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Wants to bring back the draft
alledan
Member Posts: 19,541
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- A Democratic lawmaker said Sunday he will introduce a bill in the next session of Congress to make military service mandatory.
Rep. Charles Rangel, D-New York, said such legislation could make members of Congress more reluctant to authorize military action.
"I'm going to introduce legislation to have universal military service to let everyone have an opportunity to defend the Free World against the threats coming to us," Rangel said on CNN's "Late Edition."
"I'm talking about mandatory service."
The Korean War veteran has accused the Bush administration and some fellow lawmakers of being too willing to go to war with Iraq.
In October, he voted against a joint resolution authorizing military action against Iraq. It passed 296-133 in the House and 77-23 in the Senate.
"When you talk about a war, you're talking about ground troops, you're talking about enlisted people, and they don't come from the kids and members of Congress," he said.
"I think, if we went home and found out that there were families concerned about their kids going off to war, there would be more cautiousness and a more willingness to work with the international community than to say, 'Our way or the highway.'"
Ageless cosmic rocker!
Rep. Charles Rangel, D-New York, said such legislation could make members of Congress more reluctant to authorize military action.
"I'm going to introduce legislation to have universal military service to let everyone have an opportunity to defend the Free World against the threats coming to us," Rangel said on CNN's "Late Edition."
"I'm talking about mandatory service."
The Korean War veteran has accused the Bush administration and some fellow lawmakers of being too willing to go to war with Iraq.
In October, he voted against a joint resolution authorizing military action against Iraq. It passed 296-133 in the House and 77-23 in the Senate.
"When you talk about a war, you're talking about ground troops, you're talking about enlisted people, and they don't come from the kids and members of Congress," he said.
"I think, if we went home and found out that there were families concerned about their kids going off to war, there would be more cautiousness and a more willingness to work with the international community than to say, 'Our way or the highway.'"
Ageless cosmic rocker!
Comments
Although the Draft ended it was still Mandatory to Register for the Draft at the Age of 18.
Is that still the way it is?
Remember...Terrorist are attacking Civilians; Not the Government. Protect Yourself!
NRA Lifetime Benefactor Member.
G. Mayes/// Part Time FFL Dealer/No expert on guns by any means just a Gun Loving Nut
Congress has mandated contracting out the military to make it smaller, enforcing a draft will have wasted hundreds of billions of dollars in Defense contracts to make it smaller. Then add a few hundred billion dollars to create more military installations for everyone..it just won't happen. Today's Military to me is a mercinary regime..how is all the money spent on a smaller force that used to run a large force quite comfortably you may ask? The retired E-9's and Officer's are taking advantage of all the contracting going on. Want a 10 Million dollar contract to mow grass on a military installation? They're out there-www.dodbusopps.com
Here's one for y'all.
General Information
Document Type: Presolicitation Notice
Solicitation Number: DABK09-03-R-0002
Posted Date: Oct 28, 2002
Original Response Date: Dec 13, 2002
Original Archive Date: Feb 11, 2003
Current Archive Date:
Classification Code: S -- Utilities and housekeeping services
Set Aside: Total HUB-Zone
Contracting Office Address
ACA, Fort Campbell, Directorate of Contracting, Building 2174, 13 ? & Indiana Streets, Fort Campbell, KY 42223-1100
Description
NA Resulting solicitation will request offerors to submit a Request for Proposal to provide Ground Maintenance Services, Post wide, Fort Campbell, Kentucky. Successful contractor will be responsible for all plant, labor, equipment/tools, and necessary materi als to provide Grounds Maintenance. Work shall include mowing, edging, trimming, removal of debris, etc. Resulting contract will be a combination of a firm fixed & a requirements type contract; a base year & three option periods is contemplated to incl ude 3 award term options, for a total of 7 years. Period of performance for base year and option/award term periods will be 12-month periods. NAICS is 561730/$6 Million. This acquisition is 100% set aside for Hub zone Business Concerns. Solicitation pa ckages may be downloaded from the Directorate of Contracting's home page utilizing the Adobe Portable Format (PDF). You may obtain a free copy of the Adobe Acrobat Reader to print and view the solicitation at www.adobe.com/proindex/acrobat/readstep.html. The solicitation will be available on or about 12 November 2002 on the Directorate of Contracting Home Page www.campbell-doc.army.mil. For further information on obtaining the solicitation contact Angela Jacobs, (270) 798-0380. All responsible sources m ay submit an offer, which will be considered.
