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30 Newton

FurseekerFurseeker Member Posts: 7 ✭✭
edited October 2009 in Ask the Experts
After my fathers passing my brother and I divided up all of his guns. I ended up with a rifle I didn't know my father had. It's a 30 Newton, it has double set triggers, facing the same direction. From what little research I've done on it, I believe it to be a model 1916. It is not drilled and tapped for a scope. The blueing is almost perfect. The only real wear is on the bottom of the magazine floor plate and steel butt plate. The stock is in great shape as well. I'm planning on running a bore scope through it to get a good look at the inside of the barrel. I have a few boxes of old ammo for the gun as well. Does anyone out there know more about these rifles.

Comments

  • rufe-snowrufe-snow Member Posts: 18,650 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Lots of info on the net, (GOOGLE/BING, are your friends). Charles Newton and his rifles are very famous, book(s) have been written about the man and his rifles. Use the above search engines and follow the links.

    We can't give you any specific help regarding your rifle, without quality photos. There is a "Sticky" at the top of the forum with instructions for posting photos.
  • FurseekerFurseeker Member Posts: 7 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    I have been doing alot of reading stuff on the net about these Newton rifles. And I should have mentioned that I will try and post some pictures in the next few days. It truley is a beautiful rifle. It seems a little thinly stocked to me, but that adds to the looks of the rifle. As I said I have some original ammo for this thing but I have no idea how old/safe it is. Even if I wanted to shoot it, I haven't shot open sights since I was a kid. I don't really know what to do with the old gun, I like to shoot what I own, but it might make a nice conversation piece if nothing else. But thanks for the reply and if anyone else has info to add please do so.
  • ikedaikeda Member Posts: 450 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    It sounds like you have a first model rifle mfg from April 1916 until about 1919, by the Newton Arms Company, Buffalo NY. The second model had the set trigger opposite the trigger, ie facing each other. This second model was mfg. by the Charles Newton Rifle Corporation, Buffalo NY.
    The following comes right out of the "The Rifle in America" by Phil Sharp". The "New Newton Rifle" became available in April 1916. "This original Newton was a mighty fine rifle and some of his earlier guns were built with extreme precision". The locking lugs were of interrupted screw-type pattern. "Newton continued to make this rifle for a number of years and the quality of his later arms left a great deal to be desired".

    The barrels were made by Marlin and the actions by someone else, Sharp does not say who. Large orders for WWI production caused his contracts to be canceled, so he was forced to mfg. the guns in his own factory. It appears this is when the quality went down.

    These guns were made in a number of configurations and calibers. Some research should be quite interesting.

    The ammo is probably safe to shoot, however if the ammo is original, particularly in the original boxes, it could be quite valuable. I would not shoot the original ammo just for that reason.

    I'm not sure about the brass for reloading but I will look into that.
  • perry shooterperry shooter Member Posts: 17,105 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I would love to own your rifle IMHO these were the FIRST WEATHERBY concept type rifles made HIGH VELOCITY . I might be cutting my own throat on if you decide to sell or keep it but BE AWARE the rifling is NOT normal CUT RIFLING . but more like the rifling in a GLOCK I. E. polygon rounded grooves they look SHOT OUT it was thought at the time the jacketed bullets at the time were not strong enough to stand up to this higher velocity with normal lands and grooves.
  • FurseekerFurseeker Member Posts: 7 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    While I appreciate all types of guns as I said before I like to shoot what I own. That being said I really don't know what to do with this thing. From my limited research on the net it appears to me that these Newton's have a loyal following to this day. I'm not a collector of old guns. I have several that were passed down from my father that I know the story behind. I grew up hunting with him and the guns he used have a very special place in my collection. This gun I do remember seeing and talking about with him. I believe one his older friends left it to him after his passing. I ended up with a Colt model 1911A1 that I know this particular gentlemen left my father. The colt was carried during WWII by this man. Now that gun I still shoot from time to time. It's nice to have and own a piece of history like that. But I'm wondering if the old Newton might mean more to somebody else out there. I've been given a lot of opinions from some of my friends like have it restocked and drilled and tapped for a scope and start shooting it. But then I think I'm not left with much of an original gun. I will try to get some photos of the gun uploaded today. And the ammo I mentioned in my earlier post is still in the Western Box, I think I have 6 or 7 boxes of the stuff. The boxes are not in great shape but paper doesn't weather time as well as steel and wood. By the way I really appreciate all the responses, keep them coming please.
  • TexraidTexraid Member Posts: 46 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Here is the person to contact regarding your Newton:

    Larry Wales: lswales@hughes.net

    http://www.newtonrifles.com/OrderForm.htm

    Here is a link to the NRA show in which he won First place.

    http://nrablog.com/post/2009/10/13/Following-up-with-the-NRA-Gun-Show.aspx

    In January 1916 Marlin canceled their barrel contract with Newton at which time he obtained his own machinery. His barrel making operation was overseen by none other than Harry Pope.

    Incidentally, barrels with segmental rifling mentioned above were marked as such:

    O-O Buffalo, N.Y.O-O

    square cut rifling was marked with three O's O-O-O
  • rufe-snowrufe-snow Member Posts: 18,650 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Furseeker
    From my limited research on the net it appears to me that these Newton's have a loyal following to this day.

    I'm not a collector of old guns. It's nice to have and own a piece of history like that.

    But I'm wondering if the old Newton might mean more to somebody else out there.


    Best thing to do, IMHO, is to put it on the auction with a lot of quality photos, if you don't intend to keep it. The quality photos are the key to maximum bids, for something as desirable as your Newton. No collector is going to put up big bucks unless they have quality photos of what they are bidding on.

    That said, the way things are in the toilet now with the economy, it would probably be best if you waited awhile before putting the Newton, on the block.
  • sandwarriorsandwarrior Member Posts: 5,453 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Furseeker,

    If you haven't already figured it out by now, from the stuff you find on the internet, Newton was one of those early firearms geniuses that brought this country, commercially anyways, into the modern 20th century of firearms. He pretty much gets credit for developing the .250-3000 and .300 Savage cartridges which were, in their day, sales kings.

    His rifle company didn't fare as well simply due to timing. When he got it going full bore was when we were entering WWI. Material and manpower had to be dedicated to that. From what I've seen, the .30 Newton is a beltless, rimless case slightly larger in diameter than the .30-06. And about the same power, or slightly less than the .300 H&H. Developed in 1913 and sold initially as the Adolph express, it bacame the .30 Newton when He opened is own company. From what I understand Newton was a genius in the firearms design forum, but he wasn't much of a businessmann.

    Anyhow, here's a link (you may have read it already):

    http://tinyurl.com/yzxf2yj

    My own take on him is that he was way ahead of his time and anything he designed or his company produced is going to have a good value. I think if it was your father's rifle I would hang on to it for sentimental reasons.
  • FurseekerFurseeker Member Posts: 7 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Photos as promised:

    NOR_7711.jpg
    NOR_7716.jpg
    NOR_7718.jpg
    NOR_7714.jpg
  • oneoldsaponeoldsap Member Posts: 563 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    What a nice piece of history you have there ! I too like to use rifles that the average nimrod won't be carying .
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