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Animal Attacks: Best Cal? 357sig

dkidcatdkidcat Member Posts: 34 ✭✭
edited May 2006 in Ask the Experts
With the recent increase in animal attacks... (Bears, Aligators & Mountain Lions) I don't think I'll be going hiking w/o a gun.

I had been thinking of a stainless 357mag revolver but just realized that my Glock's finish is pretty corrosion resistant. Therefor, I'm considering getting a 357 sig barrel for my Glock model 22. Reason being... better penetration than .40SW

10mm Delta Elite seems a popular choice but an expensive one... while the 357 sig is a simple barrel change. ( I think the mags are the same?)

Is it's performance similar to the old 357mag ?

Any opninions?
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    leeblackmanleeblackman Member Posts: 5,303 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Glock model 20 10mm... 15+1rds of Winchester Silvertip HP 175gr 1290fps with 649ft/lbs.

    From what I've seen on average a .357sig 125gr goes about 1350fps with 506ft/lbs.

    The 10mm is a heavier bullet with more energy and larger diameter, which means it will put a bigger deeper whole in your target. Put that behind the reliability of the glock and a high capacity magazine.

    I think I would still much rather have a stainless Smith & Wesson revolver in a magnum cartridge. A .357mag or larger. Preferably a .41mag or a .44mag. Like maybe a S&W mountain magnum.
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    brerhunterbrerhunter Member Posts: 48 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    If I was worried about an animal attack I would go with something bigger than a 357sig. They are just like us once juices get flowing, watch out. I would recommend a .41, .44, .454 all come in a smaller package that can be carried all day.
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    nordnord Member Posts: 6,106 ✭
    edited November -1
    I would respectfully add another opinion...

    Pistols present problems. Permits between states, the regulations within states, and even the pistol itself. Caliber is unimportant if one can't hit and stop the threat. It's also unimportant if a pistol can't legally be carried in the first place as in some states you'd be better off to allow the animal to kill you.

    My weapon of choice would be a reliable utility shotgun in 12 gauge. Mossberg or Remington would be tops on the list in either semi-auto or pump... Pump being more accepted from a regulation standpoint, but we aren't talking hunting here are we?

    My reasoning is simple. A shotgun in "riot" configuration weighs little more than a large caliber pistol. A 12 ga. slug at short range will down anything in North America and a load of buckshot as the final round in the magazine is devastating at a few feet or inches. And after the final round there's still the protection of a rather stout club if it ever came to that, though I find it hard to imagine.

    There's just no substitute for the energy and damage that over an ounce of lead can deliver at short range. There's also little substitute for the ease of use, or the ability to place a shot with this type of weapon.

    I'll carry a scattergun if I feel the need for close-in protection. It just makes so much more sense to me.
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    gap1916gap1916 Member Posts: 4,977
    edited November -1
    For a hand gun, 10mm. The Glock or Witness, the 41 or 44 mag in a revolver. I like S&W. My 2 cents [8D]
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    mbsamsmbsams Member Posts: 1,076 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    a flat nose 180 fmj will give you all the penetration and power you need. Better than the 357 on bigger critters. Plus the 40 makes a bigger hole. more blood out and more air in. Stay with your 40, it was the right choice in the first place.
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    v35v35 Member Posts: 12,710 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    A lot of aimed shots out of a gun you can control beats a hand cannon that is slow to get into action. Glocks are always ready and easy to shoot well.
    A 12 gauge 20" barreled 870 or the like with alternate loads of OO and slug has been recommended by experts for grizzly country or western black bears. The gun is slung barrel down over the weak shoulder, loaded of course. The gun would be equal to anything you could come up against. Carried this way, it can come to hand very fast.
    Whatever you carry, it needs to be within arms length all the time.
    A serious long, sharp knife mightn't be a bad idea. In several bear attacks I've read recently,the men who were jumped, managed to kill their bears by repeated stabbing in the neck.
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    dfletcherdfletcher Member Posts: 8,162 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    If the question is what is the BEST handgun for bear defense the answer is always the largest caliber you can hit with.

