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7.62x39 to 7.62x54R
David Lee
Member Posts: 129 ✭✭
I have a Ruger #1 chambered in 7.62x39. How hard would it be to convert it to 7.62x54R. Are there any other Ruger #1s that would work better?
Thanks in advance.
Dave
Thanks in advance.
Dave
Comments
Edit - following on beantownshootahs suggestion, you could get a TC Encore and then a custom barrel for it... I personally like the idea of a #1 in 762x39 ... I think it is a neat cartridge
WG
Operating pressure on the 7.62x54R is higher than the 7.62x39, but not tremendously so (57k psi vs 51k psi). Given that the Ruger #1 action can handle a 30'06 which operates at higher pressures yet, this part at least should be OK. And given that 30'06 cases are longer than 7.62x54R ones, you may be able to get away with the overall length.
One advantage to this particular conversion is that both the 7.62x54R and 7.62x39 are supposed to use .312 caliber bullets. If you tried to convert another more conventional .30 caliber round (eg 30-'06) I could imagine having accuracy or barrel wear problems trying to fire .312 bullets through a .308 barrel.
All that said, as a matter of practice, I'm not sure the conversion is worth doing. It would cost you some to get it done, and it would probably decrease (not increase) the value of the rifle.
I think it would be more cost effective to sell the Ruger #1, then have a Mosin-nagant rifle customized to your specs.
Find a nice Mosin rifle, drop the action into a nice custom stock of your choosing, have the bolt replaced with a longer bent-down one, the receiver tapped for a standard scope, the trigger tuned, and the action polished. Then you'd have a nice modern [edit-looking and functioning] repeater in 7.62x54R, and I think you'd still have some money left over compared to the cost of rechambering the Ruger #1 then selling that.
Edit: For Iwannausername, I also like the idea of a single-shot 7.62x39. Seems a shame to "ruin" a nice Ruger by converting it.
I myself have looked into finding a "modern" 7.62x54R rifle (even posting an "ask the experts" here) with no luck finding anyone that actually has a production rifle in that caliber. I'm sure they exist (ie in Asia or Europe), but demand for guns like this in the USA is negligible. If you want those kind of ballistics, you just go with a 30'06 and you're done.
The point of the exercise is just to find a way OTHER than a 19th century stiff-action non-ergonomic Mosin or military type bulky-PSL rifle to take advantage of inexpensive 7.62x54R ammo.
So far as I know, if you want a "normal" rifle in the caliber, you have to have it custom-built. Your idea of a custom barrel for a TC Encore is good. . .probably the easiest and most cost effective way to go here. It would be cool if there were such a barrel available for an NEF handi-rifle, but there isn't.
Rimmed cases mean that most ordinary rifle magazines won't work. So unless you want to design/fabricate your own magazine you're basically limited to a single shot gun.
Alternatively, you could adapt a Mosin magazine, or even better, adapt one of the detachables one from one of those Romanian PSK/Dragunov-looking long action semi-auto rifles, but now you may be talking serious fabrication for the receiver, not just a "drop in" job.
Does it pay to spend $1000+ just to use cheap corrosive ammo? I don't think so.
So going full circle, I think if you want a nice 7.62x54R gun, the easiest way is just to find a Mosin with a clean bore then build it into something nice. The guns themselves are so inexpensive, it shouldn't cost terribly much to do this.
"I have a Ruger #1 chambered in 7.62x39. How hard would it be to convert it to 7.62x54R."
Not hard at all. It's standard gunsmithing where the chamber is reamed and headspaced for the new cartridge. The contour of the barrel will play a role in determining whether the longer cartridge will be appropriate. I have yet to see a Ruger #1 barrel that wouldn't work though. Ruger chambers the .416 Rigby in the #1.
In my opinion, the new chamber provides more value than what the original is since the x54R offers substantially more flexibility for reloading and hunting. It certainly will not devalue the rifle at all unless the original is some limited edition or God forbid, 'rare'.
The new chamber should cost somewhere in the neighborhood of $100.00 to $150.00 depending on the gunsmith and your region. Creating a 'custom' M-N will be significantly more expensive and have little to no value after paying the extra money.
Best.
In my opinion, the new chamber provides more value than what the original is since the x54R offers substantially more flexibility for reloading and hunting. It certainly will not devalue the rifle at all unless the original is some limited edition or God forbid, 'rare'.
The new chamber should cost somewhere in the neighborhood of $100.00 to $150.00 depending on the gunsmith and your region. Creating a 'custom' M-N will be significantly more expensive and have little to no value after paying the extra money.
Best.
Again, I don't know if the extractor will have to be tweaked/replaced to get the gun to eject right, but if so, that might add a bit to the cost. Also, just to mention this for completeness sake, if you're having a gun rechambered, whomever does it should also re-label the barrel so that the label on the barrel matches the new actual caliber.
