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Mortar Question

mowartmowart Member Posts: 1,392 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited June 2008 in General Discussion
I read that Iranian intelligence may already have the GPS coordinates of targets inside the Green Zone, for use if war breaks out.

If you have the target coordinates, how close can you cause those first rounds to hit?

Comments

  • mrseatlemrseatle Member Posts: 15,467 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    how many digits do the coordinates have?
  • Rack OpsRack Ops Member Posts: 18,596 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    <--- Former 81mm mortar crewman

    Depends on several factors, the first being how well the gun was boresighted.

    Even with excellent coordinates, its very rare to bring your first rounds right on target. Unless you have direct line of sight, you're also going to need a forward observer.


    With a good mortar crew and a good FO you should be firing for effect within 3 rounds
  • mowartmowart Member Posts: 1,392 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Personally I don't know how many significant digits. However I do know that Iranian intelligence is considered to be world class so I would say they have the max possible with GPS.
  • dongizmodongizmo Member Posts: 14,477 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by mowart
    Personally I don't know how many significant digits. However I do know that Iranian intelligence is considered to be world class so I would say they have the max possible with GPS.

    What makes you think they would not already be using this info if they had the ability to?
    Don
    The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly, is to fill the world with fools.
  • 11echo11echo Member Posts: 1,008 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I worked with a 4.2 mortar crew, coordinates are just a starting point. You need to have an F.O.(forward observer) to call in corrections ...IF you're looking for "bulleyes". "IF" the balloon went up I'd think "close" would due for Iran. At this point in time, I'm guessing all your hearing is "saber rattling".
  • dtknowlesdtknowles Member Posts: 810 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    For mortors wind is significant as are differences and uncertaintey in elevation for launch site and target. Other atmospherice conditons like barometric pressure and temperature. All these will cause dispursion at the target even if you know the precise location of the launch site and target. Having good coordinates, you probably have good elevation data as well. If you want the first round on target you need to use precision guided munitions. I don't know what the coelition has for counter fire near the green zone but I hope it would be good enough that it would not allow even an unanswered second round. We have radar directed counter fire artillery that should be able to target a launch site following a single tracked round but I think it is really meanth for dealing with heavier threats not man portable mortors so it might not work for shorter range threats.
  • v35v35 Member Posts: 12,710 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    AMF developed the MPQ10 in the '50s to do that job but it didn't work.
    During the subsequent 50+ years I would hope the problems have been solved.
  • mogley98mogley98 Member Posts: 18,291 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Duck
    Why don't we go to school and work on the weekends and take the week off!
  • bigtirebigtire Member Posts: 24,800
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by dtknowles
    For mortors wind is significant as are differences and uncertaintey in elevation for launch site and target. Other atmospherice conditons like barometric pressure and temperature. All these will cause dispursion at the target even if you know the precise location of the launch site and target. Having good coordinates, you probably have good elevation data as well. If you want the first round on target you need to use precision guided munitions. I don't know what the coelition has for counter fire near the green zone but I hope it would be good enough that it would not allow even an unanswered second round. We have radar directed counter fire artillery that should be able to target a launch site following a single tracked round but I think it is really meanth for dealing with heavier threats not man portable mortors so it might not work for shorter range threats.


    +1

    As soon as an enemy round leaves the tube Radar units know exactly where the enemy position is located. They won't get a second round off if the counter firing battery is on it's toes.
  • buschmasterbuschmaster Member Posts: 14,229 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    If you have the target coordinates, how close can you cause those first rounds to hit?

    depends on what they're using, how close they can get, wind conditions, how long they want to stay and adjust their fire. I'd guess they don't want to stick around very long at all. need to figure out model of launcher. but as far as defense goes, like that really matters. I bet all they care about is range.

    What makes you think they would not already be using this info if they had the ability to?

    they don't want to do it yet, obviously

    At this point in time, I'm guessing all your hearing is "saber rattling".

    they probably know everything about the terrain all over iraq, and a good idea of locations, movement patterns, numerical strength, blah blah blah what would make the difference camouflaged installations they didn't find, and if we change movement patterns, supply routes, add/remove troops, sudden hardening of targets, etc. our big stuff is obviously aint going anywhere.
  • TxsTxs Member Posts: 17,809 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by mowart
    I read that Iranian intelligence may already have the GPS coordinates of targets inside the Green Zone, for use if war breaks out.Anyone who downloads Google Earth has enough info to get a decent spotter round.

    As for those radar sites capable of gathering trajectory info for plotting a tube's location, what do you think would be at the top of these mortar's target list? [;)]
  • buschmasterbuschmaster Member Posts: 14,229 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I heard google blanked out or altered the sensitive stuff.

    anyways, the iranians could have easily got close up info with some footwork then meshed it up with nearby coordinates gathered from regular reconnaisance. simple as that.
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