    For minimum I can only recount a few years ago I accompanied hunting friends in OR & quickly came upon about a 350 lb black bear over a dead deer. I was closest & they were not in clear view, the bear turned & was shot 3 times with 41 Mag "Buffalo Bore" SWC. 350 lb is not large & had to move uphill at a steep angle. He didn't stop so much as lose legs & not get up after 3rd shot. Had he been bigger or traveled flat ground he would not have been stopped.

    I think people underestimate the strength of wild animals. I take a Ruger 480 with me now.
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    He DogHe Dog Member Posts: 50,963 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Nord+1 12 gauge.
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    iwannausernameiwannausername Member Posts: 7,131
    edited November -1
    12ga, or be very un-pc and carry a fal, hk91, etc.
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    rsnyder55rsnyder55 Member Posts: 2,526 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    When I go into the woods with bears and mountain lions, I carry a 44 mag with Federal 220gr metal case profile bullets. These bullets are meant for metal silhouette targets and don't expand. Human defense loads are not what you want in a handgun, you want penetration loads. I know these work as I also use these loads on big boars and get good penetration. I don't feel too insecure.

    My second choice, a Marlin lever action in .444 or 45-70.
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    beantownshootahbeantownshootah Member Posts: 12,776 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by dkidcat
    With the recent increase in animal attacks... (Bears, Aligators & Mountain Lions) I don't think I'll be going hiking w/o a gun.

    I had been thinking of a stainless 357mag revolver but just realized that my Glock's finish is pretty corrosion resistant. Therefor, I'm considering getting a 357 sig barrel for my Glock model 22. Reason being... better penetration than .40SW

    10mm Delta Elite seems a popular choice but an expensive one... while the 357 sig is a simple barrel change. ( I think the mags are the same?)

    Is it's performance similar to the old 357mag ?

    Any opninions?


    To answer your specific question:

    In general 357 Sig is LESS powerful than 357 magnum, though the difference isn't all that great with standard 125 grain bullets (say 1350fps for the Sig, 1450fps for the magnum).

    On the other hand, the revolver is more reliable, and can also be loaded with heavier bullets, which are probably more suitable for defense against large animals. Personally, I'd pick the wheelgun, then put in the heavy weight bullets.

    Fully loaded 10mms are comparable in power to a 41 magnum. . .and are therefore more powerful than either the 357 magnum or 357 SIG. (You have to be careful because a lot of the factory 10mm loads are watered down, and are not loaded up to the full potential of that caliber). In terms of pure energy, those are a better choice than 357 SIG, if you can handle them.

    As some of the other posters have already mentioned, if you are really worried about an attack from a bear or mountain lion, you really can't have too much gun. .44 magnum is still better than 10mm, and a shotgun (or light rifle) is better than just about any handgun.
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    rsnyder55rsnyder55 Member Posts: 2,526 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    One other thing I also carry is a very loud whistle (and I have my kids carry one also). This may buy you a second or two or may make the animal change its mind.
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    boeboeboeboe Member Posts: 3,331
    edited November -1
    After a hiking trip into a well known national park where all firearms are prohibited (unless they are disassembled) and doing some reading on the subject following, I am wondering if it is true that bears are reliably replused by 12 gauge flare rounds loaded with caspian pepper.

    I know, there are people who would tend to carry a large caliber revolver on such hikes, regardless of regulation, especially if they were on the hike with their family.

    Nature is an interesting thing. From the old wives tales I have heard, hitting an aggressive bear on the nose with a well placed 22 round will cause them to turn and flee. Of course, who wants to risk life and limb based on ones ability to hit a charging bear in the nose with a .22? Still, I don't have real reason to doubt that bears may be very sensitive to a shot of caspian pepper fired from a 12 gauge flare pistol.

    Has anyone looked into this?
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    boeboeboeboe Member Posts: 3,331
    edited November -1
    I neither confirm or deny that it would work. But if hitting a bear with caspian peper would more reliably end an attack, I think that is what I would do.

    http://www.elkrivertradingco.com/bear_repellant_safety_tips.htm

    http://www.safetygearhq.com/bearspray.htm

    http://www.tbotech.com/bearspray.htm

    http://www.tbotech.com/bear-repellent.htm
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    v35v35 Member Posts: 12,710 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    From what I've read about actual bear attacks, sprays cant be reliably expected to stop an attack from a determined bear.
    There's plenty of reading on the subject. Try Googling Bear Attacks.
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