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I want a sub machine gun.

offerorofferor Member Posts: 8,625 ✭✭
edited December 2003 in General Discussion
I have an increasingly strong practical interest in having one submachine gun in my collection. Since I met the Class III dealer today at the gun show with the $2000 Ingram Mac-10 .45 automatic in his case, it has only solidified a thought that has been buzzing around for quite some time. I like the .45. I like the Uzis, of course, but I'm starting to like the Macs a lot more than I used to, since they are not the "tin boxes" I once imagined. They are actually, as the user manual boasts, somewhat "revolutionary" in terms of reliability, and size. And they are robust, after all. Many of the more expensive Uzis I might find in full auto would be 9mm guns. So with a .45 Mac-10 staring me in the face, I find it hard to believe I'd be happier with a Mini-Uzi in 9mm that cost me 5 grand.

Now, at one time the idea of a machine gun for home defense was quite a stretch. The shotgun is still just about as good as it gets, up to the point of multiple reloads, at least. As time goes on, though, I consider it less and less of an oddity to think about acquiring one submachine gun to complement my home battery of arms. It's small enough, and the cartridge is only a handgun round. It could serve practically in a number of those emergency scenarios we all agree will probably never happen, but just in case...

I find myself running through the options in my head, like people run chess moves, to see what the chances are of putting enough "dough" together. I've got the OA-98 ($1100 on a good day, $1000 minimum), the excellent condition pre-ban Norinco AKM Type 56 w/bayonet which I have heard might be worth the better portion of the other half of the money. And I also have the SWD M-11/9mm semi-auto in near new condition, which I could probably live without if I had a full auto in .45ACP.

I realize the .45 is a challenge to shoot, compared to the 9, but if I put the usual barrel extender, or even a silencer, on the fore end I should be able to control it. I could then acquire long stick mags as I could afford them, as they became available. Of course there's the tax stamp money, which I consider "miscellaneous" at this point. The bigger challenge is making a $2000 deal, finding the liquidity. Of course, I have lots of money wrapped up in music equipment, but I use most of that for income, so I might sell a few extra pieces but not the whole shebang.

I wouldn't be surprised if the dealer does NOT sell that Mac tomorrow, and he will still have it back in Decatur. I got his business card, and I will give him a call and talk about how he works his deals, the waiting period, any trade-in options, etc. I have a feeling that if I really wanted to let go of the OA-98, the Chicom AK, and the M-11 pre-ban, they could get me a Mac-10 sub-gun for personal defense. And that's all Indiana requires to own one, assuming the investigation proves me to be a person of good repute.

T. Jefferson: "[When doing Constitutional interpretation], let us [go] back to the time when [it] was adopted. [Rather than] invent a meaning [let us] conform to the probable one in which it was passed."

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Comments

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    Rafter-SRafter-S Member Posts: 2,173 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I have 4 Class 3 guns, one being a Mac 10. For me, once the new wore off, they are no big deal. Now I shoot them on the average once every 3 years.

    Be sure to learn all the regulations that go with Class 3 guns...such as keeping the paperwork with the gun, traveling out of state with it, etc. They can be a lot more hassle than a good shotgun complimented with a Colt 1911.

    Respectfully,
    Rafter-S
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    ElMuertoMonkeyElMuertoMonkey Member Posts: 12,898
    edited November -1
    I say go for it. Parts are not that hard to get ahold of and nothing says, "Get out of my house" to an intruder like a short burst of 45 ACP.

    Besides, in the world of toys, there's cool toys and then there's cooler toys. Class III is definitely cooler.
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    WarbirdsWarbirds Member Posts: 16,845 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Trading and moving some stuff around for your basic, 45 ACP home defense machine gun, YOUR my kind of Guy!




