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45-70 Loads

greybeard100greybeard100 Member Posts: 24 ✭✭
edited November 2012 in Ask the Experts
I picked up some lighter 300 grain JHP Hornady bullets .458 to load into the 45-70. Had some troubles finding data for this lighter loading, but found data that said 58.5 to 65 grains IMR 4064. So I loaded 59 grains, expect around 1800 fps. (Marlin 1895). Seems like a lot of powder. Do these numbers seem right to you?[8D]
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    greybeard100greybeard100 Member Posts: 24 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    what are your fav 45-70 loads i am going to start reloading mine just trying to get a "feeler" out i have some reloading books just wanting personal exp. thanks in advance

    you can be king or street sweeper but everyone is going to dance with the reaper
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    charliemeyer007charliemeyer007 Member Posts: 6,579 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    These data are for only Ruger No.1 and No.3 single shots, Browning 1885 single shots and Siamese bolt action rifles. Max pressure, 50,000 CUP. Do not use these data in either of the prior two sections of 45-70 data (Trapdoor and Lever Actions).

    Cartridge: 45-70 Government (Modern Rifles)*
    Load Type: Rifle
    Starting Loads
    Maximum Loads

    Bullet Weight (Gr.) Manufacturer Powder Bullet Diam. C.O.L. Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure

    300 GR. BAR TTSX IMR IMR 4198 .458" 2.775" 50.0 2207 37,700 CUP 53.0C 2323 45,000 CUP
    300 GR. BAR TTSX Hodgdon H4198 .458" 2.775" 53.0 2346 39,800 CUP 56.0C 2445 46,700 CUP
    300 GR. SIE HP IMR IMR 4198 .458" 2.525" 54.0 2253 31,800 CUP 58.5C 2450 43,000 CUP
    300 GR. SIE HP Hodgdon H4198 .458" 2.525" 59.5 2394 37,300 CUP 63.0 2532 50,000 CUP
    325 GR. HDY FTX IMR IMR 4198 .458" 2.650" 50.0 2149 37,000 CUP 54.0C 2292 44,100 CUP
    325 GR. HDY FTX Hodgdon H4198 .458" 2.650" 52.0 2242 37,700 CUP 56.0C 2378 46,500 CUP
    350 GR. HDY JRN Hodgdon H335 .458" 2.540" 57.0 2016 32,200 CUP 63.0 2174 47,300 CUP
    350 GR. HDY JRN Hodgdon H322 .458" 2.540" 52.0 1898 25,800 CUP 57.0C 2143 41,100 CUP
    350 GR. HDY JRN IMR IMR 4198 .458" 2.540" 49.0 2118 37,700 CUP 52.0 2212 43,900 CUP
    350 GR. HDY JRN Hodgdon H4198 .458" 2.540" 50.5 2104 35,100 CUP 56.0 2300 50,000 CUP
    400 GR. SPR JFP Hodgdon H335 .458" 2.540" 54.0 1883 31,900 CUP 60.0 2057 49,800 CUP
    400 GR. SPR JFP IMR IMR 4198 .458" 2.540" 47.0 1954 35,400 CUP 50.0 2089 47,100 CUP
    400 GR. SPR JFP Hodgdon H4198 .458" 2.540" 48.0 1915 31,800 CUP 53.0 2108 49,100 CUP

    From
    http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp

    I like 4198 in my 45-70 and 458 for more full tilt loads. Unique is good for ligher stuff.
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    rufe-snowrufe-snow Member Posts: 18,650 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    You got to pay attention! Loading data for the 45-70 can be complicated. There are 3 different types of loads, depending on the firearm your loading for. All loading books and responsible on-line sites note what firearm each load is safe for.

    Loading for the 45-70 with your head up your butt, instead of looking at a book is going to destroy the firearm and maybe you.

    EDIT #1, I would contact Hodgdon customer service, either by phone or e-mail. Definitely would want to verify the starting loads pressure figures.

