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Looking down the barrel....

204targetman204targetman Member Posts: 3,493
edited June 2008 in General Discussion
I walked up to the counter in a store the other day. Guy standing in front of me had a shoulder holster on overtop of his t-shirt. I was looking directly down the barrel of his .45. Needless to say I stepped to the side. Now I dont want to step on anyones rights. I'm all for carrying. But I did'nt care for this. I wish he would have put it on his side. Or left it in the truck.....
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Comments

  • chappsynychappsyny Member Posts: 3,381 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    The majority of shoulder holsters are horizontal. What's the difference if it's exposed or concealed under a jacket. Guns don't just go off, there's not risk involved in using a horizontal shoulder holster
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  • 204targetman204targetman Member Posts: 3,493
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by chappsyny
    The majority of shoulder holsters are horizontal. What's the difference if it's exposed or concealed under a jacket. Guns don't just go off, there's not risk involved in using a horizontal shoulder holster

    I know guns dont just go off. But I still dont like looking down the barrel. Would be about the same as me sticking a gun in your face. I'm sure you would'nt like it. Just did'nt give a very responsible look. But just my opinion.
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  • steeltoe1978steeltoe1978 Member Posts: 3,248
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by chappsyny
    ...Guns don't just go off...

    ...unless you're a cop teaching a gun safety class with a loaded gun and showing the class how to holster the weapon. [:D][:o)][:D][:o)][:D](see the video(s) of this happening if you haven't already)
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  • WarbirdsWarbirds Member Posts: 16,940 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I tend to think shoulder rigs are for wanna-be hardcore guys who watched to much Miami Vice in the 80's.

    Would you have felt better if he was wearing a jacket and didn't realize he had a shoulder rig on?
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  • royc38royc38 Member Posts: 2,235 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I am a big proponent of the horizontal holster. First, its easier to run with than a belt holster, You can draw from either hand in an emergency if you have to, and someone has to reach up under your arm(awkward) or straight in to try to disarm you. In all my years of executive protection, I have carried a horizontal holster. Others were looked at and evaluated, but for all of those advantages, its always worked for me. And besides that, I did indeed look good carrying it.[8D]
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  • CHEVELLE427CHEVELLE427 Member Posts: 6,750
    edited November -1
    Just think how many have been at your face you couldn't see.

    mine may have been one as most come up to my arm pit
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  • n/an/a Member Posts: 168,427 ✭
    edited November -1
    I prefer a shoulder rig to a belt holster.

    In cold/jacket weather, you will find me with my Galco, "Miami Classic" rig on, most days.
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  • n/an/a Member Posts: 168,427 ✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by CHEVELLE427
    Just think how many have been at your face you couldn't see.

    mine may have been one as most come up to my arm pit
    +1

    If I have a coat on you better believe I have a shoulder rig on too!
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  • mateomasfeomateomasfeo Member Posts: 27,143
    edited November -1
    I could see how that would make you uneasy. One of the biggest rules in gun safety is muzzle safety and awareness.

    I would have stepped to the side myself. If I ever wore one, and I have not, I would avoid having the muzzle pointing at someone.

    Just the way I was trained I guess...
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  • 204targetman204targetman Member Posts: 3,493
    edited November -1
    I understand the function of a shoulder rig. I was just brought up that you never have your weapon pointed at someone unless you intend to shoot them. This kinda violates that lesson. I mean think about it. The barrel of a loaded weapon is pointed directly at you. No matter the function. Thats what it is. If your saying this is O.K. then where do you draw the line? If your at the range and the guy next to you lays his rifle across the table and its pointing at you. Is that O.K. Basically the same thing.
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  • Horse Plains DrifterHorse Plains Drifter Forums Admins, Member, Moderator Posts: 40,236 ***** Forums Admin
    edited November -1
    I agree with Mateo, except I have a shoulder holster and the muzzle points down.
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  • 204targetman204targetman Member Posts: 3,493
    edited November -1
    Originally posted by MT357
    I agree with Mateo, except I have a shoulder holster and the muzzle points down.

    I've never owned a shoulder holster. I assumed they all pointed down. After this encounter. I assumed wrong.
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  • Tech141Tech141 Member Posts: 3,787 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I'm with you. If I can see down the barrel, it's definitely pointed the wrong way. I will NEVER assume that the weapon is in 100% perfect condition and won't fire at any time or is "Unloaded". "Assuming" gets folks killed every week.
    It's not tha I don't trust the person, it's that I DO NOT TRUST them to actually know what they are doing.
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  • n/an/a Member Posts: 168,427 ✭
    edited November -1
    I understand the point being made, but my properly holstered gun is secured and I do not make an effort to turn my back directly toward anyone so that it is pointing at them.

