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Need some advice from you guys. Long read
Oakie
Member Posts: 40,565 ✭✭✭✭
Being that most of you are older then me and I respect all your opinions, I need some fatherly advice from you guys and your opinion. I am only going to give you my side of this and a little back ground.
I have been a member of our shooting club, 400 members, for 34 years. Our current president has raided our treasury to his own benefits, and made it look like it was for the good of the club. I sit on the executive board as a range officer. He had one of the other members of the EB make us a road through wetlands. He also per cured the club a trailer for a club house. 80x40 double wide. All this is good, except he never got permits against my and several other EB members objections. We are now being fined and sued by pinelands, DEP, the township,Wetlands and the Army corps of engineers. This is not good. Our legal fees are bankrupting us. He told us all to suck it up. He has been a member for 13 years. He has dismissed all the member of the executive board that disagree with him, on bogus charges, except myself and the VP. All this is done behind the members backs. I am fighting tooth and nail to save the club and represent the members. I am loosing.[:(!] He paid another member 47,000 dollars for the road, which is a joke and unusable. He also keeps paying this guy outrageous monies for trivial things, like 4,000 to fill in a pot hole and 5,00 to remove a tree about 12" round. I know they are embezzling the money, but cannot prove it. The damn members won't show up to the meetings because he put it in fine print and very obscure places in our news letter, when he wants to do things. I can go on and on.
Here is my question. We are in for the fight of our lives with this club and the general membership wants me to take over as President, next election. I just don't know what to do because of all the fall out and court stuff going on. Our current President is a lot smarter then I am, as far as legal stuff, but I have the clubs and members best interest at heart. I don't want to be the one left holding the bag when the devil comes to call, but I don't want to lose the club either. I am so desperate to save this place and now have the general membership behind me. I have made over 300 calls this weekend to let the members know what is going on behind their backs and to come to the quarterly meeting in October. At that meeting, our current President is going to try to change our bylaws to extend his term another 2 years. Subtle changes that you really have to read. I can send someone a copy of the changes and our current bylaws.
I probably left a lot out, so ask me and I will tell you. It would take up ten pages to tell you all everything that is going on. I truly need some advice from you guys as what to do legally and morally. I am not perfect and never led an organization this big. I am a little scared but have the confidence and determination to do it. The majority of our members are about 60 to 70 years old and I am like a kid to them. I am frustrated and need your help. I will take you criticisms as well as advice. Most of you can pretty much figure out my personality from the forums and some have meet me. Thank you for reading and please help me make the right decision. John Oakie Taggart
PS, This club has been around since 1933 .
I have been a member of our shooting club, 400 members, for 34 years. Our current president has raided our treasury to his own benefits, and made it look like it was for the good of the club. I sit on the executive board as a range officer. He had one of the other members of the EB make us a road through wetlands. He also per cured the club a trailer for a club house. 80x40 double wide. All this is good, except he never got permits against my and several other EB members objections. We are now being fined and sued by pinelands, DEP, the township,Wetlands and the Army corps of engineers. This is not good. Our legal fees are bankrupting us. He told us all to suck it up. He has been a member for 13 years. He has dismissed all the member of the executive board that disagree with him, on bogus charges, except myself and the VP. All this is done behind the members backs. I am fighting tooth and nail to save the club and represent the members. I am loosing.[:(!] He paid another member 47,000 dollars for the road, which is a joke and unusable. He also keeps paying this guy outrageous monies for trivial things, like 4,000 to fill in a pot hole and 5,00 to remove a tree about 12" round. I know they are embezzling the money, but cannot prove it. The damn members won't show up to the meetings because he put it in fine print and very obscure places in our news letter, when he wants to do things. I can go on and on.
Here is my question. We are in for the fight of our lives with this club and the general membership wants me to take over as President, next election. I just don't know what to do because of all the fall out and court stuff going on. Our current President is a lot smarter then I am, as far as legal stuff, but I have the clubs and members best interest at heart. I don't want to be the one left holding the bag when the devil comes to call, but I don't want to lose the club either. I am so desperate to save this place and now have the general membership behind me. I have made over 300 calls this weekend to let the members know what is going on behind their backs and to come to the quarterly meeting in October. At that meeting, our current President is going to try to change our bylaws to extend his term another 2 years. Subtle changes that you really have to read. I can send someone a copy of the changes and our current bylaws.
I probably left a lot out, so ask me and I will tell you. It would take up ten pages to tell you all everything that is going on. I truly need some advice from you guys as what to do legally and morally. I am not perfect and never led an organization this big. I am a little scared but have the confidence and determination to do it. The majority of our members are about 60 to 70 years old and I am like a kid to them. I am frustrated and need your help. I will take you criticisms as well as advice. Most of you can pretty much figure out my personality from the forums and some have meet me. Thank you for reading and please help me make the right decision. John Oakie Taggart
PS, This club has been around since 1933 .