Original Point of Contact
Lilia Bennett, 270-798-6068
Email your questions to ACA, Fort Campbell at woodl@campbell.army.mil
Place of Performance
Address: ACA, Fort Campbell Directorate of Contracting, Building 2174, 13 ? & Indiana Streets Fort Campbell KY
Postal Code: 42223-1100
Country: US
Let's change the laws and quit bickering about them. One man CAN change the status quo.
I hope everyone sees what he is saying and votes his sorry butt out of office for good.
Alex
"The only way American citizens can adequately be protected from terror and violence is when" those in authority protect us from those who would harm us, instead of protecting us from ourselves.
Life NRA Member
T. Jefferson: "[When doing Constitutional interpretation], let us [go] back to the time when [it] was adopted. [Rather than] invent a meaning [let us] conform to the probable one in which it was passed."
Number two: God Bless all who have served, past and present, volunteers or drafted. BUT, involuntary servitude is strictly forbidden by the United States Constitution. Barring a constitutional amendment, anyone who votes for mandatory service, or anyone who has authorized it in the past, are treasonous. We can't pick one part of the constitution that we like, and defend it, and then pick another part and ignore it. Hell, at least I can't.
Not many soldiers want their back covered by a guy who was 'dragged into it kicking and screaming'.
Also, there are always MANY exemptions, so the Senator waves good-bye to his sons classmates and never his son! Send the kid to college, get him married, etc... His own never see active duty.
JMHO
OOOPS!
I posted this reply on the WRONG thread.
combatants in all services. Compulsory national service might even be considered for females.
College as well as any unfinished high school would be deferred. There's nothing in the life of an 18 year old that can't be put off for two years.
Involuntary servitude is unpaid slavery. The Army pays you so conscription is exempt and has been legal since the Civil War despite the Irish draft riots in N.Y..
Draftee armies of most nations gave a good account of themselves in
past wars of this century.
I did my thing like many thousands of others and wished my boys had also. They would have been better off for it.
Lord Lowrider the LoquaciousMember:Secret Select Society of Suave Stylish Smoking Jackets She was only a fisherman's daughter,But when she saw my rod she reeled.
SGT RRG
The greatest happiness is to see your enemy scattered before you, to see his village in ashes, and to gather to your bed his wives and daughters.-Genghis Khan 1226
The NRA is on our side!
This guy is just doing the political game, trying to make Bush look bad.
As for mandatory service, In mho, it would benefit our country AND the kids. Learning discipline, etc. would be good for those that did or didn't get it at home/school etc. Then they could go to school, get a job, whatever and have a better outlook on life when they got out.
Whether they enjoyed time in the military or not, everyone who has served-GREW UP, at least a little more than they would have at home with family and friends.
Experiences in life are not the same when you are away from home.
Agree with 'old single shots' those that choose to avoid the draft, or refuse to conform should be black marked for life.
B - BreatheR - RelaxA - AimS - SightS - Squeeze
quote:I did my thing like many thousands of others and wished my boys had also. They would have been better off for it. "v35".
v35; You came back, how would they be better if they did'nt. Why didn't you make it manditory for them when you had the chance?
_____________________________________________________________________
With power, it is a responsibility to prevent war. There is no beauty or glory in it if it begans by ruffling your feathers just because you can! We have'nt the recrutes today because our young see how the goverment treat the service men after a war- remember agent orange, and the return of the nam vets?
There will many vollenteers when it comes time to protect our country and need not worry about that.
If you look around, you'll see that our young are patriots to this country, but not so much to the government. They are less likely to support there government, but are well willing to defend their country.
I agree with the intent of this bill, not the false sense of "solution" it represents.
I once thought of a manditory draft- but that was much later than when I was 18. I was getting ready for vietnam when the war ended just before my birthday- a lot of my freinds who didn't return, weren't so lucky.
This is my opinion on this matter and I don't expect all of you to agree.
I really do understand what you're saying, and don't want you to think I'm just being hard headed.
Many come home from foreign places wounded, if not physically, then mentally to some degree. That's war, that's why it is never good even when you win. We sill have to face the fact that it has been, and will continue to be part of life on this earth as we know it.
Mandatory service in time of peace as well as war would be good training for lifes experiences. Tax $ would at least be better spent than paying non-workers to do nothing. Population numbers non-withstanding, it could be put in place. They sure do it in other countries.
Cure-all? I doubt it, but we would have more mature youngsters. Even a bad DI teaches good things.
I myself served 8yrs Army Reserves, I enjoyed my time in service and feel I became a better person because of it.
