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I hate getting into arguments about guns w/ uneduc

ruger270manruger270man Member Posts: 9,361 ✭✭
edited October 2004 in General Discussion
I hate getting into arguments about gun rights with people that are ill-informed about the subject. It seems like everyday, whether it be in real life, or on a forum, I'm either talking to someone about the importance of guns, the importance of the 2nd, why people should be allowed to own certain guns, why John Kerry does not support guns, etc etc..

its really annoying.. BUT.. it feels good, when after you keep at it with one person, show them the facts, and you change their mind. Then its all worth it.

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www.awbansunset.com

"I will no longer debate a liberal because I feel they are beneath contempt. Just communicating with one contaminates a person." - whiteclouder

"If the existing assault weapons ban expires, I personally do not believe it will make one whit of difference one way or another . . . So if it doesn't pass, it doesn't pass." Tom Diaz, Senior Policy Analyst, Violence Policy Center (VPC)
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Comments

  • Ray BRay B Member Posts: 11,822
    edited November -1
    As a hunter education instructor I'm aware of classes given in the urban areas that will be frequented by members of PETA, PAWS, etc. Usually conversations with them are fruitless since they refuse to allow facts to get in the way of their opinions. As a result, such visits usually end by asking the people to leave or in more extreme cases, having the local law enforcement ask them to leave. It would be nice to find those that are open minded enough to rationally discuss the issues.
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  • rimfire72rimfire72 Member Posts: 901 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Liberal does not = open minded.
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  • ElMuertoMonkeyElMuertoMonkey Member Posts: 12,898
    edited November -1
    Rimfire,

    Yeah, like so many conservatives are "open minded." Gimme a break... "conservatives" are just as sheeplike as "liberals." Anyone who can describe themself in one word or less is a tool.

    Ruger270,

    Talking with anti-gun folks is, at times, like talking to a brick wall. But I have had the good fortune to educate and "convert" (so to speak) several formerly hostile folks. Education with guns, as in all things, is the key. I could not agree with your post more.
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  • Henry0ReillyHenry0Reilly Member Posts: 10,892 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by ruger270man
    I hate getting into arguments .... with people that are ill-informed...

    It's not much fun arguing with the ill-informed on any topic.

    avitar.jpg
    Semper Fi

    Remember Ruby Ridge.

    What if there were no hypothetical questions?

    Not a member at the auction? Join Gunbroker at this link!
    I used to recruit for the NRA until they sold us down the river (again!) in Heller v. DC. See my auctions (if any) under username henryreilly
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  • hughbetchahughbetcha Member Posts: 7,801 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Once they become convinced of the connection between guns and violence, there is no reasonaing with them, the issue becomes too emotional to deal with rationally. In their mind, if you are for guns, you are for violence.
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  • matwormatwor Member Posts: 20,594
    edited November -1
    Fact of life, some people just don't "get it" Our local news has a spot they call "Word on the Street", this is where they interview people at random on the street and ask their opinions on certain issues. When the AWB sunset they did this and one of the idiots they interviewed said, when asked if it was a good thing or not, and I quote, "I don't think it is a good thing, because, well, I mean do we really want automatic weapons walking around the streets anyway?"

    Makes me so mad I could spit nails.

    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

    Edmund Burke
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  • matwormatwor Member Posts: 20,594
    edited November -1
    Fact of life, some people just don't "get it" Our local news has a spot they call "Word on the Street", this is where they interview people at random on the street and ask their opinions on certain issues. When the AWB sunset they did this and one of the idiots they interviewed said, when asked if it was a good thing or not, and I quote, "I don't think it is a good thing, because, well, I mean do we really want automatic weapons walking around the streets anyway?"

    Makes me so mad I could spit nails.

    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

    Edmund Burke
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  • Mr.PissyPantsMr.PissyPants Member Posts: 3,575
    edited November -1
    quote:Anyone who can describe themself in one word or less is a tool.Tell that to all the "PATRIOTS" who fought and died to maintain our freedoms.

