Shipping pre 1898 Fireamrs

TheBrassMan

This Winchester Model 1873,

http://www.GunBroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=453358837

Can it be shipped to anyone without an FFL or C&R?
They have stated according to the Serial Number it was manufactured in 1892.
Tell me if I am correct or wrong.
I am interested to know. I have actually handled that Model 1873 when they were still a local gun shop.

mark christian

Under Federal Law, any firearm produced before 1899 (that means mid night 31 December, 1898) is an antique and a non gun. State laws are all over the place on exactly what is and what is not a firearm, but so far as the feds are concerned, no FFL is needed to ship a firearm made in 1892.

TheBrassMan

Someone from Michigan just contacted them and offered them $1275 shipped.
I think I will tell them to hold off a couple of days before accepting the offer and see
if they get some more bites on it.

toad67

Since they mention that some type of FFL is required you probably won't be able to change their mind though[:(]

TheBrassMan

I think I can change their minds.
I do understand their reluctance, especially with all the idiots out there now days.
But I will try. Would be a nice sale for them.
I am no expert but from what I can find, the 38 W.C.F. has the fewest number of rifles made.
Also the round barrel version has fewer numbers then the octagonal barrel.

11b6r

Title 18, Section 922 of the Federal Code defines "firearm". It also defines "antique firearm". If it is an antique forearm, it is not a firearm. As Mark said, under FEDERAL law, it is not a firearm for purposes of selling and shipping.

babun

He needs to get that blue out of his pics.[xx(]
A lot better looking .38wcf's aren't selling at $1500.
It's up to him.

He Dog

Brassman, I think you missed this part:

If you disagree with any of the conditions set forth
in the auction, then DO NOT BID!
We do not haggle on the Restrictions, Form of Payment, Type and Cost of Shipping or ID Required.

nmyers

Huh? He's going to cancel his auction early & accept an offer made off GB? Does he not understand GB rules, & how auctions operate?

I've never seen a seller with so many rules, restrictions, & conditions, most of which are not legal requirements. He lectures US about knowing state & local laws, when he doesn't even know federal laws?

At least I will follow his request to NOT BID, since I disagree with his terms.

Neal

the yooper

I wouldn't bid on it personally. Too many restrictions. In several places he states that a C&R or an FFL are required to purchase. While it's not a LEGAL requirement, it is a SELLER requirement. Unfortunately, many dealers won't ship ANY firearms without an FFL, regardless of whether or not it's legally a C&R-eligible weapon. I've written to many and talked to a couple on the phone and have NEVER gotten them to budge when they have their minds made up ahead of time. I don't think it's that they don't KNOW the law, they just want to cover their butts and be xtra safe. Just my $.02 worth. Good luck on it.
yooper

jonk

Sellers can be picky. Some will ONLY ship to an FFL, no ifs, ands, or buts, even if clearly antique and no state laws prohibiting.

I once bought an 1896 dated Gewehr 88 (German). Not only would the seller ONLY ship to an FFL, even after I told him that he'd probably increase his market if he sold to everyone or at least C&Rs, but the receiving FFL was a jerk about it too. I told him, "look, this isn't a gun, I'll pay you the $20 for taking it in for me, no problem, but you don't have to call it in." He insisted on doing so. "Fine, whatever, call in the next Case knife you sell too, because that isn't a firearm either, and the BATF is only interested in background checks on firearm purchases... which this isn't." I don't do business with him anymore.