SKS Magazine Question

Bullzeye

Just picked up a used '94 Norinco SKS with a synthetic Monte-Carlo stock. Got it for a song.I desperately want a few 30-round mags, but I'd like to know which kind are the best before I go running around and buying them.The Zytel mags seem like a good deal. But is it worth it? Will they fit any SKS easily, or will they "need minor fitting"? (read: sandpaper the bastards till they fit)And, most importantly, will they fall apart on me after a month of constant use?The 5-round mag that came with the rifle is some sort of synthetic plastic, perhaps Zytel, but I dont know.Any advice you could offer would be great. Thanks!

boeboe

First, you should be told that to install a detatchable magazine to an SKS that was not fitted with one prior to 1989 would be a felony. After 1989 it was legal to fit them with detatchable magazines only if the bayonet lug was cut off. Since 1994 I don't believe it's legal to put a detatchable mag on any SKS unless it was fitted with one previously.Second, most all the after market detatchable magazines for the SKS are junk. They are prone to jamming and difficult to lock up. Occasionally a person would get lucky and find a particular combination of rifle and magazines that wouldn't jam, but I think that's the exception rather than the rule. They tend to jam on the last few rounds. Even if you do get through the jamming problem, the lock-up process will be a time consuming fumble. A guy with stripper clips and an SKS standing next to you could (most probably) put more rounds per minute through his SKS than you could with the available detatchable magazines. The zytel magazines do last fine, the new composite materials are very durable. But the best magazines for the SKS are the standard fixed box magazines.

Bullzeye

So.....basically, throw the rifle in the trash and buy a preban for three times the price and half the quality for the sole purpose of being able to use a fixed mag?Uh huh.

kimberkid

Bullzeye,I don't thikk thats what boeboe is saying. I read his post to say that hi-cap mags are prone to problems ... reguardless of the gun ... but sometimes you get lucky. Personally I have 4-5 of them over the years and my experiance with hicap mags has been the same, however using the original equipment 10 round fixed mag I have never had a problem ... totally reliable

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GUN CONTROL: If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention!kimberkid@gunbroker.zzn.com

boeboe

Before you throw any SKS away, send it to me because they are great rifles, especially if they are kept the way they are suppose to be. If you want an SKS with the ability to accept detatchable magazines with guaranteed reliable operation, you should get and SKS Sporter or "D" which was designed to take standard AK mags just as they came, straight from the factory.Some people have had reasonable luck with the after market detatchable magazines feeding properly, but even after working the lock-up over it's still a cumbersome pain to lock-up. For my money, unless it came from the factory with the ability to take AK magazines, I'd go with the standard box magazine, or replace it with the fixed 20 round box magazine.I am wondering that you say it's a '94 Norinco, is that to say the serial number begins with a 94?

Bullzeye

The rifle was never designed to fire a fixed mag. It was imported without a fixed mag. It is a Sporter, if that means anything.But I know for a fact that this weapon has not had the fixed mag removed with the idea to put a hi-cap detachable mag in. Since it was imported without a fixed mag, I would assume that means its legal to use a detachable mag. Thats my only option!What other recourse do I have?! Pay to have a fixed mag put on a rifle that was never intended to have one? Chamber a single round every time I want to shoot?No offense to you kimber, or anyone in particular, but when it comes to the particular peculiarities and legalities of firearms, everyone's got an idea and an opinion. What you tell me is different from what the gunsmith who sold me the gun told me, which is different from what the next guy will tell me.You know what, I think I'll call my local BATF office for an answer and take the chance that they'll come and arrest me and take the gun. I'm pulling my hair out as is.

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ADDENDUM: Sorry boeboe, didnt get a chance to read your last post before I posted this one. I think I have a better idea of what I can and cant do now. The rifle is a Norinco SKS Type 56 Sporter with a black synthetic Monte-Carlo stock. It has no apparent accomodation for a fixed magazine, and no screws or holes or any other feature that suggests it ever had or was intented to have a fixed magazine. The dealer gave me one 5-round black composite-plastic detachable magazine with the traditional SKS mag "duckbill" extension on the front.[This message has been edited by Bullzeye (edited 12-16-2001).]

boeboe

So, it is marked "SPORTER" and the serial number begins with a 94? And it has no bayonet lug, and is carbine length, right? Does the the duck bill magazine lock-up properly? Why do you say it is a type 56?It is beginning to sound to me like you might have one of the SKS Sporters imported after the initial ban on the SKS in '89. They imported the Sporters up until '94. the serial number on these began with the year of manufacture. They were intended to take the AK magazine as they came. It may be that the addition of the Monte-Carlo stock disguised it's true nature.This is a possibility that might require further investigation.....

