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Extreme vetting

Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,695 ✭✭✭✭
edited May 2017 in General Discussion
Trump's original ban on 27 January was to last 90/120 days so they could fix the system.

We are now right at the 120 day mark, and the administration is challenging the 9th circuit's blocking of the second travel ban.

They have had the time requested to evaluate and implement new policies, so are these new policies in place, or are we just restricting laptops?
Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

Brad Steele

Comments

  • Horse Plains DrifterHorse Plains Drifter Forums Admins, Member, Moderator Posts: 40,234 ***** Forums Admin
    edited November -1
    Well he was just over there smoosnhing the terrorists, so I guess it's all good now.
  • Mr. PerfectMr. Perfect Member, Moderator Posts: 66,437 ******
    edited November -1
    Maybe the thought is since both the original and the second have been restricted by the courts there is, in effect, presently no ban and there has been no opportunity to evaluate and implement new policies?

    Parts of it were indefinite anyway.
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    And fiery auto crashes
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    While sifting through my ashes
    Some will fall in love with life
    And drink it from a fountain
    That is pouring like an avalanche
    Coming down the mountain
  • mogley98mogley98 Member Posts: 18,291 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I would be very careful who I allowed to spend the night at my house we should be as careful with tourist and other visitors
    Why don't we go to school and work on the weekends and take the week off!
  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,695 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Mr. Perfect
    Maybe the thought is since both the original and the second have been restricted by the courts there is, in effect, presently no ban and there has been no opportunity to evaluate and implement new policies?

    Parts of it were indefinite anyway.


    My understanding was that the ban was necessary to keep 'bad hombres' out while new policies were being developed and implemented. I do not see how the lack of a ban would slow down or impair this development of new policies in any way.

    If anything, the continuing traffic could be utilized in that incoming immigrants/visitors/workers could be catalogued and categorized so as to help with the structuring of the vetting, targeting etc.
    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
  • Mr. PerfectMr. Perfect Member, Moderator Posts: 66,437 ******
    edited November -1
    I guess it's hard to make new policies when you're fighting court battles.[:I]
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    And fiery auto crashes
    Some will die in hot pursuit
    While sifting through my ashes
    Some will fall in love with life
    And drink it from a fountain
    That is pouring like an avalanche
    Coming down the mountain
  • skicatskicat Member Posts: 14,431
    edited November -1
    IMO the smartest way to extremely vet anyone from those 7 countries is to ban their travel here. Whether Trump and his staff have made any improvements to existing vetting procedures is unknown to me and Don is right we should have seen some suggestions at least by now. Unfortunately he is like a fish swimming upstream in DC to try and accomplish anything. I have no doubt the combined animosity of the D's,R's, and media have drug Trump into quicksand. A shame really, and more of a danger to this country than imagined Russian meddling.
  • Dads3040Dads3040 Member Posts: 13,552 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    It is hard to imagine that after courts managed to concoct a way to stop obviously allowed executive action in the form of a moratorium that any enhanced vetting measures would not face the same non-legally based court decisions.

    Best to get the legal matters straightened out first, or the leftist hamster wheel will just keep spinning.
  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,695 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Dads3040
    It is hard to imagine that after courts managed to concoct a way to stop obviously allowed executive action in the form of a moratorium that any enhanced vetting measures would not face the same non-legally based court decisions.

    Best to get the legal matters straightened out first, or the leftist hamster wheel will just keep spinning.


    I don't see the legal connection. By definition, enhanced vetting would supplant any travel ban, and would have an entirely different set of legal considerations. One would think enhanced vetting would be universal, and would therefore be immune to any challenges of religious or racial preference or profiling. Recent event have shown that we can be at risk from someone with British Passport as well as one from one of these selected countries.

    The travel ban was only temporary to keep us safe until the vetting process could be put into place. If the threat is real, there is no excuse to not have that process ready to implement or at least present as soon as is possible.

    I would hope that the review and recommendation process is well along, but absent any news other than court appeals for a travel ban that would have already expired, I am beginning to wonder if it has been all talk and no action to date.
    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
  • wpageabcwpageabc Member Posts: 8,760 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    If we do not monitor who enters our lands. How do we know who is coming in...

    When someone is knocking at your door. Do you not look and check out who they are?
    "What is truth?'
  • bpostbpost Member Posts: 32,669 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Why the hell bother vetting anyone from ragheadland when you lick the boots, kiss the * of and sell weapons to the biggest group of Islamist terrorists on the globe, the Wahhabi whack-balls running Saudi Arabia?????

    long but interesting read on these evil barbarians.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wahhabism
  • bigoutsidebigoutside Member Posts: 19,443
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
    quote:Originally posted by Dads3040
    It is hard to imagine that after courts managed to concoct a way to stop obviously allowed executive action in the form of a moratorium that any enhanced vetting measures would not face the same non-legally based court decisions.

