech. failure. "rudy" sez it happens in combat all the time- tuff luck... what the heck are we still doing w/ this p.o.s. if thats true? god bless you guys at the whim of the lowest bidder...
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Comments

  • BullzeyeBullzeye Member Posts: 3,560
    edited November -1
    Like the wheat from the chaff, and the sheep from the goats, my friend...

    A fine cigar gladdens the soul."Remember, there are only two: The Quick, and the Dead"
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  • Gordian BladeGordian Blade Member Posts: 1,202 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Bullzeye, somehow I knew before I even read that far down that you'd be pretty quick to jump on this one.
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  • IconoclastIconoclast Member Posts: 10,515 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I'd love to hear from some of the present and former military folks here on the reliability of the M16 & it's later incarnations. Many of the guys I know who served in Nam had nothing good to say about it. Two of them were in units where they had the option to carry non-standard weapons; one opted for a pump shotgun and the other for an AK.
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  • oneshyoneshy Member Posts: 417 ✭
    edited November -1
    What were the SWATs using? Why would anyone listen to Rudy?

    oneshy
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  • the loveable rat...the loveable rat... Member Posts: 969 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    all the 3 guys(and for that matter, all of the "contestants" were during the shows i watched- tho mostly using laser tag system)used ar's...
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  • idsman75idsman75 Member Posts: 13,398 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Every problem that I have ever encountered with the M-16 and its variants sprouted from magazine issues. I'm picky about my magazines and followers now. The right magazine makes a world of difference.

    SSG idsman75, U.S. ARMY
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  • Big Sky RedneckBig Sky Redneck Member Posts: 19,752 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    There are a few traitors on this board who would rather carry commie weapons, they claim superiority over the American junk and piss on anybody who uses an American weapon. You know who you are. It's like this, I would rather DIE swinging my AR by the barrel than live knowing I fought 2 seconds with some commie gun. I almost bought an AK last month and decided that after reading some of the posts and the attitudes some AK lovers have with the American weapon, that I would take the advise of my father who fought in 'Nam with that piece of crap M16 and never allow one of those commie guns in my house.
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  • Josey1Josey1 Member Posts: 9,598 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I saw that,what a neat show.I believe it was those clear plastic AR-15 mags they were using and those are cheap crap.I had a whole bunch of them that wouldn't feed reliably even after I switched out all the followers.Rat,did you see last weeks episode?During the final combat mission,the teams were dropped from a hughey,4 out of the 12 participants had their M-4's jam due to the dust that the Hughey kicked up.

    "If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege." - Arkansas Supreme Court, 1878
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  • robsgunsrobsguns Member Posts: 4,581 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Exactly idsman, anytime there is a malfunction with an M-16 it is usually a magazine problem, I've never had a problem that wasnt because of the magazine. If you want to place blame, dont put it on the plastic gun, nor plastic mag., its the mag. in general.

    SSgt Ryan E. Roberts, USMC
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  • sodbustersodbuster Member Posts: 2,305 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    In the Shooting Times-Autoloaders, Buyer's Guide 2001 They
    fired 10,000 rounds of PMC 55 grain FMJ through a Colt Match
    Target HBAR,,,not one misfire,,not one problem with the rifle.
    They took a kit bag of parts that might break-springs,pins,
    extractors, etc..didn't even open the bag.
    I am concerned that my 6601C is on it's third trip back to
    the factory because the compensator keeps flying off!!

    It's not the number of your stars that count,,it's the size of your moon.
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  • thesupermonkeythesupermonkey Member Posts: 3,905 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    7mm nut,
    Don't blame the commie-block weapons for the bad attitudes of some uninformed individuals. I own an Ar15 and an Ak47 and love them both. The Ak47 will ALWAYS be more reliable than the Ar15 in any situation. That's a fact. However, the Ak47's range is much shorter than that of the Ar15. Anything smaller than a man-sized target at or beyond 300 yards is highly unlikely with the Ak. If I had to choose an accurate weapon that worked MOST of the time, or a less accurate one that works all of the time, I'll take the one that works all of the time. I guess that makes me a traitor, but I figured the gun mattered less than the direction the bullets were going. Just because it says made in China/Russia/Yugoslavia etc... doesn't negate it's value. Commie-block weapons are designed to work, and they do just that. The Sks, the Makarov, the Ak47, the Nagants, and the list goes on and on. Let me put it this way, if I'm given $100 dollars to buy the best self defense handgun I can, I'll opt for the Makarov over that Jennings any day. I'm not ready to put my life on the line simply over logo that says "Made in the USA".
    Munkey