    The above is the most close minded and illogical statement I have ever read.

    Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.
    -Benjamin Franklin
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  • Shootist3006Shootist3006 Member Posts: 4,171
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Mr.PissyPants
    quote:Anyone who can describe themself in one word or less is a tool.Tell that to all the "PATRIOTS" who fought and died to maintain our freedoms.

    The above is the most close minded and illogical statement I have ever read.

    Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.
    -Benjamin Franklin


    Hmmmmm, would that be "patriots" supporting the King or the rebels oppossing him?
    Sounds like they still needed at least 2 words - American Patriots or british patriots.

    NRA ENdowment, CRPA Life, Past President NRA Members Council
    Quod principi placuit legis habet vigorem. Semper Fidelis
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  • mudgemudge Member Posts: 4,225 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Touche Mr. Pissypants. OK Deadmonkey...let's hear your rebuttal!

    Mudge the PATRIOT

    I can't come to work today. The voices said, STAY HOME AND CLEAN THE GUNS!<BR>
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  • Mr.PissyPantsMr.PissyPants Member Posts: 3,575
    edited November -1
    I guess "Christians" are also tools then?

    Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.
    -Benjamin Franklin
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  • Hunter375Hunter375 Member Posts: 612 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by ElMuertoMonkey
    Rimfire,

    Anyone who can describe themself in one word or less is a tool.



    So, I am a tool because I can describe myself as a "man"? Do yourself a favor and quit trying to sound philisophically informed-we're not buying.

    Liberal compassion inhibits progress.........think Republican and prosper!
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  • NighthawkNighthawk Member Posts: 12,022 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Were all tools in one way or another,from birth until even after we die.Because then were dead!![:D]No kidding we all are meant for a purpose,the majority of us a good purpose but not all of us are used in a positive way.My 2 cents!

    Rugster




    "Toujours Pret"
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  • greeker375greeker375 Member Posts: 3,644
    edited November -1
    EMM
    I'm not trying to be a smart-* and I certainly don't want to get into a peeing contest, but, (and I'm asking this in all seriousness) when you look in the mirror do you like who you see?






    "the difference between the almost right word and the right word is like the difference between a lightning bug and a lightning bolt" - Mark Twain.
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  • Salvage33Salvage33 Member Posts: 1,182 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    We seem to have gotten off topic here...so am going to attempt to get it back on track! When I have one of these discussions, it usually ends when I ask them if they have ever handled/shot a gun, and would they like to go to the range with me the next time I go and have some fun. The other question that I love to ask them, 'if gun laws work so well, why do police carry guns?' They generally reply that some people don't obey the law and it is necessary for the police to be armed in order to defend themselves. At that point, I can't be dissuaded from laughing and saying, somewhat sarcastically I have to admit, that the gun laws don't work, as all they do is impede the rights of law abiding citizens, and that if the judges would do their jobs, we could get the criminals off the streets. At this point they usually just scream.....and leave me alone.

    However, I have had quite a few take me up on my offer to go to the range and after they see other people, some who they know, shooting and SAFELY handling firearms, their opinions start to change.

    Moral: Take an anti-gunner to the range. IF they don't like it, they can be used as targets!! LOL

    John


    The original point and click interface was made by Smith & Wesson
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  • oldgunneroldgunner Member Posts: 2,466 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I regret to say this, but I've found it doesn't matter what you say. Minds are made up, and stay made up. Anti gunners are anti gunners for life. Pro gunners are pro for life. I'm on the pro side, and not one damn thing in this universe will ever change that. Unfortunately, the other side is just as strong in the other direction.

    There are no bad guns, only bad people.
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  • CrittergitterCrittergitter Member Posts: 2,554 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote: Anyone who can describe themself in one word or less is a tool.



    Now that would be quite a trick. To describe yourself in less than one word.
    "Anyone who can describe themself in one word or less is a tool." EMM
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  • Salvage33Salvage33 Member Posts: 1,182 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    a.....

    does that work for you?