Bullzeye

Thank you for responding, btw. This is what I know:The reciever stamping has, starting from the left to the right, a triangle with the number "26" in a strange angular design inside the triangle. Right of that is three Chinese characters. Right of that is the serial number 12124644. Right of that, in very small block capital letters is "MFG BY NORINCO 7.62x39 SPORTER B-WEST TUC. AZ." and in a different, slighly less bold type which is off-center to the right, "MADE IN CHINA".The entire rifle, by my measure, is just under 42 inches. The barrel extending from the front end of the stock is just under 11 inches.I have no idea where I got the 1994 idea from. I must have somehow gotten the date of the import ban mixed up as the date the rifle was made. In all honesty, I have no idea when it was made.I assumed it was a Type 56 from a page entitled "SKS Types and Identification" on "The Unofficial On-Line SKS Semi-Automatic Rifle Manual", at http://www.net1plus.com/users/oscar/sksmanual/sksmanual.html That page showed a picture of three Chinese characters matching the characters on the reciever, next to a picture of what looked just like my SKS except with a wooden stock and some sort of a protrusion under the barrel in the front. My rifle, like I said, has a synthetic black Monte-Carlo stock.Lastly, the 5-round black plastic/composite detachable magazine I was given by the dealer fits the gun fine and locks in with no problems, although the chamber does need to be open to allow the magazine to lock. I fired off approx. 20 rounds shortly after I bought it and the magazine loaded and fed fine.[This message has been edited by Bullzeye (edited 12-17-2001).]

boeboe

Well, you had me going for a while. I think yours is the Type 56 now. The 94 threw me off track and got me thinking. The mags JNA are referring to might be better than the duck bill mags. Hopefully someone who has used them can comment on them.

Bullzeye

So does this mean I'm legal to use detachable mags??More info, more info!! :-)

boeboe

I don't know if it's legal, buy evidently the firearm was sold to you by an FFL dealer with the ability to take detatchable magazines. I'd sure keep some kind of documentation of that if you intend to continue to use the detatchable mags. I think the real test for whether it was legal would depend on if it were "modified" to take the detatchable mags prior to the '89 restriction. I don't know how the dealer would know if that was the case, or how anyone would except the guy who modified it. I'd hing it on the fact that you got it that way from the dealer, who should know better than to sell an illegal firearm. That being the case, you will probably never get in trouble for it. But I'm no legal expert.All in all, I think you will still find the standard fixed box a better set-up. But you need to figure that out on your own.I thought I'd include a site that is great info on modifications to the SKS, you might want to read it as a new SKS owner. Here it is: http://www.recguns.com/IIH2.html

kimberkid

Bullzeye,No offence taken, I was going on the incomplete information ... you didn't say anything in your initial post about it being a Sporter or that it wasn't designed to take the fixed mags or what the gunsmith who sold you the gun told you.I've seen lots of the common "run of the mill" SKS's that have had the stock changed out for the Ultralite Folder, Drogonov(sp?), and MonteCarlo and the fixed mag changed out for hi-caps or flush fitting ... a call to the BATF would probably be best.Just for fun, try calling the BTAF back (after you get your initial answers) ask a different agent the same question ... see if the 2nd BATF person will give you the same answer as the first!!!(EDIT) All SKS'scame into the country with a fixed mag, the B-WEST company in Tucson did the Sporter conversion to it to get around the law at that time ... also all SKS bolt carriers slide through the mag feed lips so that the bolt has to be open inorder to change the mag ... even the fixed type.