Oldsingleshot, if you believe in making it mandatory for everyone, why exclude gays? In Isreal, where military service is mandatory and dangerous, gays are not excluded.
Regards,
************************
Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some aquatic ceremony. You can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart throws a sword at you!
If they want to bring back the draft I'd like to also see them bring back some of the better benefits the military used to offer. Like the GI Bill for college. What a rip-off these days with the matching money deal. One of the good reasons to join-up back in the old days was the promise of free college when you got out. I'd like to see that offered again.
Lord Lowrider the LoquaciousMember:Secret Select Society of Suave Stylish Smoking Jackets She was only a fisherman's daughter,But when she saw my rod she reeled.
drobs--Okay,you have convinced me.Gays too.Use them for live fire practice.
Not worth commenting on. [:o)]
quote:
I was in-I know.Guys in the Service don't want them and don't need them living amongst them.
We'd really hate to hurt those guy's feelings. But as the old saying goes, "we are everywhere, get used to it." They are there now just as they've always been.
quote:
Now i am REALLY going to hear it.I am not a gay basher.I say live and let live.They just do not fit in the military way of life.GO AHEAD--GIVE IT TO ME.I have once again opened my big mouth and asked for it.
Doesn't make sense to me to protect our gay americans from military service. If you're gonna make it mandatory, make it mandatory for everyone. When the bullets start flying, I don't think anyone here would care about the sexual preference of our buddy in the foxhole as long as he is killing the enemy.
Regards,
************************
Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some aquatic ceremony. You can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart throws a sword at you!
Bruce
Regards,
************************
Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some aquatic ceremony. You can't expect to wield supreme executive power just because some watery tart throws a sword at you!
Put that in your pipe and smoke it!
spiny
Now as for a draft, in time of war, like right now, when we might need it, no. Why?, cause we DONT really need it. Thats what we have all these reserves for. I say use them. I also believe that the inactive reserve time for a member of the armed forces that has been honorably discharged should be a mandatory 8 years, after discharge, as opposed to the 4 we currently have, after a 4 year hitch. That would make them eligible for use right up till they're 30 at the current eligible age of 18, add to it the 12 years-4 active-8 inactive, comes up to 30. Anyone healthy after 4 should still be healthy at 30 years of age, and should be made to stay that way by training twice a year. If they dont stay healthy, and in conformance with military standards, fine, bring them back on active duty and get them that way. Sounds ridiculous, buy thats my opinion. It might hurt enlistment percentages, but so what, with that many eligible reservists, we could easily fill any shortfalls when ever required by activating the reservists. Half of these kids dont even begin thinking like an adult till their 4 years are over, maybe even after that. I'd like to have some of them back after they grow up. For some, its just too early for many of them. Think about how successful their career could have been had they been a little more mature before coming in. Ah well, let us see what these kids have in a few weeks, maybe they'll surprise me. They're starting to come around, now that they're realizing this is no longer a joke for them.
SSgt Ryan E. Roberts, USMC
the draft is different then it was in the past. if the armed forces needs 5,000 doctors and EMT`s they can now conscript them. if the armed forces needs 100 spelunkers they can concscipt them. there is a rating system that covers everthing. example: you served two years in the army reserve(10 pts), you are an EMT(3 PTS), you have a bachalors degree(3 pts) you are registered with the CMP and have recieved a CMP firearm(4 pts)etc...
you still need an act of congress to reactivate the draft, but do not believe its gone. all men upon reaching the age of 18 still register with selective service by law. the draft boards still exist, and practice the skills nessesary to concript able bodied men if there is a need.
just a thought for you to consider.
What other dungeon is so dark as ones own heart, what jailer so inexorable as ones own mind.
#1, all they want is college material KIDS and a few outstanding performers in the adult class.
#2 I want to join but NO, they won't take me!
Know why?? because I never finished friggin high school!
I don't want to go to get free college, I want to fight, plain and simple. If I could choose what I was to do in the military it would have something to do with driving but I would take a backpack and a rifle right now, we are going to war and I want to go, NOW! But nooo they say, I'm a 32 year old high school dropout, they don't want me. Nevermind that I WANT to fight, they don't want me. I saw a couple shows on tv showing these kids in the Army crying because they might have to do the job they signed up for, there are alot of them in it for the money only, not fighting. Heck I'll do it for free, give me a gun and let me go.
Wanna bring back the draft? Do it and let me in.
Man I'm so ticked thinking about this I'm about to break this danged keyboard I'm hittin the keys so hard.[:(!][:(!][:(!][:(!][:(!][:(!]
