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Help with identifying gun

jerickojericko Member Posts: 15 ✭✭
edited November 2009 in Ask the Experts
My father in law gave me a gun he said is pretty old. On the top of the barrel it says Empire State Arms Co. The holster that came with it has a data of 1917 stamped on it. Any info on what it is, how old, and a approximate value would really be appreciated!


http://www.tconl.com/~jericko/003.JPG

http://www.tconl.com/~jericko/004.JPG

Thanks
Jason Norton
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Comments

  • mark christianmark christian Member Posts: 24,443 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    For value; there is one up on auciton right now, although yours looks much better
    http://v4.beta.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=138613561
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  • rufe-snowrufe-snow Member Posts: 18,650 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    My reference identifies Empire State Arms Co. as a Trade Name used by the Folsom Co., many years ago. As it was a Trade Name it could have been made for them by any number of different manufacturers, supposedly it was made by Meriden. This would date it around the time of the First World War, circa 1914-1918?

    It appears in the photos as not being in factory original condition. The original blue or nickel finish has been removed and it has been polished down to bare metal. The grips are also ill fitting replacements. Because of this it's of nominal value IMHO, $100-$200
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  • hrfhrf Member Posts: 857 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    The Iver Johnson target style grips on it might be worth something. Photo is not too clear, but to me finish looks like original nickel. If polished off, I doubt the trigger guard would still be blue like the one on auction.
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  • Ned FallNed Fall Member Posts: 662 ✭
    edited November -1
    Empire State and Empire State Arms Co were "Trade Brand Names" used on gun made by Crescent Fire Arms Co of Norwich,CT (1892 to 1932) for and sold by Sears & Roebuck Co of Chicago,IL. H & D Folsome of New York City owned Crescent Fire Arms and could get away with saying that they made guns although the factory was named Crescent.
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  • rufe-snowrufe-snow Member Posts: 18,650 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    quote:Originally posted by Ned Fall
    Empire State and Empire State Arms Co were "Trade Brand Names" used on gun made by Crescent Fire Arms Co of Norwich,CT (1892 to 1932) for and sold by Sears & Roebuck Co of Chicago,IL. H & D Folsome of New York City owned Crescent Fire Arms and could get away with saying that they made guns although the factory was named Crescent.



    You sure that Crescent made this revolver Ned? I though the front sight on this revolver was one of the characteristics of the Meriden revolvers.

    003.JPG
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  • hrfhrf Member Posts: 857 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    "Pistols of the World" (Hogg & Weeks) lists Eastern Arms Co., Empire State, and Federal as trade names used by Meriden Firearms Co. of Meriden, CT., with an illustration of a Meriden .38 Hammerless revolver exactly like the gun shown here (except for wrong grips on jericko's).
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  • b.goforthb.goforth Member Posts: 982 ✭
    edited November -1
    my 2cents is, Empire Arms Co. was a brand name used on Meriden manufactured revolvers. Meriden's main retailer was sears roebuck & company however what sears did not take meriden sold to what ever distributor they could find. Empire Arms co. marked revolvers have been seen with Fred Biffar co. as well as other distributor's marking.

    i agree with pistols of the world by hoggs & weeks the front sight on this revolver is an identifing feature of being manufactured by meriden however not all meriden products have this type of front sight.

    meriden handguns were not unsafe when new but the softness of the internal mechanism would lead to early wear that would effect timing and therefore i would treat all meriden handguns with care and not fire them with modern ammo.

    the holster is a lot newer than the revolver and although it may have been purchased for this revolver it looks to new for this revolver to have been carried in it very long.
    bill
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  • federosfederos Member Posts: 2 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    Hi Jeriko
    It would appear the holster for your hammerless revolver is not an original. However the stamp on yours tells a story! This pistol was used as an officer side arm during WW1 and I believe the Australian and US army both used them. The orignial holster is closed bottem and there is a full top flap with no actual button, rather a stud and hole. I will see if I can get you a photo. It also appears you have a new handle. Mark and RTF posted links to the orignial grip on this weapon which was sold as the Meridian .38 Hammerless Revolver. I actually have the original grip and holster however the original grip kicks like a mule so its been modified with a moden grip :)

    These antique hammerless revolvers can be worth well over 1000bux to a collector in its original condition.

    Contact if you would like more detail info.. its a nice revolver u have there would seem someone looked after it...
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  • federosfederos Member Posts: 2 ✭✭
    edited November -1
    jason i'll email u them pics if u want i cant upload them here
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  • He DogHe Dog Member Posts: 51,593 ✭✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Ned is the expert, but I am unaware of Crescent making anything but shotguns.
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