    Don't worry about the bullet with your name on it, worry about the fragmentation grenade addressed 'To Occupant'.
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  • travelortravelor Member Posts: 442 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    If AR problems result from mags, can someone please go into some detail about how to "tune" mags to function well? or direct me to a good sorce of information pertaining to this?

    keep lots of extra uppers for your ar..you can change often enough to keep the thing from over heating...what ever caliber fits the moment..~Secret Select Society of Suave Stylish Smoking Jackets~
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  • thesupermonkeythesupermonkey Member Posts: 3,905 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Just make sure you purchase original GI or Colt mags, and not the cheapest ones you can find. Even the Ora-lite mags are pretty decent.

    Don't worry about the bullet with your name on it, worry about the fragmentation grenade addressed 'To Occupant'.
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  • mac66mac66 Member Posts: 1 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    They were using Simunitions ammo with special magazines and which required modification to the guns. This ammo is like paintball ammo. Notice the barrels of the rifles were blue and the plastic mags had blue stipes on them. The jam the seal guy experienced is not uncommon if you don't seat the magazine in the rifle when you close the bolt. The bolt will strip the round but then under ride it which causes a hell of a jam. Doesn't happen very often and I've never seen it with factory or GI mags but I've seen it with plastic mags several times.
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  • gap1916gap1916 Member Posts: 4,977
    edited November -1
    Iconoclast:
    I have carried the M16, M14, Stonner 63, and the AK 47 while with Uncle Sams Misguided Children. The M 16 was the most un reliable but that was a long time ago. Each weapon was carried for a different reason/mission. Today I have an AR 180 that I like to plink with. I do not need an assult type weapon to protect myself as I did in those thrilling days of yester year. Just my 2 cents.
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  • mudgemudge Member Posts: 4,225 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Mine's an M-16. I use a 30/45 mag. It's plastic with a movable floorplate. It will allow you to load 30 rounds and fully extend the floorplate to take some tension off the spring. If you want to "rock 'n roll" with just 30 rounds in the mag., you're all set. Or, when you're going to really "rock", stuff in the other 15 rds. I've fireda lot of rounds thru them without a whimper. Admittedly, my experience has been in controlled environment, (ie. non-combat) situations, not crawling around in the dirt so I can't speak to how they (the mags.) would perform under those conditions.
    I also have a 90 rounder for the thing. Pack that full, set up on the bi-pod, and cut loose at the manhole cover that's hanging 300 yds. away. Gets that big piece o' steel swingin'.

    Mudge the rocker

    I can't come to work today. The voices said, STAY HOME AND CLEAN THE GUNS!

    Edited by - mudge on 04/19/2002 15:29:27
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  • Josey1Josey1 Member Posts: 9,598 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Mac,you are right about the simunitions ammo as far as the combat simulations but in the first competition it was a run and gun challenge where they ran a course with clay targets that they had to shoot on the way.This is where the gun jammed and they were using ball ammo.

    "If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege." - Arkansas Supreme Court, 1878
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  • BullzeyeBullzeye Member Posts: 3,560
    edited November -1
    I'm not telling anyone what they should or should not carry.

    I'm just saying that this is a great example of the inferior weapon being weeded out of the scenario by commonly encountered battlefield factors.

    It's almost Darwinian. And it's unequivocable.

    A fine cigar gladdens the soul."Remember, there are only two: The Quick, and the Dead"
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  • CaptBlackDawgCaptBlackDawg Member Posts: 38 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Bullzeye..Aye laddy, seems you must be a book worm or such an believe thy words from commies ya know.For the babble that runs from ur mouth is second hand n not from experiance no doubt... But that Ar is a fine weapon next to a sharp sword that is. Har
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