    R/

    Dave


    How different the world would be if we could consult the veteran instead of the politician. - Henry Miller
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    woodsrunnerwoodsrunner Member Posts: 5,378 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    If my state would allow classIII weapons, I would love a DeLisle from WWII. A nice suppressed modified SMLE in 45acp. Sure it's a bolt action, but it's a very quiet bolt action.

    After that I'd want a lewis gun!

    Woods

    It's better to die on your feet, than to live on your knees.
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    Gibbs505Gibbs505 Member Posts: 3,175
    edited November -1
    So do I <sigh>, some hope up here in the north.[V]
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    pickenuppickenup Member Posts: 22,844 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Now if you even consider getting rid of the OA-98, I might be able to come up with SOMEONE who might be interested. Depending on the final price and what accessories come with it. It is in, unfired, LNIB condition, right?

    Since I could not find my H&K Expert locally, I finally had to bite the bullet and buy it from out of state. Which meant that I had to go through the background check finally, (how long has that been in effect?) and have my name added to the list (that they are NOT keeping) So what is the difference of having my name added to a list AGAIN, that does not exist. LOL

    As far as UZIs and Mac 10s? If they are semi-auto, they are not my pistol of choice. What is fun about shooting a BOX. But now if they will rock and roll? That makes them a whole different critter. Personally I would opt for the MP-5, just love shooting that one. It is the $12,000? price tag that would slow me down on it.


    The gene pool needs chlorine.
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    Colt SuperColt Super Member Posts: 31,007
    edited November -1
    I intend to buy an integrally silenced, full-auto 10-22.

    Really, really, want one.

    Don't know why, just do.

    God Bless America and...
    NEVER Forget WACO
    NEVER, EVER Forget 911
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    Big Sky RedneckBig Sky Redneck Member Posts: 19,752 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Welcome to the club, I have been wanting a Class III gun for quite awhile but the price is keeping me from doing it right now. The Mac you want is quite cheap in price compared to what I want. I want an M16 full auto, when you find them the price is nothing short of HOLY COW! If I buy a Class III weapon it will be what i want or nothing, no Macs for me, I WANT MY M16!

    BTW, I had a conversation with the Class III dealer here one day after he got his registered sawedoff double barrel shotgun (He carries this thing is a holster it is so small!) about using it for defense and he told me that under no circumstanses is it cool to shoot someone with a Class III gun, doing so will open up a can opf worms you do not want and all other rules of self defense shooting go out the window when you use that gun, in short he said it will make you an instant criminal for using it. Not sure exactly how he means that but the man has been dealing in the types of weapons for a long time to LEO and civilians so I kinda listen when he talks.

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    select-fireselect-fire Member Posts: 69,453 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Sell you OA-98 and buy the Mac !! You won't regret it. In the .45 they are a handful.
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    Smokeeater 38Smokeeater 38 Member Posts: 2,735
    edited November -1
    7mm nut,

    I was wondering about that fact if you have to shot someone with a class III weapon. I could see it as being viewed as over kill and bloodthirsty. Not the way you want to be viewed in court.





    Get the job done and come home safe guys.

    I rush in where others flee.
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    mark christianmark christian Forums Admins, Member, Moderator Posts: 24,456 ******
    edited November -1
    Purchase or swap whatever will make you happy Steve (I don't like MAC's- surprise). One thing I will tell you is that even mentioning the use of a machinegun for self defense purposes as a private citizen will cuase you nothing but trouble so just keep the shotgun handy and lock up the MAC if push comes to shove. I have retricted LEO sales samples of all types and would NEVER consider the use of such weapons for self defense...I'd grab one of my own Bushmasters before reaching for a Colt M4 or 9mm AR-15!

    Mark T. Christian
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    wizard78wizard78 Member Posts: 3,144
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by SaxonPig
    Gee, I would think that using a machine gun on a sub would be risky.