    Speaking facetiously, don't you all know that it ain't polite to stand behind someone?[:o)]

    The same could be said for my properly holstered SOB rig, which points to the left and my properly holstered horizontal cross-draw rig, which also points to my left.

    Accepted carry methods for many. That being said, I don't like to see the bore of any firearm pointed my way either and move if such occurs.

    Final point, there is a difference between a properly holstered handgun and laying a rifle on a bench pointed at someone, I think.
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  • AlpineAlpine Member Posts: 15,092 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Actually a shoulder rig is more comfortable when carrying on a plane. So I found out when I did extratitions.
    ?The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.?
    Margaret Thatcher

    "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."
    Mark Twain
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  • 204targetman204targetman Member Posts: 3,493
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by lt496
    I understand the point being made, but my properly holstered gun is secured and I do not make an effort to turn my back directly toward anyone so that it is pointing at them.

    Speaking facetiously, don't you all know that it ain't polite to stand behind someone?[:o)]

    The same could be said for my properly holstered SOB rig, which points to the left and my properly holstered horizontal cross-draw rig, which also points to my left.

    Accepted carry methods for many. That being said, I don't like to see the bore of any firearm pointed my way either and move if such occurs.

    Final point, there is a difference between a properly holstered handgun and laying a rifle on a bench pointed at someone, I think.



    I dont think there is a difference. If someones carry gun is pointed at you. Its probably got one under the hammer. Who knows about the rifle laying across the table. I dont think either is a good idea. This is something I had never given any thought to until the other day. Just wanted to know what some others thought.
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  • Gregor62Gregor62 Member Posts: 3,144 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by lt496
    I understand the point being made, but my properly holstered gun is secured and I do not make an effort to turn my back directly toward anyone so that it is pointing at them.

    Speaking facetiously, don't you all know that it ain't polite to stand behind someone?[:o)]

    The same could be said for my properly holstered SOB rig, which points to the left and my properly holstered horizontal cross-draw rig, which also points to my left.

    Accepted carry methods for many. That being said, I don't like to see the bore of any firearm pointed my way either and move if such occurs.

    Final point, there is a difference between a properly holstered handgun and laying a rifle on a bench pointed at someone, I think.




    Couldn't agree more! Out of sight, out of mind! This thread reads into the hands of the grabbers.[V] OMG, it could go off!!!
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  • KEVD18KEVD18 Member Posts: 15,037
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by 204targetman
    Originally posted by chappsyny
    I know guns dont just go off. But I still dont like looking down the barrel.Would be about the same as me sticking a gun in your face. I'm sure you would'nt like it. Just did'nt give a very responsible look. But just my opinion.



    not really. if im pointing a gun in your face, i have my hand on it with my finger close to if not on the trigger. if i wearing a gun in a horizontal shoulder rig and pointing towards which nudie mag i want at the counter in a store, my hands arent anywhere near my gun(insert full metak jacket reference here).

    guns that arent in the hands, while they may be facing in a direction, arent being "pointed" in that direction. theres a distinction.

    guns dont go off without the triggers and safeties being manipulated. while this could certainly happen while in the act of drawing or holstering, its rather tough to accomplish while the gun is actually secured in a holster.

    were this person removing or reholstering his weapon, i would have also stepped to the side. but with it just hanging there? no need. do you also feel the need to constantly move your body parts away from the muzzle of your carry gun?
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  • 204targetman204targetman Member Posts: 3,493
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by stubnoid
    quote:Originally posted by lt496
    I understand the point being made, but my properly holstered gun is secured and I do not make an effort to turn my back directly toward anyone so that it is pointing at them.

    Speaking facetiously, don't you all know that it ain't polite to stand behind someone?[:o)]

    The same could be said for my properly holstered SOB rig, which points to the left and my properly holstered horizontal cross-draw rig, which also points to my left.

    Accepted carry methods for many. That being said, I don't like to see the bore of any firearm pointed my way either and move if such occurs.

    Final point, there is a difference between a properly holstered handgun and laying a rifle on a bench pointed at someone, I think.




    Couldn't agree more! Out of sight, out of mind! This thread reads into the hands of the grabbers.[V] OMG, it could go off!!!

