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Bayonet lug question for FFLs not in free states.

kidthatsirishkidthatsirish Member Posts: 6,984 ✭✭✭
edited May 2017 in General Discussion
Ok...i know I'll likely get varied responses as this may vary from new York to New Jersey to California and similar states...but what constitutes the actual bayonet lug.

Back story...
In a gun shop today in....guy had dropped a rifle off with the shop to have a muzzle device of some kind drilled and pinned to the rifle. He leaves...after he leaves one of the employees says to the boss that it has a bayonet lug on it. Apparently those two features together on this particular rifle would not be allowed. So the shop calls the gun owner, the gun owner is put on speaker which I thought was wierd. Says that he already took a Dremel to the particular lug that the bayonet attaches to and that the bayonet can't be attached...i glanced at the rifle and believe that to be true, no way a bayonet would stay in place, it was now just a stub. The dealer told the guy it had to be flush with the barrel. Customer says he would come up, get the rifle, Drexel the rest off and then bring it back. The dealer said he couldn't release it back to him because of the law and that he would have to pay the gunsmith to take it off when be attaches the muzzle device.the guy reluctantly agrees knowing he will be charged now for the extra service.

Does this seem fishy, or is this really how FFLs operate it totalitarian states?

Edit: I edited the title in hopes that some FFL holders would be more inclined to read and respond.

Comments

  • brier-49brier-49 Member Posts: 7,104 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Very fishy. FFl should have refused gun right off.
    He took it in just to make more money.
  • Gunman760Gunman760 Member Posts: 140 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I am not in one of "those" states but in my opinion as an FFL holder, it seems fishy. Since the muzzle brake has not been installed yet, in my world, I would give it back to him to finish the job he started and then have him bring it back to have the muzzle brake installed. Just my .02 cents worth. Terry
  • p3skykingp3skyking Member Posts: 23,916 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    The FFL is incompetent.

    I possess one of a very few HOWA made AR-180's with the handstamped 0.
    It was originally manufactured as a machinegun as certain holes exist and there was some grinding on the internal parts.
    It was designed to take the standard US M-16 bayonet by using the mount with two ears protruding on the rear of the assembly.

    Before the weapon left Japan, the two rear ears of the bayo lug were neatly ground off to comply with then current Japanese law for export. There is now nothing for the bayonet to lock on to. It would have to be duct taped to even stay on the barrel.

    If in fact the weapon is unable to have a bayonet locked on independently of glue, tape, etc., it doesn't have a bayonet lug.

    JMO
  • Locust ForkLocust Fork Member Posts: 32,082 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    The only thing more annoying than a power hungry know it all is a grandstanding power hungry know it all.

    The fact that this guy took it upon himself to grind on someone's rifle before even calling to inform the owner makes me want to fight to make that guy wrong in every way I possibly can.

    He might have been right and the gun might have been a problem, but if it were me I would have called and told him this needed to be gifted to a relative that lived in a state where those were allowed.

    There is a limit to this generosity.....I have a belt fed machine gun story proving that sometimes you just go ahead and call the ATF.
    LOCUST FORK CURRENT AUCTIONS: https://www.gunbroker.com/All/search?Sort=13&IncludeSellers=618902&PageSize=48 Listings added every Thursday! We do consignments, contact us at mckaygunsales@gmail.com
  • kidthatsirishkidthatsirish Member Posts: 6,984 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Locust Fork
    The only thing more annoying than a power hungry know it all is a grandstanding power hungry know it all.

    The fact that this guy took it upon himself to grind on someone's rifle before even calling to inform the owner makes me want to fight to make that guy wrong in every way I possibly can.

    He might have been right and the gun might have been a problem, but if it were me I would have called and told him this needed to be gifted to a relative that lived in a state where those were allowed.

    There is a limit to this generosity.....I have a belt fed machine gun story proving that sometimes you just go ahead and call the ATF.



    I must have not typed it out right....but the owner of the rifle had grinded the bayonet lug before he brought it in...he just left a bit of a stub that would in NO way possible hold a bayonet anymore. The FFL was sensing it to a gunsmith to have the muzzle device put on for the guy. My question was about what actually makes a bayonet lug a bayonet lug, and why the gel dealer couldn't have just given the rifle back to the owner before sending it to the gunsmith?
  • Locust ForkLocust Fork Member Posts: 32,082 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by kidthatsirish
    quote:Originally posted by Locust Fork
    The only thing more annoying than a power hungry know it all is a grandstanding power hungry know it all.

    The fact that this guy took it upon himself to grind on someone's rifle before even calling to inform the owner makes me want to fight to make that guy wrong in every way I possibly can.