If you need a gun larger than a .243 to kill a deer, you need to give up
redneck1314@pennswoods.net
And, by the way, "involuntary servitude" means being forced to do something against one's will, whether paid or not, and was expressly meant by the Founders to prohibit military conscription, please read both the Federalist Papers and the Anti-Federalist Papers.
What part of "involuntary" don't you understand??
The same as the gun-grabbers not understanding "shall not be infringed?"
If you're going to defend the Constitution, and I will repeat once again, either you do or you don't.
"The right of the citizens to keep and bear arms" doesn't mean: "Unless they have green hair or disagree with me politically", and just because you had to unconstitutionally serve involuntarily does not mean that it is right for you to violate the rights of others as some kind of "payback." I appreciate what ALL who have served have done, honorably, for my country. But you can slice the cake anyway that you want to, the right to bear arms still exists constitutionally and so does the right to be free of involuntary servitude. LOTS of hypocrisy and ignorance floating around right now.
1. Urbanization
2. Doing away with the draft
J. Rau
The United States is supposed to be a democratic republic, and therefore well suited to the militia system. Complicating this is our federal system, with the states enjoying partial soveriegnity as well as the national government. Switzerland and Israel also use the militia system, with considerable success. Our military needs also require at this time in our history a force of professional soldiers, some as elite intervention forces, and others as an officer corps. All of these are possible in our current system. I therefore offer these modest proposals:
1)4 months of active duty for training, a reasonable duration. During this time, advertizing for regular service can be used to persuade men to continue into more useful forces. This need not be done at 18, studies have shown that men of 20 are easier to train.
2)Part-time service after, for several years. I recall this was considered during the Eisenhower years, and the time desired was 8 years. The current National Guard structure would be ideal for this, allowing participation by state governments and utilization of units for civic duties. A much larger structure would be needed, of course.
3)More elite regular-type units to carry out most foreign interventions. All the Navy, Air Force and Marine Corps would be in this category, and recruits for these services would be exempt from other service. Also certain Army formations would be categorized here. Airbornes, Rangers, Special Forces, and Mountain troops come first to mind, but there would be a large requirement for more heavily-armed formations as well, perhaps as much as several armored divisions.
This would provide what the nation needs, and get more of the people involved in the business of the nation. Our Republic would be healthier, and the added strength would command respect again around the world.
I have wondered since 9-11 what kind of "war" this is going to be. If this is a real war, where IS the draft? Where are the war taxes? How about rationing, especially of petroleum products, since the supply of them is most at risk in a Middle Eastern conflict? I do wonder what our leaders are thinking. 9-11 was the equal to Pearl Harbor in my mind, look at the USA in 1943, we were doing all kinds of extreme measures to be sure we would beat the Axis, and now, the same time after an attack, you still see fit young men in shopping malls, there are no calls for national sacrifices for victory. Could it be that victory is not what our government is seeking? Do they simply want an open-ended war, justifying unlimited spending on pet projects and any level of suppression upon our liberties? What kind of future does this leave us?
Iraqi: "Is it true that only 13% of American kids can find Iraq on a map?"
American reporter: "Yes, but all 13% are Marines"
Let's change the laws and quit bickering about them. One man CAN change the status quo.
the ten ring!!!! I am genuinely impressed. Workable,
pragmatic, effective.
In Robert Heinlein's story, "Starship Troopers," he
describes a worldwide republic in which the only
way to become a fully participating, voting citizen
is through military service. Everyone else has all
the same rights and are not treated as second class;
they just can't vote! Veterans are considered to have
proven their dedication, and to have acquired a maturity
and a perspective (especially regarding war) that
civilians cannot know. And DIs can definitely kick the
c@#p out of recruits! Offered as an interesting point
for discussion.
Interestingly though I do like the "starship troopers" concept of citizenship and voting rights. The howls of protest for such a system would start in Hollywood and resound in other bastions of anti-American liberalism. As attractive as it might sound it just would never happen. Too bad, it might really improve the performance of Congress. Beach
to hold elective office, if I recall. Heilein's works are
just filled with interesting and challenging ideas regarding
political forms, always supportive of individual Liberty.
OK, now everyone read "The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress" by
Robert Heinlein. It's his best single work on revolution
and self government, and a hell of a good aventure yarn
besides. "Revolt In 2100" is another great tale of the struggle against tyrrany. There'll be a quiz next Wednesday!
What price on that?
Iraqi: "Is it true that only 13% of American kids can find Iraq on a map?"
American reporter: "Yes, but all 13% are Marines"