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headshots unethical
remingtonoaks
Member Posts: 26,251 ✭✭✭
Somebody posted on here that they do nothing but headshots because they don't want to tear up the meat. I'm not going to mention any names or draw attention to the thread that it was said because I don't want to embarrass anybody
The reason why I think head shots are unethical is because just as your trigger breaks the animal that you are shooting can move his head. And if you're shooting point blank is not that big of a deal, because the bullet doesn't take time to travel to get to your target
But if you're shooting hundred 2-3-4 yards and even Beyond it takes some time for that bullet to reach its Target, and if that animal moves his head it could actually just blow off the animals more or upper jaw, were by it will just run away and die of starvation if somebody else doesn't see it and shoot it first
So please, to all those that will do nothing but headshots when they hunt, please stop that practice and become an ethical Hunter
The reason why I think head shots are unethical is because just as your trigger breaks the animal that you are shooting can move his head. And if you're shooting point blank is not that big of a deal, because the bullet doesn't take time to travel to get to your target
But if you're shooting hundred 2-3-4 yards and even Beyond it takes some time for that bullet to reach its Target, and if that animal moves his head it could actually just blow off the animals more or upper jaw, were by it will just run away and die of starvation if somebody else doesn't see it and shoot it first
So please, to all those that will do nothing but headshots when they hunt, please stop that practice and become an ethical Hunter
Comments
I could be wrong but I think the bullet is move faster than the speed of sound.
Much faster
Speed of sound in air is 1125 FPS
Most 30-06 165gr bullets are faster than 2600 FPS.
As far as head shot on game being unethical I am not so sure. I say it depends
1. On the animal
2. The skill of the shooter
I have headshot a bunch of deer but most were within 100 yds. Shooting at varmints I have tried headshots out to 500 yds.
I could be wrong but I think the bullet is move faster than the speed of sound.
You are right there, but like I said in my post that the deer could move his head as the trigger is breaking. So therefore as the firing pin strikes, the deer has already moved and even if you are dead on on your shot your target has moved enough to where it's unethical
I've known several people that have shot a deer that had either it's lower or upper jaw shot off by somebody else. I'm sure the other person that blew off the jaw probably was good enough shot that it had the deer not moved his head just prior to the trigger breaking
Coupled with the fact that a minute of angle gun shoots 1 inch diameter from where you're aiming at a hundred yards, at 200 yards it's a couple of inches 300 yards it's even more at 400 yards you're four inches off. And a couple inches on a small Target could mean disaster
Of course same would say it's unethical to shoot them at all.
Should I use the same criteria when hunting squirrels, rabbits, birds, coyotes?
Ethics are your own, but then, so are opinions.
A headshot step forward will probably result in a miss.
A shoulder shot will probably lead to a gut shot. Those are nasty, and rarely lead to a DRT recovery... if there is one at all.
If the headshot shot is there, I don't see an issue with taking it.
I should probably add that the unemployment rate in that township back than was almost 50% and every deer got eaten.
I wont go into details but I tried 2 head shots. The first was great. The second made me swear to myself that never again would I do a head shot.
Nothing like making a precision shot. I usually try to aim just below the eye..about .758250 DRT... [:D]
You have the advantage of sighting in 6" above the corn pile, so it is ethical in your case.
Brad Steele
quote:Originally posted by PacMan
I could be wrong but I think the bullet is move faster than the speed of sound.
You are right there, but like I said in my post that the deer could move his head as the trigger is breaking. So therefore as the firing pin strikes, the deer has already moved and even if you are dead on on your shot your target has moved enough to where it's unethical
I've known several people that have shot a deer that had either it's lower or upper jaw shot off by somebody else. I'm sure the other person that blew off the jaw probably was good enough shot that it had the deer not moved his head just prior to the trigger breaking
Coupled with the fact that a minute of angle gun shoots 1 inch diameter from where you're aiming at a hundred yards, at 200 yards it's a couple of inches 300 yards it's even more at 400 yards you're four inches off. And a couple inches on a small Target could mean disaster
You could also say shooting a deer in the * is unethical..because you could give him the "piles".....are gut shot are etc...etc.. etc...any deer hunter has messed up shots period, and if you say you haven't ......your competing with Jesus...