    LOL

    The original point and click interface was made by Smith & Wesson
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  • CrittergitterCrittergitter Member Posts: 2,554 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    No, Savage33....... a is a word!


    Try again.
    "Anyone who can describe themself in one word or less is a tool." EMM
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  • n/an/a Member Posts: 168,427 ✭
    edited November -1
    I would much rather debate/argue with someone who is uneducated, ill-informed or even mis informed than someone who thinks they are educated or informed...

    Reason?....you can, with logic and facts, usually sway the uninformed person, but you cannot sway one who thinks they know it all....and there are many......They are usually wrong...
    The uneducated, ill-informed person usually listen openly and intently, eager to hear your arguement...and then make up their minds....

    Its like clay, the unedcuated being the unmolded clay, waiting to be formed, where as the know it all is already glazed and fired...but he can be smashed to pieces with the right instrument...

    cute_skunk.gif


    Lil' Stinker's Opinion
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  • oldgunneroldgunner Member Posts: 2,466 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    BR, you make an excellent point, and I agree. Unfortunately, when it comes to guns, EVERYONE is an expert, EVERYONE knows what is right. If you grew up with guns and shooting, you have no doubt..YOU are right, guns do no harm, people do. If you don't have guns in your background, they are terrible, fearful, deadly objects to be avoided at all costs. You want no education, you want no thinking, they are the enemy..After all, so many people have died from gunshots.. No listening to reason, no compromise..they are deadly. I know, I've tried. Over and over, God only knows how many times. I no longer try. I am as I am. I tried for at least fifty years. I love my guns, I love to hunt, so I do it. It is not only my way of life, it is my livelihood. I don't convince anyone that I'm right, they will NEVER convince me that I'm wrong.

    There are no bad guns, only bad people.
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  • ruger270manruger270man Member Posts: 9,361 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by oldgunner
    I regret to say this, but I've found it doesn't matter what you say. Minds are made up, and stay made up. Anti gunners are anti gunners for life. Pro gunners are pro for life. I'm on the pro side, and not one damn thing in this universe will ever change that. Unfortunately, the other side is just as strong in the other direction.


    I proved you wrong quite a few times already. [:D]

    GWB_logo_100.gifak.jpg01_american_flag.jpg
    www.awbansunset.com

    "I will no longer debate a liberal because I feel they are beneath contempt. Just communicating with one contaminates a person." - whiteclouder

    "If the existing assault weapons ban expires, I personally do not believe it will make one whit of difference one way or another . . . So if it doesn't pass, it doesn't pass." Tom Diaz, Senior Policy Analyst, Violence Policy Center (VPC)
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  • sharpshooter039sharpshooter039 Member Posts: 5,897 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I always ask any anti-gun person to come shoot with me,I tell them they can not make an honest judgement until they atleast try it once.I have had several take me up on it and they have enjoyed it.you would be surprised how much fun someone that has never fired a firearm can have with a 22.
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  • HappyNanoqHappyNanoq Member Posts: 12,023
    edited November -1
    I just don't take people seriously if they haven't held, handled and shot a gun at least.

    Have brought many friends to the silhouette-targetting range as well as the claytargetting range - all except for one.. had much fun.
    The one that didn't have fun, immediately had a bad shoulder - but that was somewhat cronic to begin with.

    polarbear.gif
    Don't do anything that I've allready done - That'd be just plain STOOOOOOPID.
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  • MuffinmanMuffinman Member Posts: 418 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    You will best be served to just move on to someone that is willing to listen and take a real look at what your showing them. In some cases the ones that are willing can impart something you did not know.

    Anyone that refuses any imput from anybody, Is just looking to argue anyways. They think they got all the answers and want someone to prove it too. You could take them their, Let them touch, taste, feel and see it and they would not believe it!

    "Never let these type of people make there problems yours" they deserve none of my time or my ear, least they currupt my good sense.
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