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Ok Welder Guys.......questions and recommendations

MercuryMercury Member Posts: 7,840 ✭✭✭
edited January 2017 in General Discussion
Ok guys, here is the scoop. I've welded most of my life, using basic stick welders, and then moved up to mig welders later on. I was even a welder/shop supervisor for 3 years at a shop that did nothing but weld mild steel frames.

BUT......other than basic mig welding, I have almost zero knowledge of tig welding.

SO, I'm looking to spend about $2k-3k for a tig/mig welder, so I can do stainless, aluminum, etc.

What do I need to look for? I've read that "square wave" is best for tig, but I honestly have no idea what that even means. [:p]

Any recommendations for welding rigs? I'd like to stay with major name brands. Miller, Hobart, Lincoln, etc. American made would be ideal too.

Thanks.

Merc
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Comments

  • bigcitybillbigcitybill Member Posts: 4,912 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Hard to go wrong with a Synchrowave 250.
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  • AlpineAlpine Member Posts: 15,092 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I do not have a Square Wave machine. Mine is an old Lincoln AC/DC high frequency machine with a foot pedal and Bernard water cooler (a must for welding Aluminum).

    My understanding is a Square Wave machine will give you more variables to set and only marginally better for some rare welding jobs.

    Water cooled tig torch, set of Argon and He bottles and a welder capable of 300 amps and you will be good to go.

    I weld SS, mild steel and Aluminum (with a spool gun) with the Mig welder.

    I weld SS, mild steel, Aluminum and Ti with the Tig welder. How much heat, where to put the heat with the Tig will make you an "expert" welder in no time.

    You may want to look at some UTube stuff to get more ideas and advice. There are some really good welders that show technique.

    Good luck!
    ?The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.?
    Margaret Thatcher

    "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."
    Mark Twain
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  • MercuryMercury Member Posts: 7,840 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Wow.......all these welders, and no other comments? [:(]


    Merc
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  • AlpineAlpine Member Posts: 15,092 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Anybody can MIG, but only the connoisseur can TIG.

    Besides you can make very pretty welds with TIG.
    ?The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.?
    Margaret Thatcher

    "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."
    Mark Twain
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  • redneckandyredneckandy Member Posts: 9,716 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I'm still learning on Mig. Tig is still out of my league. For now.
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  • OakieOakie Member Posts: 40,565 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by redneckandy
    I'm still learning on Mig. Tig is still out of my league. For now.


    Me too and I suck at that. I can never get the weld to look pretty. I know how to control it, but cannot get the adjustments right. I am going to take a class at the local college this spring.
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  • mag00mag00 Member Posts: 4,719 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    You may wish to consider one of these.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lotos-LTPDC2000D-Plasma-Cutter-Tig-Stick-Welder-3-in-1-Combo-Welding-Machine-/282289582555?hash=item41b9c531db:g:NEgAAOSwgZ1XsSvb

    Just a real handy unit. The plasma will be something you are glad you got. I got mine with foot pedal.
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  • fishkiller41fishkiller41 Member Posts: 50,608
    edited November -1
    Merc: Go look at this guys videos.He made me a "welder" in a little over 2 months.I'm no where near the caliber of welder that you prob. are but,I have complete faith in any type of welding I try to do now.I get proper penetration and have even succeeded in welding razor blades and coke cans without too much "blow-thru"
    I KNOW his vids will get you on track in no time.GREAT LEARNING TOOL!!!

    https://www.youtube.com/user/weldingtipsandtricks/videos
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  • chiefrchiefr Member Posts: 14,115 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Going from stick and MIG to TIG is like going from a paint rollers and 4" paint brushes to a fine haired brush of the canvas artists.

    Would check military and government auctions periodically for some real bargains.
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  • MercuryMercury Member Posts: 7,840 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Well....I couldn't find a rig that did everything I wanted. So, I bought a Millermatic 252. I'll buy a TIG unit later on.

    Thanks for everyone's help.