    Your right. It does read into the hands of the gun grabbers. People who think their gun wont go off. Thats the people that give the gun grabbers ammunition. Because they sometimes do go off. Thats why we teach kids to keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction....
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  • 204targetman204targetman Member Posts: 3,493
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by KEVD18
    quote:Originally posted by 204targetman
    Originally posted by chappsyny
    I know guns dont just go off. But I still dont like looking down the barrel.Would be about the same as me sticking a gun in your face. I'm sure you would'nt like it. Just did'nt give a very responsible look. But just my opinion.



    not really. if im pointing a gun in your face, i have my hand on it with my finger close to if not on the trigger. if i wearing a gun in a horizontal shoulder rig and pointing towards which nudie mag i want at the counter in a store, my hands arent anywhere near my gun(insert full metak jacket reference here).

    guns that arent in the hands, while they may be facing in a direction, arent being "pointed" in that direction. theres a distinction.

    guns dont go off without the triggers and safeties being manipulated. while this could certainly happen while in the act of drawing or holstering, its rather tough to accomplish while the gun is actually secured in a holster.

    were this person removing or reholstering his weapon, i would have also stepped to the side. but with it just hanging there? no need. do you also feel the need to constantly move your body parts away from the muzzle of your carry gun?


    So how is this different than laying the rifle down at the range pointing towards other shooters. You just cant split hairs here. Its either OK to have a gun pointed towards someone or not. It does'nt matter whether your finger is on the trigger or not. A weapon pointed at someone is just that.
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  • Gregor62Gregor62 Member Posts: 3,144 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by 204targetman
    quote:Originally posted by KEVD18
    quote:Originally posted by 204targetman
    Originally posted by chappsyny
    I know guns dont just go off. But I still dont like looking down the barrel.Would be about the same as me sticking a gun in your face. I'm sure you would'nt like it. Just did'nt give a very responsible look. But just my opinion.



    not really. if im pointing a gun in your face, i have my hand on it with my finger close to if not on the trigger. if i wearing a gun in a horizontal shoulder rig and pointing towards which nudie mag i want at the counter in a store, my hands arent anywhere near my gun(insert full metak jacket reference here).

    guns that arent in the hands, while they may be facing in a direction, arent being "pointed" in that direction. theres a distinction.

    guns dont go off without the triggers and safeties being manipulated. while this could certainly happen while in the act of drawing or holstering, its rather tough to accomplish while the gun is actually secured in a holster.

    were this person removing or reholstering his weapon, i would have also stepped to the side. but with it just hanging there? no need. do you also feel the need to constantly move your body parts away from the muzzle of your carry gun?


    So how is this different than laying the rifle down at the range pointing towards other shooters. You just cant split hairs here. Its either OK to have a gun pointed towards someone or not. It does'nt matter whether your finger is on the trigger or not. A weapon pointed at someone is just that.


    204,

    So, with all this said in discussion. Why did you choose not to say something to the individual? Let's apply it to the range. Education is a key element to ownership............you agree?
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  • 204targetman204targetman Member Posts: 3,493
    edited November -1
    I really did'nt put that much thought into at the time. I just stepped to the side. Later I thought this would make a good topic on here. I was sure many on here carried a shoulder rig. I wanted to see how others felt about it. As I later found out this guy is a retired MP officer. I'd say his opinion would be much the same as the ones on here who carry the shoulder holster. My fingers not on the trigger so its never going to go off. And it probably never will.
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  • 204targetman204targetman Member Posts: 3,493
    edited November -1
    And stubnoid. Your right. I should have said something. This old guy would have probably kicked my *. But I should have said something.
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  • Colt SuperColt Super Member Posts: 31,007 ✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Dave W.
    I tend to think shoulder rigs are for wanna-be hardcore guys who watched too much Miami Vice in the 80's.
    Would you have felt better if he was wearing a jacket and didn't realize he had a shoulder rig on?

    That would be me.

    Doug
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  • dheffleydheffley Member Posts: 25,000 ✭
    edited November -1
    I'm all for the right to carry either openly or concealed, but if they ever give us the right back, I'm carrying concealed. I don't want anyone knowing if I have a gun, and if I do, where to grab for it.
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  • bigdaddyjuniorbigdaddyjunior Member Posts: 11,233
    edited November -1
    After the first 2-3 times looking down the wrong end of a barrel while there is a finger on the trigger it becomes irrelevent. By that time you are more concerned with determining a safe area to have the gun pointing in case it goes off while you are twisting it away from the idiot that picked the wrong guy to stick up. I think bad guys watch too much tv and feel like they have to say something witty when they pull a gun on someone. They also expect the victim to play their part by getting scared and pleading for their life or something. They never expect the gun to be twisted out of their hands or the 'goodnight' right hook to the temple.
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