Shipping using USPS? ATF pointed something out

Locust Fork

I was talking to the inspector about how I ship my guns.....he was telling me that according to his info I was supposed to get an "affadavit from the recipient saying they are allowed to have the firearm." Since I only ship to FFLs I don't think this applies to me, but I wouldn't even know where to begin in dealing with "affadavits." What is that....like a permission slip from their Mother or something? Its always something MORE isn't it....

Jacob2008

On auctions I have looked at, it says they MUST include a note with payment and FFL copy indicating they ARE of legal age and it is their responsibility to check legalities to own said item in their state/county/town... Is that what they mean?

guntech59

That is usually for ammo, not firearms, since the firearm needs a NICS check anyway.

Wulfmann

That is only in a case where the FFL is shipping a handgun through the mail.
Here is a C&P from BATFE regulations on shipping

SHIPPING FIREARMS

You may ship firearms through the U. S. Postal Service. Federal firearm licensees may deposit an unloaded firearm in the mails for conveyance to any officer, employee, agent, or watchman who is eligible under 18 U. S. C. 1715 to receive pistols, revolvers, and other firearms capable of being concealed on the person for use in connection with his or her official duties.

However, any person proposing to mail a handgun must file with the postmaster, at the time of mailing, an affidavit signed by the addressee stating that the addressee is qualified to receive the firearm, and the affidavit must bear a certificate stating that the firearm is for the official use of the addressee. See the current Postal Manual for details. The Postal Service recommends that all firearms be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms.

A nonlicensee may ship a firearm through the U. S. Postal Service. A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own state or to a licensee in any state. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. A nonlicensee may not transfer any firearm to a nonlicensed resident of another state.

A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by carrier to a resident of his or her own state or to a licensee in any state. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm. [18 U. S. C. 922(a)(2)(A) and 922(e), 27 CFR 178.31]

A nonlicensee may ship firearms interstate for his or her use in hunting or other lawful activity. A person may ship a firearm to himself or herself in care of another person in the state where he or she intends to hunt or engage in any other lawful activity. The package should be addressed to the owner. Persons other than the owner should not open the package and take possession of the firearm.

A signature is required each time a firearm is delivered by a shipper, or common or contract carrier to verify the acknowledgment of the receipt of the firearm. A signature of the FFL maintained on file by the shipper is not an acceptable alternative.

mark christian

If you were using Form 4473 Part II, Non Over The Counter (GB member aglore is one of a handful of dealers I know who've ever used that one) that is correct, you'd need a signed affidavit (along with a number of other items) before you could ship. There is nothing in the regulations that mandates dealers provide and affidavit since you cannot hold an FFL if you are prohibited from possessing a firearm.

stickem up

mess governent regulations. how about some freedom in america ?

CaptFun

When in doubt write to the ATF Legal office in Atlanta, they are required to answer in writing and their answer will hold up in Court. What Agent Joe Bob told you???? Not so much...

Locust Fork

Very good idea CaptFun. Its not that I am doing anything wrong....I just don't appreciate that feeling that "they" could think I am. I'd like that "everything is good" feeling you get when you have it in writing.

11b6r

Locust Fork- tell the inspector he should have paid attention in class. That does not apply when shipping to a LICENSED individual, such as an 01 or 03 FFL holder. It applies in the RARE "non-over-the-counter" sale. He needs to read Title 18, Sec 922 of the US Code.

He is in the same category as the OSHA compliance officer that tried to tell me that latex based paint had to be treated as a flammable- since latex will burn.

Most of the really bright folks I deal with are NOT working for a govt agency.

binthere

Dear 11b6r:
I hate to break it to you, but you may want to review the statement "does not apply when shipping to a LICENSED individual, such as an 01 or 03 FFL ." The post office does not consider the O3 FFL as a legitimate addressee. The regulations specifically state that "The mailer must be a licensed manufacturer or dealer mailing to another licensed manufacturer or dealer." A person who holds a C&R license is not a dealer. In other words, C&R dealers are NOT supposed to be using the USPS to send and/or receive handguns. But then perhaps "US Postal Publication 52 - Hazardous, Restricted, and Perishable Mail > 4 Restricted Matter > 43 Firearms > 432 Mailability" may have escaped your recent reading list, especially being such an intelligent person.

Dean Cascio

+1
Dean

quote:Originally posted by binthere
Dear 11b6r:
I hate to break it to you, but you may want to review the statement "does not apply when shipping to a LICENSED individual, such as an 01 or 03 FFL ." The post office does not consider the O3 FFL as a legitimate addressee. The regulations specifically state that "The mailer must be a licensed manufacturer or dealer mailing to another licensed manufacturer or dealer." A person who holds a C&R license is not a dealer. In other words, C&R dealers are NOT supposed to be using the USPS to send and/or receive handguns. But then perhaps "US Postal Publication 52 - Hazardous, Restricted, and Perishable Mail > 4 Restricted Matter > 43 Firearms > 432 Mailability" may have escaped your recent reading list, especially being such an intelligent person.

11b6r

Binthere- I do not believe I used the word MAIL in any part of my post. I did use the term ship. I am very much aware that both USPS and ATF regs sharply retrict mailing of a handgun. Nor did I make reference to handguns per se- nor did the original poster.

Nor have I laid claim to "especially being such an intelligent person". My statement was " Most of the really bright folks I deal with are NOT working for a govt agency". Which, by the way, I'll stand by. I DO know some very bright folks that work for NIOSH and FHWA, but the really sharp folks seem to move to private industry.

So what got YOUR panties in a wad?