    Best to get the legal matters straightened out first, or the leftist hamster wheel will just keep spinning.


    I don't see the legal connection. By definition, enhanced vetting would supplant any travel ban, and would have an entirely different set of legal considerations. One would think enhanced vetting would be universal, and would therefore be immune to any challenges of religious or racial preference or profiling. Recent event have shown that we can be at risk from someone with British Passport as well as one from one of these selected countries.

    The travel ban was only temporary to keep us safe until the vetting process could be put into place. If the threat is real, there is no excuse to not have that process ready to implement or at least present as soon as is possible.

    I would hope that the review and recommendation process is well along, but absent any news other than court appeals for a travel ban that would have already expired, I am beginning to wonder if it has been all talk and no action to date.


    Ya think?!? #128521;
  • Dads3040Dads3040 Member Posts: 13,552 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
    quote:Originally posted by Dads3040
    It is hard to imagine that after courts managed to concoct a way to stop obviously allowed executive action in the form of a moratorium that any enhanced vetting measures would not face the same non-legally based court decisions.

    Best to get the legal matters straightened out first, or the leftist hamster wheel will just keep spinning.


    I don't see the legal connection. By definition, enhanced vetting would supplant any travel ban, and would have an entirely different set of legal considerations. One would think enhanced vetting would be universal, and would therefore be immune to any challenges of religious or racial preference or profiling. Recent event have shown that we can be at risk from someone with British Passport as well as one from one of these selected countries.

    The travel ban was only temporary to keep us safe until the vetting process could be put into place. If the threat is real, there is no excuse to not have that process ready to implement or at least present as soon as is possible.

    I would hope that the review and recommendation process is well along, but absent any news other than court appeals for a travel ban that would have already expired, I am beginning to wonder if it has been all talk and no action to date.

    There is no legal connection to the court decisions and legal underpinnings given US 1182. Yet the injunctions were issued. The EO should have been immune. It was not. The amendments to 1182 in 1965 didn't seem to apply to Carter's Iranian deportation and ban in 1979. Why now? Politics. Not the Law.

    For myself, I am wondering if those who are working so hard to impede anything from this administration give a tiny crap about risks to the US from those with British passports or anything else. It sure doesn't appear so. It ought to be obvious that tying up the administration is the silly sheet we have seen cannot avoid but delaying work on important issues. Yet they persist.
  • kimikimi Member Posts: 44,719 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by bpost
    Why the hell bother vetting anyone from ragheadland when you lick the boots, kiss the * of and sell weapons to the biggest group of Islamist terrorists on the globe, the Wahhabi whack-balls running Saudi Arabia?????

    long but interesting read on these evil barbarians.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wahhabism


    Add to that that our politicians have always allowed everybody and their brother John Doe Foreign National to own U. S. Property, and you can see where it all started.
    What's next?
  • kimikimi Member Posts: 44,719 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by bpost
    Why the hell bother vetting anyone from ragheadland when you lick the boots, kiss the * of and sell weapons to the biggest group of Islamist terrorists on the globe, the Wahhabi whack-balls running Saudi Arabia?????

    long but interesting read on these evil barbarians.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wahhabism


    Add to that that our politicians have always allowed everybody and their brother John Doe Foreign National to own U. S. Property, and you can see where it all started.
    What's next?
  • Don McManusDon McManus Member Posts: 23,695 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Dads3040
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
    quote:Originally posted by Dads3040
    It is hard to imagine that after courts managed to concoct a way to stop obviously allowed executive action in the form of a moratorium that any enhanced vetting measures would not face the same non-legally based court decisions.

    Best to get the legal matters straightened out first, or the leftist hamster wheel will just keep spinning.


    I don't see the legal connection. By definition, enhanced vetting would supplant any travel ban, and would have an entirely different set of legal considerations. One would think enhanced vetting would be universal, and would therefore be immune to any challenges of religious or racial preference or profiling. Recent event have shown that we can be at risk from someone with British Passport as well as one from one of these selected countries.

    The travel ban was only temporary to keep us safe until the vetting process could be put into place. If the threat is real, there is no excuse to not have that process ready to implement or at least present as soon as is possible.

    I would hope that the review and recommendation process is well along, but absent any news other than court appeals for a travel ban that would have already expired, I am beginning to wonder if it has been all talk and no action to date.

