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convince me
callktulu
Member Posts: 3,451 ✭✭✭
Convince me that the President's executive order immigration ban is wrong and different from the similar bans Presidents Obama, Bush, and Clinton enacted during their tenures.
Comments
It was so poorly planned innocent travelers were trapped on arrival here and treated like criminals.
OK, and....? I'm looking more so for reasons why overall, like big picture, no the immediate after-effect. What I'm saying is, before it was even enacted, why was it so bad?
It was so poorly planned innocent travelers were trapped on arrival here and treated like criminals.
I find that claim interesting.
How were they treated like criminals? Were they arrested, cuffed read Miranda Rights and placed in a cell, or were they detained at the airport until the issue of their individual case could be determined?
Also from what I have heard though FOX news this am, this temporary ban (which the libtards and mainstream media is overlooking,) of 90 days will only effect 8% of the Muslims worldwide. (Again) Is this figure incorrect??
Personally, I am all for immigration reform and control.
Unless you are a United States Citizen, you have NO Constitutional right to enter the U.S.
Can we all at least agree on that?
It was so poorly planned innocent travelers were trapped on arrival here and treated like criminals.
Piss on the SOB's. Most of them are criminals anyway!
It was so poorly planned innocent travelers were trapped on arrival here and treated like criminals.
Or...
People who were traveling from countries that support terrorist organizations were slightly inconvenienced.
It was so poorly planned innocent travelers were trapped on arrival here and treated like criminals.
Why should they not go through the vetting process like all the other refugees of the past did.my grandparents had to go through it in the late 1800s, They proud to go through it for the privilege of the freedom that they were getting. They understood that The United States government did not want to let any possible problem people into the country to protect it. The problem with the generations preceding the mid-1900s is that they want everything handed to them on a SilverPlatter without putting any effort into getting it. Going through a betting process is an extremely small price to pay for their freedom they will be getting in the United States.
quote:Originally posted by gartman
It was so poorly planned innocent travelers were trapped on arrival here and treated like criminals.
Why should they not go through the vetting process like all the other refugees of the past did.my grandparents had to go through it in the late 1800s, They proud to go through it for the privilege of the freedom that they were getting. They understood that The United States government did not want to let any possible problem people into the country to protect it. The problem with the generations preceding the mid-1900s is that they want everything handed to them on a SilverPlatter without putting any effort into getting it. Going through a betting process is an extremely small price to pay for their freedom they will be getting in the United States.
we can be treated like criminal and it is ok, but hold them up for a few hours and all hell breaks loose....[xx(]
If they were already in America why would they want to travel back to the cesspool they escaped from?
For any number of reasons, business, family, etc. But what is of concern is those that travel back for jihad training and teaching then returning to the USA. We have already had violence perpetrated in the country buy people that have done just that. That, in part, is what this approach is about as well as keeping out new jihad activist.
I personally think ALL executive orders should have to go in reverse of the normal flow where the house and senate has a chance to veto an executive order just as the president has a chance to veto theirs. Otherwise, if it keeps going as it is with most every president utilizing it more than the last (although calling it something else sometimes), we will get to the point of a voted monarch and other representatives will be useless.
I think the ever-increasing numbers of executive orders have got to stop! They are/were intended for things that needed immediate attention such as wartime. Many of the early executive orders were also then voted on by the house/senate.
I personally think ALL executive orders should have to go in reverse of the normal flow where the house and senate has a chance to veto an executive order just as the president has a chance to veto theirs. Otherwise, if it keeps going as it is with most every president utilizing it more than the last (although calling it something else sometimes), we will get to the point of a voted monarch and other representatives will be useless.
I can definitely agree with all of that. As far as the actual order in question, it sounds to me like we are trying to properly enforce the immigration laws we already have in place. So again, I ask - it this bad or wrong as all the Hollywood and other protesters would have us believe? Convince me!
I think the ever-increasing numbers of executive orders have got to stop! They are/were intended for things that needed immediate attention such as wartime. Many of the early executive orders were also then voted on by the house/senate.
I personally think ALL executive orders should have to go in reverse of the normal flow where the house and senate has a chance to veto an executive order just as the president has a chance to veto theirs. Otherwise, if it keeps going as it is with most every president utilizing it more than the last (although calling it something else sometimes), we will get to the point of a voted monarch and other representatives will be useless.
A lot of things the media calls executive orders are just directives, which anyone running an executive branch will have to do. I agree that any branch of government needs to be kept within the bounds of it's constitutional power and areas of operations, the executive branch included. But the media is blowing this stuff up beyond reality.
i heard they forced them to eat bacon, then washed it down with some waterboarding [;)]
With a side order of electricity.