Comments
Kind of sounds like a microcosm of our nation don't it...
With that said ain't you moving soon?
Obtain an attorney. Have the attorney obtain a court order to have the club's books audited.
+1. When the current guy goes to jail.. you become president.
The key to this succeeding is for everyone to keep their mouth shut. You take over as President and nobody knows what happened to the other guy. Taking the "legal" route with this guy will get you nowhere and chances are your club will most likely dissolve in the proccess.
I work for a company that had a small amount of run off water from a job site filtrate into some wet lands and was fined 350k, not to mention the tens of thousands spent to repair.
Simple enough,find another gun club to end the frustration.
Neal
My experience with a similar situation in a motorcylce club was resolved with violence. Sometimes people only understand a good beating. This might sound extreme to most people, but if you get two or three club members you can trust and beat this guys *, he will understand. Then tell him he is not President anymore and don't ever come back.
The key to this succeeding is for everyone to keep their mouth shut. You take over as President and nobody knows what happened to the other guy. Taking the "legal" route with this guy will get you nowhere and chances are your club will most likely dissolve in the proccess.
This is incredibly bad advise and an incredibly bad place (The World Wide Web) to suggest such action.
Hopefully you intended to use green font and don't really believe that this is an acceptable solution to this issue.
Time to walk away.
Maybe come back when the dust settles.
Take every scrap of information you have or can dig up to a lawyer that you hire to protect YOU. You want that lawyer to examine two questions first and foremost
A. What, if any, illegal activities does the lawyer see or suspect in the information?
B. What, if any, are the risks to yourself for civil or criminal penalty as an officer, employee, member or volunteer of the association?
2. This next step depends upon the lawyer's analysis. If the lawyer sees criminal or civil risks, then it is the lawyer who should present the case to the appropriate authorities.
The time to make 300 calls to the members and retain an attorney was BEFORE he put the road in and did all the other stuff. As a member of the *, I would think that even if you made a loud noise about it, your own failure to take legal action (possibly under the club's by-laws as well, depending on what they were) and bring the permit issue to the attention of the authorities means that you share in his culpability.
I would ask an attorney for legal advice as to your own legal standing here, and show up with all documentation you can for the initial consultation.
It's quite likely that, unless you can prove that he acted alone and that you did everything in your power to stop him, the land will be seized to cover lawsuit costs anyhow, or else you'll be forced to sell. You can only hope that the membership and the * isn't held for the costs.
Yes, talk to a good attorney, as soon as possible.
Have had 2 run ins with crooks running a non-profit. President of a local Youth Athletic Association (kids sports) was one- we caught her having embezzled over $39 K that we could prove. The other was President of a HOA. $200 K we could prove- along with violation of some serious EPA matters.
Make one more call to a lawyer. No, really.
a club I am a member of had similar issues {stealing}, the problem I foresee is all members are part owner, so all could be held responsible even if it 1/400th
I personally wouldn't be an E board member if you payed me, not worth my time
One more thing, you should delete this post. Now.
Agreed.
I will see how it all plays out as we have a court date this week to answer the charges from the Township, DEP, wetlands and pinelands. It's not going to be good. Were doomed and I am grasping at straws. Thanks for your advice but I just have to realize I am only one person of two people against 10 others on the board. Very sad to see someone steal our club after almost 82 years. We got blind sided by a crook that was good.[;)] Again, thanks. I was just hoping against all hope and looking for a ray of light. Damn, just Damn
You are probably in way over your head on this one, so again, reach out for a professional. The burden need to be shifted to the one or two that created the problems/issues. If you have not kept a log or journal, start one immediately and include everything relating to ANY club actions.
By being an EB member puts you neck out for a mile and if this was not addressed early on, it could be shown that by no action, the EB had shown no opposition.
If memory serves me correctly you have mentioned this before, so do not hesitate, and now for the last line, talk to an attorney now! May be the best spent money in some time.
The club can be put back together after the mess is finalized.
(had a couple typo's to fix)
quote:Originally posted by ChrisInTempe
quote:Originally posted by m88.358win
One more thing, you should delete this post. Now.
Agreed.
financially responsible for the club. We had to sign papers each year
to not hold them accountable for any wrong doing or accidental
injuries. As an officer of the club you would be held maybe financially
responsibility for the damages of the previous president.
The paper is a "Club Release, Indemnification and Hold Harmless Agreement"
I hope the best for you.
Thor
Move to ga and join one of many stable gun clubs.
River bend
Don't run for president imho
Ros
Use the process to oust the bad apple and file charges for compensation.
Hire a good lawyer smarter than your current president