    Merc
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  • LesWVaLesWVa Member Posts: 10,490 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Will not recommend a unit.

    But will highly advise you to get a Foot pedal. Especially for welding aluminum. You must start out hot enough to get the aluminum to bubble (melt) and then back off the heat control to do the weld when adding the filler rod.

    Also with aluminum welding you want a blunt tungsten. All other welding you want it sharpened like a pencil.


    I think TIG welding is the easiest method of welding to learn and master.
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  • jerrywh818jerrywh818 Member Posts: 2,573 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I am a gun maker X auto mechanic, engraver and gunsmith and use a Lincoln square wave 175. I love it but it does take some time to learn to use for high precision. I can weld the tip on sears for side locks and I have welded springs with success. If there is anything it can't do I haven't found it yet. I have had it for 15 years. Keep the mig.it is good for common fabrication. I Engraver friend of mine misspelled the name of a client on the barrel of a mod. 70. A guy with a tig. welded up that single letter on the barrel and my friend re engraved the letter. It even gets better than that.
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  • redneckandyredneckandy Member Posts: 9,716 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    You will like it Merc. I have a Miller 251 and it is an awesome machine. It paid for itself twice over in the first six months I owned it. I bought the book Farm and Workshop Welding by Andrew Pierce. It does a good job of explaining the details. I've only been welding for a couple of years and am trying not to develop any bad habits. I never would of guessed that there is so many variables when it comes to welding. It truly is an art form.
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  • FrancFFrancF Member Posts: 35,279 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    As a TiG welder (that's what I do for a living) there are a lot of new machines out in the $2500-5000 range that 15 years ago would have cost $20K "Square wave" only affects AC this is an arc sine wave you are going peek to peek with no falloff . "Syncrowave and Aerowave are brand names of Miller.

    Depending on what you buy Must have basics-
    :Water Cooled Torch (not needed for min. use. I need on for production)It's nice to have!
    :High Frequency Start (Lift arc will aggravate you)
    :AC Balance Control (This changes your arc Field from wide to narrow)
    :Pre and Post flow gas timer
    :HF intensity adjustment (not necessary but nice to have)

    Other option that allow you to do trick stuff is a Pulsar timer. Love this thing on my 351 Syncrowave. This control unit will let you go from welding (with the right set up (.020 dia tungsten) welding tin foil to blowing holes in 1/2 plate.

    Also The new trick machines like Miller and Lincoln have Blue tooth remote foot pedals that's a plus.

    Now Last thing about new TiG Machines, I am a fan of Miller- been using them for 30+years Lincoln, ESAB and Thermal Arc also make grate machines.. If you go High end make sure your machine is not Tungsten makeup sensitive! Some of the new Millers will not run (to my understanding some Pure (green tip) tungsten, Zirconiated I think was also an issue in the new machines. But the others- Ceriated, Thoriated, Lanthanated were good to go. Uless you doing Government contract stuff this will have no effect on what your doing or quality.

    Gas- %100 Argon If this is for home, buy! don't rent a bottle. A 125 cu is good a 250-280 is better, Tig welding every day @ 8 hours 250cu will last about a week and and a half.
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  • jerrywh818jerrywh818 Member Posts: 2,573 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    FrancF
    Great info. Where does someone learn to weld with a .020 tungsten electrode?? Will my square wave lincoln do that?
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  • AlpineAlpine Member Posts: 15,092 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Diameter of the electrode is a function of how many amps it will pass before it is burned up. If you are going to use a small electrode, then set the upper limit of the machine to max at 150 amps. If you need more heat (as with welding Aluminum) then use 75% Argon and 25% He.

    I prefer to use the 75/25 for Aluminum just to keep the heat transferred to the part down. Aluminum sucks heat away from the weld very badly. Welding SS or Ti is much nicer/easier because the heat stay right where you apply it. Also Aluminum has to be cleaned with a SS wire brush and will start to oxidize in about 5 minutes.
    ?The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.?
    Margaret Thatcher

    "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."
    Mark Twain
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  • FrancFFrancF Member Posts: 35,279 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by jerrywh818
    FrancF
    Great info. Where does someone learn to weld with a .020 tungsten electrode?? Will my square wave lincoln do that?