Over 325,000 people from other countries arrived in the USA yesterday, about 300 where detained for further evaluation and most of them have been admitted, 109 were being looked at further. It is what it is, but it's also not what it's not.
NOW YOU WENT AND DID IT!
You went so far as to post actual verifiable facts of the matter.[:0]
Do you think that helps the snowflakes and Media's cause? [:p][}:)]
I bet you take pacifiers out of babies mouths too, why do you take pacifiers from babies? [;)][:D]
Convince me that the President's executive order immigration ban is wrong and different from the similar bans Presidents Obama, Bush, and Clinton enacted during their tenures.
He made Chucky Schumer cry. [:0] [:I]
The leader of the most powerful democratic republic in the world is trying to run the whole show himself with tweets and executive decisions, completely ignoring the congress elected by the citizens.
That may or may not be the case, but doesn't answer my question as to why this directive or executive order is wrong.
The leader of the most powerful democratic republic in the world is trying to run the whole show himself with tweets and executive decisions, completely ignoring the congress elected by the citizens.
where were you the last 8 years ?
trump is doing exactly what those who elected him want him to do
It was so poorly planned innocent travelers were trapped on arrival here and treated like criminals.
They were inconvenienced, not trapped and treated like criminals.
Had a few judges not stepped in and approved their release, it would have been a problem, but the problem was solved quickly, and moving forward, there is no significant damage.
I agree it was poorly planned, but we have a system whereby one branch of government can step in and make minor corrections to fix a mistake by another branch. In the big picture, the system worked.
Hopefully a little more thought goes into the immediate application of such decrees in the future.
Brad Steele
quote:Originally posted by gartman
The leader of the most powerful democratic republic in the world is trying to run the whole show himself with tweets and executive decisions, completely ignoring the congress elected by the citizens.
That may or may not be the case, but doesn't answer my question as to why this directive or executive order is wrong.
If you haven't gathered from reading The answers to this post, nobody thinks it's wrong. At least here
I must be a raycist
If you haven't gathered from reading The answers to this post, nobody thinks it's wrong. At least here
That's fair, I'm just trying to understand the other side of it, and illicit some legitimate discussion with counter-arguments.
+1 and it made people notice we want our country back
and coming to the U.S. is a different ball game.
Zillions of dollars to make the announcement to the entire world has been given for FREE.
quote:Originally posted by gartman
It was so poorly planned innocent travelers were trapped on arrival here and treated like criminals.
On November 28, 2016, a car ramming attack and mass stabbing occurred at 9:52 a.m. EST at Ohio State University (OSU)'s Watts Hall in Columbus, Ohio. The attacker, Somali refugee Abdul Razak Ali Artan, was shot and killed by the first responding OSU police officer, and 13 people were hospitalized for injuries.
Abdul Razak Ali Artan (1998 - November 28, 2016) was a Muslim Somali refugee and legal permanent resident of the United States who had been a logistics management major in the Max M. Fisher College of Business at the time of the attack.[38][39][40][41] Though OSU said Artan was 18, investigators said official records conflicted on his actual age, and believed he may be older.[42]
Artan was the third-eldest of seven children. He alleged that he was born in a refugee camp after his family fled Somalia.[7] However, a senior U.S. government official said that Artan left Somalia with the rest of his family in 2007, and that they spent seven years in a refugee camp in Pakistan, settling in Islamabad on a road known as "Somali Street".[43][44] He moved to the U.S. on a refugee visa with his mother and six siblings in 2014.[2][4][45]
quote:Originally posted by remingtonoaks
If you haven't gathered from reading The answers to this post, nobody thinks it's wrong. At least here
That's fair, I'm just trying to understand the other side of it, and illicit some legitimate discussion with counter-arguments.
Another discussion, requires another thread. This is the WHAT'S wrong with it thread and as of yet, I've not seen one post about what is wrong. NOT one. Implementation maybe, but that's not the orders fault.
Convince me that the President's executive order immigration ban is wrong and different from the similar bans Presidents Obama, Bush, and Clinton enacted during their tenures.
My GUESS would be because Trump's order gives preference to Christians in the effected countries. Although the words Muslim and Christian are not used in the order, the term "minority religion" is used. Since these countries are likely 90%+ Muslim, "minority religion" equals non-muslim/Christian.
Here's part of the EO.
"(b) Upon the resumption of USRAP admissions, the Secretary of State, in consultation with the Secretary of Homeland Security, is further directed to make changes, to the extent permitted by law, to prioritize refugee claims made by individuals on the basis of religious-based persecution, provided that the religion of the individual is a minority religion in the individual's country of nationality. Where necessary and appropriate, the Secretaries of State and Homeland Security shall recommend legislation to the President that would assist with such prioritization."
Ros