Never had a problem.
http://forums.GunBroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=700194
[/quote]
HAHAHAHAHA! That was awesome!
always thought I would want to die quick if it is my time to die
quote:Originally posted by remingtonoaks
Somebody posted on here that they do nothing but headshots because they don't want to tear up the meat. I'm not going to mention any names or draw attention to the thread that it was said because I don't want to embarrass anybody
The reason why I think head shots are unethical is because just as your trigger breaks the animal that you are shooting can move his head. And if you're shooting point blank is not that big of a deal, because the bullet doesn't take time to travel to get to your target
But if you're shooting hundred 2-3-4 yards and even Beyond it takes some time for that bullet to reach its Target, and if that animal moves his head it could actually just blow off the animals more or upper jaw, were by it will just run away and die of starvation if somebody else doesn't see it and shoot it first
So please, to all those that will do nothing but headshots when they hunt, please stop that practice and become an ethical Hunter
Here, I'll post it for you. You also missed half of my point, but I've always thought of you as a halfwit. [8]
http://forums.GunBroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=700194
And now for a response in the form of a profanity-laced tirade, calling you everything and nothing simultaneously.[;)]
Here, I'll post it for you. You also missed half of my point, but I've always thought of you as a halfwit. [8]
http://forums.GunBroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=700194
HAHAHAHAHA! That was awesome!
[/quote]Man,your sure hard on ole Remington....257 Weatherby is a deer killer period...I shot one in the flap of the ear, and it died instantly..speed kills...
quote:Originally posted by select-fire
Nothing like making a precision shot. I usually try to aim just below the eye..about .758250 DRT... [:D]
You have the advantage of sighting in 6" above the corn pile, so it is ethical in your case.
Data from Hornady is out of 24" barrel. From my 25/06 26" long range Remington you can add 150 more FPS out of the muzzle. You are exactly 6" or the second line down on the drop compensating scope. Not much of a shot at 300.
https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/rifle/25-06-rem-117-gr-sst-superformance#!/
I take the shots in the vitals, whether that is with a bow, a crossbow, a muzzle loader or a rifle big or small. I do head shots on raccoons in the live trap, but that's not sporting, just eliminating problems for sheep, turkeys, my barn and the like.
Maybe if I was as good at head shots as others above I'd shoot trap with a .22 instread of a 12 gauge too, save a lot of money at that I bet!
I guess I'm not a precision shooter like some folks are above this post. I wish I was. But I seem to do ok, I did have to shoot a coyote twice with a .17 though.
I take the shots in the vitals, whether that is with a bow, a crossbow, a muzzle loader or a rifle big or small. I do head shots on raccoons in the live trap, but that's not sporting, just eliminating problems for sheep, turkeys, my barn and the like.
Maybe if I was as good at head shots as others above I'd shoot trap with a .22 instread of a 12 gauge too, save a lot of money at that I bet!
....don't shoot trap,but I do shoot "Skeet" with a 22 short...
When hunting big game I have found it generally most effective to target the heart and lungs of the animal be it with bow or gun. I also know there are scenarios and circumstances when other options are appropriate and do not consider it unethical to use them.
Some of you remind me of the liberal with their nose in the air, disgusted that anyone could possible not agree with them. Much like the ones trying to remove the confederate memorials and rewrite history. Your ethics should be everyone's ethics, because, well, you said so.
If, in your discretion, and perhaps abilities, you think it wise to only shoot boiler room shots and choose to not use other options, I support you. You should do it your way, within your comfort zone. It is what I teach new hunters, as, like I've written, "When hunting big game I have found it generally most effective to target the heart and lungs of the animal be it with bow or gun." However that is not the only way, nor is it always the best.
Tearing down other hunters is not going to further the activity, it will, however, help to destroy it.
We all know it is unethical to hunt, but if you are going to hunt it is extremely unethical to hunt with lead based ammunition. Only non-lead non-toxic ammunition should be used as it is unethical to possibly expose any living creator to lead. It is also unethical to hunt mountain lion, but it is especially unethical to hunt them using dogs, the same goes for bears. Of course all leg hold traps and snares of any form are unethical. We know this, among other unethical things, because we were, and are, told this by genuine California liberals, who are the gate keepers of all things ethical.
When hunting big game I have found it generally most effective to target the heart and lungs of the animal be it with bow or gun. I also know there are scenarios and circumstances when other options are appropriate and do not consider it unethical to use them.
Some of you remind me of the liberal with their nose in the air, disgusted that anyone could possible not agree with them. Much like the ones trying to remove the confederate memorials and rewrite history. Your ethics should be everyone's ethics, because, well, you said so.
If, in your discretion, and perhaps abilities, you think it wise to only shoot boiler room shots and choose to not use other options, I support you. You should do it your way, within your comfort zone. It is what I teach new hunters, as, like I've written, "When hunting big game I have found it generally most effective to target the heart and lungs of the animal be it with bow or gun." However that is not the only way, nor is it always the best.
Tearing down other hunters is not going to further the activity, it will, however, help to destroy it.