    From personal experience, just because a load is published by a powder or loading tool manufacturer. Doesn't mean it's going to function safely in your personal firearm.
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    Riomouse911Riomouse911 Member Posts: 3,492 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    All the modern reloading manuals will specify the three loads: Older Trapdoor/Rolling Block power levels, modern Marlin 1895 power levels, and Ruger #1 etc power levels. As you can expect, the more modern and strong the action is, the closer to .458 Win Mag performance you can get. Mix up the data, and you can get a blowup.

    I regularly use IMR 3031 or IMR 4198 for my .45/70 loads, there's tons of data on these pwders. I haven't tried 4064. however.

    I suggest, in the name of safety, if these first loads are right at full house or beyond for your Marlin; pull the bullets and start anew.
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    gruntledgruntled Member Posts: 8,218 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I have three 45/70s. An original 1873 Trapdoor, a Ruger #3 & a 45/70 barrel for my Thompson Contender.
    The problem is what should I load in the Contender? I keep the loads seperate by loading cast lead bullets in the Trapdoor & jacketed bullets in the #3. So far I only use the Trapdoor loads in the Contender but it should be capable of better than that. Even so it would then present the problem of knowing at a glance which loads go where.
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    greybeard100greybeard100 Member Posts: 24 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Data was from the Hodgon Reloading Data Center,
    45-70 Government(Lever Actions)
    300 gr. IMR-4064 59.0gr. 1858fps 20300 CUP to 65.5C gr. 2125fps 28700 CUP.
    http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp
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    dcs shootersdcs shooters Member Posts: 10,969
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by gruntled
    I have three 45/70s. An original 1873 Trapdoor, a Ruger #3 & a 45/70 barrel for my Thompson Contender.
    The problem is what should I load in the Contender? I keep the loads seperate by loading cast lead bullets in the Trapdoor & jacketed bullets in the #3. So far I only use the Trapdoor loads in the Contender but it should be capable of better than that. Even so it would then present the problem of knowing at a glance which loads go where.


    Use load data for the Marlin 1895. That's what I use for my 14" T-C.
    Recoil is very stiff though [xx(] I had the barrel Magna-Ported, and it helped some.
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    dfletcherdfletcher Member Posts: 8,162 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by gruntled
    I have three 45/70s. An original 1873 Trapdoor, a Ruger #3 & a 45/70 barrel for my Thompson Contender.
    The problem is what should I load in the Contender? I keep the loads seperate by loading cast lead bullets in the Trapdoor & jacketed bullets in the #3. So far I only use the Trapdoor loads in the Contender but it should be capable of better than that. Even so it would then present the problem of knowing at a glance which loads go where.


    Re the T/C Contender, T/C will recommend Trapdoor levels only - I think that's 18K CUP. The Hodgden manual I use lists 28K CUP loads for the T/C Contender. I've done some cross checking and found T/C Contender loads, without CPU measures, also listed in the Marlin 1895 levels section of Hornady, Sierra, etc.

    A load I use in my T/C pistol with 300 grain Sierra JHP is just shy of the 55.0 of H4198 max load published in the Hodgden Annual 2002 reloading magazine, listing 2,076 fps from a 14" bbl. It's a very, very heavy load (brutal out of a handgun) but Hodgden lists it at 28K CUP. My Hornady manual lists 51.2 of H4198 as max in the Marlin 1895 level (and 450 Marlin) so I have to believe this is a pretty stiff load. I should make clear I'm not recommending this load, just noting that it is listed in the Hodgden manual.

    I have a 45/70 SMLE and stick with the Marlin level loads for it.

    I keep my reloaded ammo in marked MTM boxes. I guess I'm used to that since I neck size my bottleneck cartridges and have to keep a dozen or so 308s, 223s, 30.06s and such separate by rifle. But it shouldn't be a chore to segregate your 45/70 ammo according to load level.
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