You may be right that it will cost you more out of pocket to build a "custom" (really sporterized) Mosin than to convert a Ruger, but I don't think its going to be a big difference. The reason is that Mosins are just so dirt cheap, and accessories are cheap and common.
Getting down to brass tacks, you can buy a good-or-better condition Mosin barreled action for $50 (or even less), or under $100 shipped and transferred. I know. . .because I just bought one like that right here on GUNBROKER.COM. Its a 1952 Hungarian M44, packed in cosmoline. . .worn finish, but a nice shiny bore with strong rifling.
ATI synthetic Monte-Carlo stocks are $50-60, and while not beautiful to look at, functionally they're reasonably good. Custom wood stocks are nicer, and can be had for $100 (or even less) from Richard's Microfit, if you don't need anything super-fancy.
Trigger job is free if you do it yourself, and its not particularly complicated on a Mosin. Its possible to get a surprisingly good result just by shimming the trigger spring screw and polishing the sear a little. . .there's a reason good Mosins were prized as sniper guns during the second World War. Conventional-mount scope drill and tap is maybe $25 (or free if you do it yourself). Rebuilding the bolt runs about $50 for a nice professional job including polishing the bolt and body.
So for under $200, you can have a completely functional sporterized Mosin. For a little more, you could have something reasonably nice.
As you point out collectors value for this Mosin would be nil, but resale value of a bent-bolt Mosin is not going to be less than $100 almost under ANY circumstance (eg bent bolt bodies themselves cost $50+). If you do a good job sporterizing it, you should be able to get at least $150 out of the gun if you sell, meaning "real" cost could be as little as $50 plus your time.
Edit: Also, if these sporterized Mosin rifles have no resale value, then it should be relatively easy to find one someone else has already converted, and pick it up for a song! I think you're better off building one yourself, so that way you can have it built exactly the way you like it, but if you just want a sporterized Mosin, there are plenty of them already out there pretty cheap.
In terms of conversion, I agree 100% that the converted Ruger would be more interesting and even more useful, but that doesn't necessarily make it more salable or valuable. I think most shooters would rather have the gun in the cheap and easy to find 7.62x39. . .and that's probably why Ruger makes them in that caliber (and many others) instead of 7.62x54R! Also, I think (rightly or wrongly) many shooters would be leery of buying a converted gun of uncertain provenance with effectively zero factory warrantee.
Even stipulating that a converted Ruger is worth MORE than the original one, a conversion is unlikely to increase the guns resale value by the full cost of having the conversion done, let alone MORE than that. (If it could, gunsmiths would be running a cottage industry of doing this conversion!). In short, you'd probably still be running a small loss for doing the conversion.
The bottom line, I think, is that building a reasonable "shooter" sporterized Mosin is actually pretty inexpensive. Even if it costs a little bit more than converting a Ruger, at least when you are done you'd have two separate guns.
$700-1300 can buy you a lot of custom work...
Just for giggles I did a search on the auction side.. .there is one #1 in 7.62x39 listed, $699 starting with a BIN of just about $1300. Also, according to the listing, only a few hundred were made in this caliber.
$700-1300 can buy you a lot of custom work...
I actually checked earlier and saw that, though its hard to judge what it "means". Just because someone is ASKING $1300 doesn't mean that they'll get it. In this case, if I were the seller I wouldn't be holding my breath for someone to come along and drop that much money on a production single-shot 7.62x39 gun.
If you look at completed sale prices on these guns, they seem to range from around $450 to $1500, depending on which exact gun, condition, caliber, and accessories. Most of the guns especially common calibers (eg 30-06, etc) seem to be actually selling for around $500-700, and I think that's probably more realistic here.
But even $700 can buy you a pretty nice 7.62x39 gun. Obviously that will buy you just about any SKS you like, PLUS every custom accessory you can imagine to go along with it. You could get a pretty good quality Kalashnikov for that much.
For a more conventional repeater, the CZ-527 bolt actions in 7.62x39 retail for $600. Ruger did make some M77 rifles in 7.62x39. This Remington 799 looks pretty nice at a MSRP of under $700:
http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/centerfire_rifles/model_799_specs.asp
And this M10-A1 looks very cool, its an Australian made 7.62x39 bolt gun that takes AK mags, though they're effectively unavailable in the USA:
In Australia, these sorts of guns are popular since semi-automatic weapons are banned.
But this is getting a bit off tangent. I think the question has been answered. Can you convert a 7.62x39 Ruger #1 to 7.62x54R? Yes, and as these things go, it should be relatively straightforward to do it.
*SHOULD* you do this? Personally, I wouldn't. . .but see above.
The best thing about the conversion is that when finished you will have a beautiful 7.62x54 rifle. With a converted MN you will end up with a UGLY 7.62x54 rifle.
Best