Wonder how some would react if they witnessed a Kosher or Hala killing?
And I guarentee you this I have seen far more legshot and guy shot deer running around or dead and never found by the hunter than I ever saw missing a jaw.
If we are going to dictate others shooting I saw we ban off hand shooting, you can only shoot with an approved rest. No more running shots either, poor deer getting gut shot, * shot and legs blown off.
Maybe we should just ban hunting all together because people can't be trusted to make a clean lethal shot every single time.
Working dairy farms as a young teen and into my 20s part time I've killed more crop damage deer with a .22 mag to the head off of a spotlight than most of you will ever kill with a rifle and every single one of them dropped in thier tracks. Can you guarentee that with a heart shot? Nope!
Hey, what about archery hunting?!? Do you understand how an arrow kills? The deer dies by blood loss or choking on blood in its lungs. A bullet uses shock to destroy organs, an arrow while destroying organs relies on blood loss and a deer may live for several minutes choking on its own blood with even the best shot to both lungs. Maybe that should be stopped as well.
quote:Originally posted by SCOUT5
We all know it is unethical to hunt, but if you are going to hunt it is extremely unethical to hunt with lead based ammunition. Only non-lead non-toxic ammunition should be used as it is unethical to possibly expose any living creator to lead. It is also unethical to hunt mountain lion, but it is especially unethical to hunt them using dogs, the same goes for bears. Of course all leg hold traps and snares of any form are unethical. We know this, among other unethical things, because we were, and are, told this by genuine California liberals, who are the gate keepers of all things ethical.
When hunting big game I have found it generally most effective to target the heart and lungs of the animal be it with bow or gun. I also know there are scenarios and circumstances when other options are appropriate and do not consider it unethical to use them.
Some of you remind me of the liberal with their nose in the air, disgusted that anyone could possible not agree with them. Much like the ones trying to remove the confederate memorials and rewrite history. Your ethics should be everyone's ethics, because, well, you said so.
If, in your discretion, and perhaps abilities, you think it wise to only shoot boiler room shots and choose to not use other options, I support you. You should do it your way, within your comfort zone. It is what I teach new hunters, as, like I've written, "When hunting big game I have found it generally most effective to target the heart and lungs of the animal be it with bow or gun." However that is not the only way, nor is it always the best.
Tearing down other hunters is not going to further the activity, it will, however, help to destroy it.
Wonder how some would react if they witnessed a Kosher or Hala killing?
And I guarentee you this I have seen far more legshot and guy shot deer running around or dead and never found by the hunter than I ever saw missing a jaw.
If we are going to dictate others shooting I saw we ban off hand shooting, you can only shoot with an approved rest. No more running shots either, poor deer getting gut shot, * shot and legs blown off.
Maybe we should just ban hunting all together because people can't be trusted to make a clean lethal shot every single time.
Working dairy farms as a young teen and into my 20s part time I've killed more crop damage deer with a .22 mag to the head off of a spotlight than most of you will ever kill with a rifle and every single one of them dropped in thier tracks. Can you guarentee that with a heart shot? Nope!
Hey, what about archery hunting?!? Do you understand how an arrow kills? The deer dies by blood loss or choking on blood in its lungs. A bullet uses shock to destroy organs, an arrow while destroying organs relies on blood loss and a deer may live for several minutes choking on its own blood with even the best shot to both lungs. Maybe that should be stopped as well.
Right on Lonnie!
It's totally ethical to smack 'em with a Vista Cruiser, mow 'em down with a Harley, run 'em over with a Semi, or shoot 'em inna head; the garbage that comes from Progressively thinking like a Libloonlefty would have hunters dropping leaflets before the hunt, and building safe spaces for Bambi.
Just because this particular food source is ambulatory doesn't mean it has to be treated more or less special; that's the kind of reasoning that brought us shotgun-only deer hunting.
Also, the head is constantly moving; if startled, the first thing to jerk away is the head.
I shoot a lot of deer a year, usually 7-8. Mostly does.
I use all the meat, for the most part.
I don't like deer ribs, but will bone them out and grind.
I always aim for lungs, because if I ruin a skosh of rib meat, no biggie.
There is a whole bunch of really good meat on the neck of a deer, that I grind up for homemade sausage, and regular ground meat.
Neck shots do to much damage for my tastes.
But I'm not butchering or eating your deer, you are.
It just has no effect on my life, but I will support whatever other hunters are comfortable with doing for themselves.
Bickering and fighting does no good, and only adds fuel for the antis.
a stranger in a hopeless search for a deer he hit. Where he
said it was standing, there was blood spatter, a piece of
jawbone and a few teeth. Pretty grim scene.