    There is no legal connection to the court decisions and legal underpinnings given US 1182. Yet the injunctions were issued. The EO should have been immune. It was not. The amendments to 1182 in 1965 didn't seem to apply to Carter's Iranian deportation and ban in 1979. Why now? Politics. Not the Law.

    For myself, I am wondering if those who are working so hard to impede anything from this administration give a tiny crap about risks to the US from those with British passports or anything else. It sure doesn't appear so. It ought to be obvious that tying up the administration is the silly sheet we have seen cannot avoid but delaying work on important issues. Yet they persist.


    This is where Trump is missing the boat, IMO.

    The sideshow that is the 9th Circuit did nothing to impede the work necessary to bring about what has always been stated as the end game. They have not hindered State or DHS from investigating and analyzing best practices regarding vetting. There is not and cannot be a pre-emptive injunction but the objections voiced, which seem to be centered around Trump's pre-election talking points, can be evaluated and circumvented if necessary when crafting the vetting program.

    The obstructionists are out in full force to be sure. They have done nothing that would have prevented the role out of the enhanced vetting process/program in the time requested.

    Where is it?

    The threat has not changed. All that has changed is a virtually unrelated issue has been blocked, and rather than moving forward in the interest of safety as we were led to believe, this administration has chosen to ignore the goal and focus on the distraction.

    Perhaps the goal of laying out a program of enhanced vetting in 120 days was harder than originally thought. It would be nice to know that someone is working on the problem rather than just wasting time on the legal case of the travel ban.
    Freedom and a submissive populace cannot co-exist.

    Brad Steele
  • gunnut505gunnut505 Member Posts: 10,290
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
    quote:Originally posted by Dads3040
    quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
    quote:Originally posted by Dads3040
    It is hard to imagine that after courts managed to concoct a way to stop obviously allowed executive action in the form of a moratorium that any enhanced vetting measures would not face the same non-legally based court decisions.

    Best to get the legal matters straightened out first, or the leftist hamster wheel will just keep spinning.


    I don't see the legal connection. By definition, enhanced vetting would supplant any travel ban, and would have an entirely different set of legal considerations. One would think enhanced vetting would be universal, and would therefore be immune to any challenges of religious or racial preference or profiling. Recent event have shown that we can be at risk from someone with British Passport as well as one from one of these selected countries.

    The travel ban was only temporary to keep us safe until the vetting process could be put into place. If the threat is real, there is no excuse to not have that process ready to implement or at least present as soon as is possible.

    I would hope that the review and recommendation process is well along, but absent any news other than court appeals for a travel ban that would have already expired, I am beginning to wonder if it has been all talk and no action to date.

    There is no legal connection to the court decisions and legal underpinnings given US 1182. Yet the injunctions were issued. The EO should have been immune. It was not. The amendments to 1182 in 1965 didn't seem to apply to Carter's Iranian deportation and ban in 1979. Why now? Politics. Not the Law.

    For myself, I am wondering if those who are working so hard to impede anything from this administration give a tiny crap about risks to the US from those with British passports or anything else. It sure doesn't appear so. It ought to be obvious that tying up the administration is the silly sheet we have seen cannot avoid but delaying work on important issues. Yet they persist.


    This is where Trump is missing the boat, IMO.

    The sideshow that is the 9th Circuit did nothing to impede the work necessary to bring about what has always been stated as the end game. They have not hindered State or DHS from investigating and analyzing best practices regarding vetting. There is not and cannot be a pre-emptive injunction but the objections voiced, which seem to be centered around Trump's pre-election talking points, can be evaluated and circumvented if necessary when crafting the vetting program.

    The obstructionists are out in full force to be sure. They have done nothing that would have prevented the role out of the enhanced vetting process/program in the time requested.

    Where is it?

    The threat has not changed. All that has changed is a virtually unrelated issue has been blocked, and rather than moving forward in the interest of safety as we were led to believe, this administration has chosen to ignore the goal and focus on the distraction.

    Perhaps the goal of laying out a program of enhanced vetting in 120 days was harder than originally thought. It would be nice to know that someone is working on the problem rather than just wasting time on the legal case of the travel ban.


    You fail to realize that there is no "good" news about President Trump in any National publication. As long as the progliblefties are writing the stories (and that's what they write, "stories"), there will never be any coverage of the good things done by Him.
  • ruger41ruger41 Member Posts: 14,665 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Nothing will be done until we have another 9/11 here. Until then it's all talk. bpost is 100% spot on. Giving anything to the Saudi's helps them a hell of a lot more than it helps us.
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