    Same place you learn with welding with 3/32 1/16,.030 Tungstens[:D]
    Kidding aside~

    Depends on the machine and how low your amperage will go. Super small Tungsten are for doing micro TiG welding and R&D stuff. They can be a PITA to use. My experience with using an electrode that small was welding twisted 5 strand .010 Micro Tophet 30 heating element wire to a micro lead wire in huge R&D Project. That was a very hard challenge to do that kind of work free hand (with the help of fixtures, magnification etc. Your looking at about 2 Amps max with a high/low pulse rate (Fuse only no filler rod).
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  • BoskettiBosketti Member Posts: 1,090 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Also check the local schools and vo-techs. The local Tech College here has annual auctions and the welders they sell are in great shape.
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  • jerrywh818jerrywh818 Member Posts: 2,573 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I'm going to get some small electrods and try them. What would be the best type Thoriated or lanthanated or what? Is pure argon OK?
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  • mag00mag00 Member Posts: 4,719 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by FrancF
    As a TiG welder (that's what I do for a living) there are a lot of new machines out in the $2500-5000 range that 15 years ago would have cost $20K "Square wave" only affects AC this is an arc sine wave you are going peek to peek with no falloff . "Syncrowave and Aerowave are brand names of Miller.

    Depending on what you buy Must have basics-
    :Water Cooled Torch (not needed for min. use. I need on for production)It's nice to have!
    :High Frequency Start (Lift arc will aggravate you)
    :AC Balance Control (This changes your arc Field from wide to narrow)
    :Pre and Post flow gas timer
    :HF intensity adjustment (not necessary but nice to have)

    Other option that allow you to do trick stuff is a Pulsar timer. Love this thing on my 351 Syncrowave. This control unit will let you go from welding (with the right set up (.020 dia tungsten) welding tin foil to blowing holes in 1/2 plate.

    Also The new trick machines like Miller and Lincoln have Blue tooth remote foot pedals that's a plus.

    Now Last thing about new TiG Machines, I am a fan of Miller- been using them for 30+years Lincoln, ESAB and Thermal Arc also make grate machines.. If you go High end make sure your machine is not Tungsten makeup sensitive! Some of the new Millers will not run (to my understanding some Pure (green tip) tungsten, Zirconiated I think was also an issue in the new machines. But the others- Ceriated, Thoriated, Lanthanated were good to go. Uless you doing Government contract stuff this will have no effect on what your doing or quality.

    Gas- %100 Argon If this is for home, buy! don't rent a bottle. A 125 cu is good a 250-280 is better, Tig welding every day @ 8 hours 250cu will last about a week and and a half.




    Franc, what's interesting is I consider myself "Old School", but remember the real "Old School" welders of the day. I have used some of the old dinosaurs, and they worked fine. In the 80's Pow Con came and ran demo units. Wow, they were nice.

    Thing is, the "Old School" welders could still run circles around us "wet behind the ears" welders with those dinosaur machines.

    I recently have been outfitting my shop to do motorcycle projects after years out of the industry. I picked up one of the 3 in 1 import machines. Excellent machines for the money. Then yesterday, picked up an old Linde buzzbox. I'll look for a cheap torch to do alum with. I don't do alot of Aluminum, so my needs are few. I used to use Oxy/Ace setup with the flux coated rod for stick machine to weld the stuff. Probably will still do that at times. I can't see investing big bucks for the few times I would need to do aluminum. I can hire somebody to do it [;)]

    Also, technology has moved along for other phases of design and fabrication. I will be getting a 3d printer so I can model my parts, then create molds and cast my own custom parts and emblems.

    This stuff just didn't exist back in the day, and it sure is a wonderful world today for custom and prototype work.
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