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GUN CONTROL: If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention!kimberkid@gunbroker.zzn.com [This message has been edited by kimberkid (edited 12-17-2001).]

prebanfan

Bullzeye, Your totally correct when you say one person will tell you one thing and another person will tell you something else. NOBODY can keep up with the always changing B.S. laws. I had a cop in my local gunsmith shop tell me that if my sks was made before the ban that I could put anything I wanted to on it(including a folding stock) at anytime, as long as it stayed semi-auto and the barrel length stayed within the law. He was totally wrong but my point is that reading the laws is like reading greek. The parts a laymen can understand still raises "can I or can I not" questions. I am like you. I would NEVER call the feds with a gun question........EVER. A lot of people will just say screw it, I am not touching the gun and leaving it as is............and that is exactly what the anti-gunners want you to do. They scare us away with bizzare and every changing laws, hoping that we will just give up. If we get lucky and finally understand every tiny detail of a law, they go and change it and then are guns are illegal again. Ok I am rambling, stupid gun laws are my main pet peve. Anyway.....I have tried about every sks clip out there. None of them are very good, and like one of the guys said above, your main problem will be jamming problems with the last few rounds. Also somebody hit it on the head again when they said that a guy can re-load faster with stripper clips and the standard mag than a guy next to him with a 30 rounder pop out. Here is what I do, as sks's are my favorite guns to shoot. I have 30 round mags on all my SKS's except one........and that is the gun that I actually shoot. It has the fixed standard mag that came with it. I just leave the 30 rounders in so the guns look nice and pretty sitting up there on the wall. Every now and then I will shoot with a 30 round or above, but they make me nervous. [This message has been edited by prebanfan (edited 12-17-2001).]

JustC

The way I see it, the gun was made before 1994 reguardless. Now, if you did not fill out any paperwork, then you bought it before 1994, and the clips are legal. Second, the gun is a preban, they are all preban manufacture. I have asked this question many times and the answers are always varied from one side to the other. If you live in a state where the cops have nothing better to do than check serial numbers at the range, then don't install the mag, or get the 10rd detachables that are available and use those at the range. They are legal. If your state is like mine, the police at the range will be just as interested in shooting your gun as they are in shooting their own. I rarely have ever gotten a crosseyed glance from the police. If you ask them, 99.9% will let you know that they are on our side in the firearms argument. They like guns as much as you do.Also, CenterFire systems has in their catalogue, 30rd detachables that function great. I have several and so do my friends, and neither one has ever failed. Not even on the last few rounds. When you get to loading that last few rounds, you will see why. Caannnn't Geeeeetttt theeeese Buuulllets tooooo goooooooo innnnnnn. Ahh. there we go.

prebanfan

Just C, or anybody else. Does CenterFire systems have a website? SKS mags that work.......never heard of such, but will give them a try for sure.

kimberkid

JustC,The 94 ban pertained domestic firearms, not imports ... that was Bush 43's 1989 ban.I'm un-clear as to why its not legal to use pre-ban hi-cap mags in an SKS, when it is legal to use pre-ban hi-caps in most every other post-ban rifle such as the FAL and HK clones as well as pistols ie, post-ban Beretta & wide body 1911's with 14+ rounders ... can anybody explain?

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GUN CONTROL: If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention!kimberkid@gunbroker.zzn.com

nmyers@home.com

Kid, it's not illegal to use a hi-cap mag in an SKS, if that's the only change.If, however, you also add 2 or more of the 5 "semiautomatic assault weapon" features (a folding stock with pistol grip would do that), then you would be making an illegal semiautomatic assault weapon. See Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide, p 47.Neal

prebanfan

I was just about to mention the two evil law. I could be wrong on this but I think that you can have to evils on a post ban gun....but folding stocks are not allowed unless it's pre-ban and came that way....ya right......blah blah blah. So the way I understand it, you can have a pistol grip type stock, and a 30 round mag, but you can't attach you bayonet. I hope I am correct because this is the way all my assult type weapons are...........two evils each. Anybody know the exact law on this? Also what is this about not being able to put a high cap mag in a post ban, unless you cut off the bayonet lug??? Is this correct??? I have never heard anybody say that before. Speaking of which..... When did the feds start cutting off the bayonet lugs? I bought a paratrooper 3 weeks ago and wondered why in the h*ll the bayonet lug was chopped off. I thought the previous owner had done it, then I read about the feds being ordered to cut off the lugs? What was that all about and what year? I can't keep up with all the garbage...uhhggg.