Colt 38 Super Question

MOONED

I have a 50's model 1911 in 38 Super. Is it acceptable to shoot +P ammo in it? The pistol is original, including the barrel. Just curious....

EDIT 1
Thanks all for the responses. For all practicle purposes, the 1911 "style" Colt gun I have is most commonly referred to as a 1911. One may call it what they wish, but since it was before the government model, it ain't that. I had a fist year production 1911 is 38 Super one time from 1929, still wished I had it, but found the need to sell it at some point.
To get back to the main question I had, will a common/original Colt 38 Super handle a +P cartridge, it appears the answer is yes. I have known for a long time that the 38 Super cartridge is a hot round and and would ahve expected it would handle a bit higher pressure than normal, but it's always worth asking the opinions of others. The box I have in hand has a similar denotation indicating "+P".


Thanks.

Aaron

spas12

Isn't all 38 super +p?

Nordicwargod

I reload quite a bit .38 super. I shoot much of it and my friend does also as he has two 1911s chambered in it. I did some research about this cartridge a few months back and it is quite interesting. First it appears that the 38super +p is not much more than the original 38super. With the development of more dense, slower ball pistol [accurate #9] powders the bullet speed increases without pressures increased. The original 38acp [not 380 acp] and the 38super have identical sized cases [externally] The super varient started in the late 1920s with higher pressures and the +p evolved in the 50s. I believe the cases evolved along with it being stronger.
The long winded answer to your question is Yes you can shoot 38super+p in your 50s era 1911. The recoil spring for the 38super is suppose to be 14lbs, if you have any concerns move up to a sixteen pound spring. I shoot mine in matches usually each week, the only issues I have is getting my brass back!
Here is a informative little article on the history of the 38 super


http://www.38super.net/Pages/History.html

Bill DeShivs

There was no +P labelled ammunition in the 1950s. .38 Super is simply a hotter-loaded .38 auto. Lately, ammunition makers have begun to label all Super ammunition +P.

armilite

There is no +P in 38 Super.

11b6r

According to SAAMI, there are only 4 OFFICIAL +P loadings. They are 9mm Parabellum, .38 Special. .45 ACP, and ALL .38 Super ammo. .38 Super is considered to be the +P version of the .38 ACP. So if you are shooting .38 Super, whether it is marked or not, it IS +P.

Nordicwargod

With a 1911 in 38 automatic you would have to be very careful not to shoot 38 super or 38super +p. I have brass labeled in both 38super and 38super+p. In the 50s the 38super cartridge was loaded to over 1300fps. Now just about anything you buy will only be loaded to 1200fps or so. Your gun is good to go with factory ammo.

A little info for you about the 38super cartridge:


"We now recognize two separate loadings for these cartridges. A low pressure (26,500 psi) .38 Automatic (ACP) and a high pressure (36,500 psi) .38 Super. The current SAAMI specifications manual lists the nominal velocity of the .38 Automatic with a 130 grain bullet as 1035 fps, and the .38 Super Auto +P as 1200 fps. Even the .38 Super has been downloaded from its once impressive 1300 fps.

The +P designation was added to the .38 Super name in 1974 (Speer Reloading Manual) to help distinguish between these cartridges because they have different pressure limits and are otherwise indistinguishable since they have the same external dimensions. Current .38 Super ammunition is marked 38 Super or 38 Super +P. Technically, there is no official .38 Super. The SAAMI manual does not list it. It includes only the .38 Automatic and the .38 Super Automatic +P"

Other than the brass it costs about a penny more per round to reload 38 super than 9mm. Usually 9mm is less than half the price at the gunstore. But it is ironic that on the shelves right now 38 super is available while 9mm is very hard to find.

MIKE WISKEY

" There is no +P in 38 Super."

Hawk Carse

quote:With a 1911 in 38 automatic you would have to be very careful not to shoot 38 super or 38super +p.

I have never seen a Colt 1911 pattern pistol in .38 Auto. They have been .38 Supers since introduction in 1929. The .38 Auto was in the 1900, 1902, and 1903 "parallel ruler" Colt/Browning guns.
You should be careful with the Spanish knockoffs. A Llama marked 9mm/.38 is meant to use 9mm Largo and .38 Auto interchangeably. .38 Super is hotter than they were built and proved for.

quote: " There is no +P in 38 Super."

Better to say, there is no +P in .38 Super to label some .38 Super as loaded to higher pressure than other .38 Super. All .38 Super is +P relative to the old .38 Auto. They have only been calling .38 Super "+P" since the 1970s, I guess it takes a while for information to filter through the system.

nunn

So, let's say this:

All .38 Super ammo is LABELED as +P, but just the same, it is not as hot as it once was, and it is safe to use even in older Colts.

Is that accurate?

Ambrose

Origionally posted by nunn:

So, let's say this:

All .38 Super ammo is LABELED as +P, but just the same, it is not as hot as it once was, and it is safe to use even in older Colts.

Is that accurate?

Well--Not exactly. If it's marked for the .38 Super cartridge: yes. But there are old Colts that will accept the .38 Super cartridge but are for the .38 Auto cartridge and shooting those with .38 Supers would NOT be safe.