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separation of church and state
rcdis
Member Posts: 994 ✭✭✭✭
It seems I remember reading a thread that stated there was no mention of separation of church and state in the Constitution or in the words of the founding fathers. If I am not stating the meaning of the posters correctly, please forgive a weakened mind, drain bammage you know.
Any way I thought I would pass this on:
<<"Believing... that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their Legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between Church and State." --Thomas Jefferson to Danbury Baptists, 1802. ME 16:281 >>
http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/jefferson/quotations/jeff1650.htm
rcdis
Any way I thought I would pass this on:
<<"Believing... that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their Legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between Church and State." --Thomas Jefferson to Danbury Baptists, 1802. ME 16:281 >>
http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/jefferson/quotations/jeff1650.htm
rcdis
Comments
Why do so many feel separation of church and state is a bad thing? Does England have separation? I know Henry VIII made his own church just to get some new trim legally. What if Obama gets elected? Would everyone like it if he could make his own state run religion? What about that Mormon dude? Would that be cool?
Look at the Iranians and Afgans. They don't/didn't have separation. I guess we could beat all the rednecks and rappers that wear ball caps inside a dining facility like McDonalds or a hospital since that is disrespectful to god and man. Forget about hunting or watching ballgames on Sunday too. Got cable? Imagine 160 channels all filled with Pat Robertson from 0001 Sunday morning to 0001 Monday morning.
The Communist didn't have separation of church and state either. They left out the church and you just worshipped the state. "Read a bible, go to jail". How many want to give the government the power to sponsor their god? If you give them the power to sponsor, you must also give them the power not to sponsor. Does anyone think if the Democrats gain power, the Christian religion would be at the forefront of diversity training?
It may actually benefit religion not to be hindered by official regulations. How many of you could happily maintain a home with an extra three wives? Forget taking a nap, the "Call to Prayers" is in 30 minutes. What if a Jew or Moslems is elected? Hog farming would be banned. Would eggs and humus become a new breakfast favorite?
Okay, lets hear it from the folks that think the government should sponsor religion, any religion.
That being said, there is no explicit provision in the constitution for separation of Church and State. Jefferson phrased it differently in that quote, the ammendment actually reads "Congress" not "legistlature". The constitution was meant to be binding on the federal government. Nothing said about 'state' as in one of the states of the union.
Now if a State constitution has something like that, it would be a different story.....
Got a new gun for my ex-wife.....pretty good trade, huh?
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For the first time a civilized nation has full gun registration; the streets are safer, the police are more effective, and the rest of the world will follow us into history--Hitler 1937
The"seperation of church and state" quote, is used by the constitutional revisionist to make claim that the 1st amendment bars religion on ALL levels of government in the United States-It doesnt. To understand the intent of the first amendment, one must read the first amendment. And upon reading the first amendment, one MUST conclude that the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT is not to meddle with religious affairs. THe first amendment says NOTHING about the states. As a matter of fact, when the federal government prohibits a state from deciding on issues of religion, it is the federal government that is behaving in an unconstitutional manner, not th state. In a nutshell,only the federal government can be guilty of violating the first amendment, a state can not.
To quote Jefferson:
"In manners of religion, I have considered that its free exercise is placed by the constitution independent of the powers of the general government. I have therefore undertaken, on no occasion, to prescribe the religious exercises suited to it; BUT HAVE LEFT THEM, AS THE CONSTITUTION FOUND THEM, UNDER THE DIRECTION AND DISCIPLINE OF STATE OR CHURCH AUTHORITIES ACKNOWLEDGED BY THE SEVERAL RELIGIOUS SOCIETIES."
-THomas Jefferson
-Second Inaugural Address March4 1805
"Waiting tables is what you know, making cheese is what I know-lets stick with what we know!"
-Jimmy the cheese man
It seems I remember reading a thread that stated there was no mention of separation of church and state in the
You could be referencing my signature that I had for a while that stated, to the effect, that the words "separation of church and state" are not in the constitution, but neither was were the words "right to a fair trial". My point being that many people like to claim that there is no explicit separation and would like to get rid of the concept as a whole, but you can imagine that they'd probably be the first ones to cry foul and call the ACLU if they were denied a right to a fair and just trial. Overall, even if the constitition does not explicitly state something word for word, there are legal precidents determined by it. One needn't look further than the 2nd amendment to realize that (i.e. the debate over the words "well regulated militia").
The intent was apparently, in simple language, enable the free exchange and practice of religious beliefs without government interfearence. Also, I think one might just find some pretty plain language about subsequent legislation ... at any level, superceding the constitution without ammendment by due process.
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