    Cute.[;)] I miss the northern sayings, down here it would be called a "hogie machine gun" [:D]

    Do it offeror, I haven't rock and rolled in a while and I do miss it. [8D]

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    Fight Crime, Shoot First
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    mudgemudge Member Posts: 4,225 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I've also been told (by a LEO) that if you use a Class III weapon for self defense, you'd better have the phone # of the best lawyer you know of handy because you WILL need one. I asked him: "What if that's the only gun you own?" His reply: "Is that the only firearm you own? Nobody owns only a Class III weapon and nothing else."
    I'm sure he's right.
    The handgun is only to hold 'em off while you get to the shotgun.

    Mudge the cautious

    I can't come to work today. The voices said, STAY HOME AND CLEAN THE GUNS!
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    HARDRIGHTHARDRIGHT Member Posts: 48 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I must warn you, the Mac10 I purchased years ago was a stepping stone into the class3 addiction. Trust me...you buy one class3, you'll be wanting more. Most of the day I ponder thoughts of how to obtain more money to acquire more class3's.

    You buy that Mac in 45 acp and I bet your next purchase will be a can for it. I just mailed in my forms for a Gemtech can...now the wait begins. Nice thing about the .45 is you don't have to use sub-sonic ammo.




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    offerorofferor Member Posts: 8,625 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Well, I have learned a couple things from the latest comments on this thread.

    1. Saxon and wizard should get married. [:D]
    2. Planning on buying a sub-gun for home defense is not a very good plan, after all. If all I'm going to do is add one to my collection for rock 'n roll plinking, I can afford to slow down a bit and not gut my collection in order to snap one up. I've never wanted to be the most cool plinker at the local outdoor range.

    My interest is purely, shall we say, homeland security-related, i.e. practical. But I don't see any Al Qaeda crossing the Macinac (?) Bridge from Canada into Michigan quite yet, so I guess there's no rush. On the other hand, $2000 for an Ingram Mac-10 w/wire folder is still a heckuva fair price -- around here, anyway.

    As far as home invasion goes, I guess maybe a hi-cap shotgun and a load of 8 rounds of #1 buck is still my favorite option (16 .30 cal shot going downrange per pull).

    T. Jefferson: "[When doing Constitutional interpretation], let us [go] back to the time when [it] was adopted. [Rather than] invent a meaning [let us] conform to the probable one in which it was passed."

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    RosieRosie Member Posts: 14,525 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Just try to control one of those suckers! You will kill half the neighborhood!
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    njretcopnjretcop Member Posts: 7,975
    edited November -1
    No sir, not me brother!

    I don't want any gun that is sub standard, even a machine gun. If I can't afford one that's up to specs, I wouldn't buy one. [;)][:D][:D]

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    Charlie

    "It's the stuff dreams are made of Angel"NRA Certified Firearms InstructorMember: GOA, RKBA, NJSPBA, NJ area rep for the 2ndAMPD. njretcop@copmail.com
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    Spring CreekSpring Creek Member Posts: 1,260
    edited November -1
    Go for it!
    I've had more fun with my recently acquired UZI SMG than I would have ever realized.
    Once you get past the fingerprinting and Form IV waiting, you'll want a suppressor or two (Or maybe more) and certainly another SMG in a .223.
    They are just plain "Catching".
    My wife had a call within the last 15 minutes from a neighbor, wondering if I was out playing again with my "Machine Gun" or if a
    War had broken out.
    A Sunday afternoon without Full-Auto weapons fire would not be complete, for me!
    Oh the joys of living in a "Rural" environment.
    RAT-A-TAT-TAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    JOIN THE NRA
    SUPPORT THE NRA
    NRA Benefactor Life Member
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    HARDRIGHTHARDRIGHT Member Posts: 48 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    This thread must have motivated the ATF to approve my tax stamp.
    I got my Gemtech can today!


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    PhillybillyPhillybilly Member Posts: 328 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    that was my dads first class III item. for the gun and the suppressor it was around 2300 after taxes and stamps. very fun guns. now you need to go out and get a second job to feed it[:D]

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    Say hello to my little friend
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