    He might have been right and the gun might have been a problem, but if it were me I would have called and told him this needed to be gifted to a relative that lived in a state where those were allowed.

    There is a limit to this generosity.....I have a belt fed machine gun story proving that sometimes you just go ahead and call the ATF.



    I must have not typed it out right....but the owner of the rifle had grinded the bayonet lug before he brought it in...he just left a bit of a stub that would in NO way possible hold a bayonet anymore. The FFL was sensing it to a gunsmith to have the muzzle device put on for the guy. My question was about what actually makes a bayonet lug a bayonet lug, and why the gel dealer couldn't have just given the rifle back to the owner before sending it to the gunsmith?



    I'm sorry....the way I read it the FFL had ground on the bayonet lug and was calling the owner to tell him. You have to go at things pretty significantly when they "destroy" parts. They have outlined the exact way things have to be done. On the ones that I have seen with the bayonet lug removed there was no "nub" at all left....it was a flat area. I'm guessing the FFL just wanted to send it off to the gunsmith and get him to do both jobs so it would be a little more "worth" the gunsmith's time. Most stores don't upcharge for gunsmith services....so I doubt the FFL was trying to get more money out of things. Most places let the gunsmiths pick up items and fix them and in return they have them do a few small jobs. "You rub my back and I'll rub yours" kind of set up.
    LOCUST FORK CURRENT AUCTIONS: https://www.gunbroker.com/All/search?Sort=13&IncludeSellers=618902&PageSize=48 Listings added every Thursday! We do consignments, contact us at mckaygunsales@gmail.com
  • kidthatsirishkidthatsirish Member Posts: 6,984 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Gunman760
    I am not in one of "those" states but in my opinion as an FFL holder, it seems fishy. Since the muzzle brake has not been installed yet, in my world, I would give it back to him to finish the job he started and then have him bring it back to have the muzzle brake installed. Just my .02 cents worth. Terry


    That's kind of what I was thinking.
  • Horse Plains DrifterHorse Plains Drifter Forums Admins, Member, Moderator Posts: 40,242 ***** Forums Admin
    edited November -1
    FFL's porking the gun owner. Pure and simple.
  • dfletcherdfletcher Member Posts: 8,179 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by kidthatsirish
    Ok...i know I'll likely get varied responses as this may vary from new York to New Jersey to California and similar states...but what constitutes the actual bayonet lug.

    Back story...
    In a gun shop today in....guy had dropped a rifle off with the shop to have a muzzle device of some kind drilled and pinned to the rifle. He leaves...after he leaves one of the employees says to the boss that it has a bayonet lug on it. Apparently those two features together on this particular rifle would not be allowed. So the shop calls the gun owner, the gun owner is put on speaker which I thought was wierd. Says that he already took a Dremel to the particular lug that the bayonet attaches to and that the bayonet can't be attached...i glanced at the rifle and believe that to be true, no way a bayonet would stay in place, it was now just a stub. The dealer told the guy it had to be flush with the barrel. Customer says he would come up, get the rifle, Drexel the rest off and then bring it back. The dealer said he couldn't release it back to him because of the law and that he would have to pay the gunsmith to take it off when be attaches the muzzle device.the guy reluctantly agrees knowing he will be charged now for the extra service.

    Does this seem fishy, or is this really how FFLs operate it totalitarian states?

    Edit: I edited the title in hopes that some FFL holders would be more inclined to read and respond.


    The bayonet lug is of no consequence in CA, don't know what state the event happened in.

    I'm in CA, I'm not an FFL. I enjoy the heck out of going to local gun stores and as much as possible buy local. FFLs in CA have a tough job keeping up with the laws. Having said that ....

    Unfortunately the three little words you'll never hear in a gun store are "I don't know". For some reason there seems to be an almost allergic reaction to those words by nearly anyone working a store. OK, I exaggerate a bit, but not much.

    Perhaps I'm missing something in the above story. The store owner asserts the presence of a bayonet lug with muzzle device puts the rifle in an illegal configuration. However, the gun is in the same configuration as when brought in, with a ground down bayonet lug and no muzzle device - correct? Being in the same condition when delivered, that is a "bayonet lug" but no muzzle device I fail to see why the gun can't be returned to its owner.

    The store owner's position, that he'll attach the device but then require the gunsmith to "properly remove" the lug, is suspicious. Why put the gun into a plausibly illegal configuration when the easiest avenue is to return it untouched? Unless the gunsmith already attached the device and the store owner is attempting to recoup cost?
  • Smitty500magSmitty500mag Member Posts: 13,623 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    That's an FFL that's looking to find out what it feels like to have a bayonet lug stuck up his * and twisted on the way out!
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