Looking for AR-15 performance in California

Chris-86GT

I live in California, so most of the good guns are no longer options here. I have always chosen tried and true non fancy weapons that have a reputation for dependability. I have a Remington 870 12 gauge, a Ruger 10/22 .22 and a Glock 17 9mm. All of these guns I researched beforehad to take recoil, accuracy and weight into consideration and so far have been extremely pleased with my decision. Now I am in the market for a good rifle that will perform as well as my other guns, prove to be light, and have a plethora of options (such as bipods, magazines, et cetera)I need a rifle that has a cyclic rate as fast as I can pull the trigger, yet can hit a deer accurately at 200-300 yards. I have researched the AR-15 to find that I cannot own one in California. I have turned my attention to the Ruger mini-14 or the M1 Garand in .30-06 caliber. The only problem I have with the Garand is the 8 round top loading magazine as it appears that it could be cumbersome to operate should the neo nazi army decide to invade califonia.. The one advantage to the M1 over the mini-14 or other newer rifle is when California decides to take away more of the weapons, there is a higher chance that "WWII antiques" may be spared because I would have to buy myself a decent rifle and then be forced to sell it back to the state for 25% of what I paid for it. Does anyone have a suggestion that may meet my stringent requirements? Oh yeah, I don't want to spend more than $600-$700. Yes, I want everything, but I don't want to pay for it..

smooth_operator

I too used to be a prisoner of that state. I share your frustrations...my sympathies.Years ago, I was amused and amazed at high capacity semi automatics...until I saw their accuracy on the field, then I turned my attention to bolt actions. At the range you suggested, I doubt that a .223 would be sufficient to take down deer. Why dont you trade the ability to shoot 30rds for accuracy? The M1 is more than adequate at those ranges, not to mention that the cartridge itself is effective if not overkill. The only downfall to this is COST.But hell...These rifles have proven their worth on the field and that was half a century ago.Saxon is right, the best solution to your problem (legally) is to move to a right to bear arms state. Im currently in Nevada and I love it here. Houses are about a quarter of what it normally costs in CA. Not to mention that this is a class3 state and they give out CCW permits like pancackes.-Smooth

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Life is the leading cause of death.Everything else is just a contributing factor.

ED P

Something with stripper clips loads really fast, that's why I like my M1-A.One word of advice though, although not a Ca. resident, I brought the Ca. legal version of the M1-A, with the muzzle break, and it is LOUD. Shooting without hearing protection, if you had to in a pinch, would leave your ears ringing for hours.If you can get an SKS with stripper clips, I'd go that route, as I can shoot my AK without hearing protection and it's quite tolerable. I've heard alot of back and forth here however, on what makes a Ca. legal SKS, so make sure you find out before going that route.If you go the Mini-14 route, these guys below make 10 round mags for the Mini-14.you can get 10 round mags from here: http://www.johnmasen.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=J&Category_Code=RMA

Zak

http://www.odcmp.com You'll have to join a club and shoot a match, but it shouldn't be at all difficult to find one in California. In return, you get to buy surplus rifles from the government.A GI Garand will run you $500, while a Danish re-import will cost $400. I'd take a Garand over a Mini-14 any day of the week.(Note to folks: He asked about an M1 Garand aka "Rifle, Caliber .30, M1" and not about an M1 carbine or Springfield M1A (aka semi-auto M-14.) Prices are much lower than you've been quoting--no sense in scaring the guy off, he's got it bad enough to begin with where he lives!)

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Okay, Okay, I'm a rabbit, I'm a rabbit!

Chris-86GT

See, thats the price range I was looking at. I found a guy that sells perfectly restored garands and garandguy.com for $750.00. This is the description:Springfield 3216513 Service Grade, M1, gauges 2, tight muzzle, bright shiny bore, reparkerized, new Boyd walnut stock & handguards. Looks and shoots like a champion!This sounds like a good deal. The reason I don't want the SKS is because if anything will be outlawed next, it will be that gun. Considering I already have hi capacity magazines for my Glock 17 and Ruger 10/22, the high cap issue for a dear rifle is not THAT big of an issue, especially if you have ever hunted dear, you know they don't hang around and wait for you to insert another mag anyway. It sounds like the Garand will meet my needs perfectly. What about scope options?? It is a top loading magazine, would that not limit my scope options?

altos

Chris,If you want reliability and performance, you only have one choice (a comment sure to irk someone, but alas...). Get an M1A, at LEAST with a NM barrel. The loaded version will allow you to buy some goodies which is ok but not a compelling financial case. If you are an exceptional shooter, spring for the super match at $2k and don't look back. If you can't go that high, get the loaded for $1199-1250. They are available. I know. I bought one. Ruger is very popular. There is an entire industry built around trying to make them "right". There are Remingtons and Brownings... but.. well, their cheaper and you get what you pay for. I chew through military surplus ammo and jump for joy when I can hold 4 inches at 100 yards with iron sights. I will admit that most of the time I am at about 5.5 inches on 20 rounds but I don't take it too seriously, I'm an old fart and I enjoy being out there punchin' holes. But I am doing it after a lot of research. The M1A is the ticket. Spend as much as you can and only do it once (with no expectation of having to diddle, diddle, diddle). I'm an accuracy/quality clown. If I really need to satisfy an accuracy urge then Anschutz is the way. And, yes, that's my small bore rifle...hey, have some fun !!!enjoy

altos

Hey Chris, forgot a point... there is a Scout version with a short barrel. Shot it several times and liked it. Nice piece. When I bought my M1A I opted for the full length barrel. I don't know why. There was something in the brain that said it would be more accurate, but then, many "experts" say barrel length does not matter. Regardless, I went long. I am glad I did. The long barrel "feels better", has less recoil (in my opinion) and less noise. Both are CA legal. Net/net is I am glad I went long. Just an FYI.bye.

Chris-86GT

As I understand it the M1A is not 30.06 and feeds with a stripper clip, is this true??

Shootist3006

Chris, the M1A is .308 and feeds with a detachable magazine. It can be charged from stripper clips but that isn't the normal method of feeding. Of the rifles mentioned here, the Garand is (IMHO) far away the best choice. Both the .223 and the 7.62X39 are somewhat underpowered for deer sized critters, esp. at 300 yards!A practiced rifleman with the M1 can maintain a cyclic rate of fire equal to or faster than the M1A. Changing the mag is a lot slower than feedig in another 8 round clip and feeding a clip is the same action as feeding a 5 round stripper clip - except it is 8 rounds.At 300 yards, I wouldn't hestitate to shoot deer with the M1, I would NOT attempt the shot with an SKS or Mini-14.

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Quod principi placuit legis habet vigorem.Semper Fidelis

seamus

Chris, since I own several Mini 14s, and have also done my share of shooting with both the M-1 and M-14, I thought I would add my humble opinion, for what it is worth. First off, you are expecting too much from one rifle. The Mini 14 is a fine weapon, as long as it is used for the purposes and within the limitations of its design. If you want a rifle to humanely take dear out to 300 yards, forget about using the Mini 14, Mini 30, or any of the so-called assault rifles (below 308 cal.). I have found the Mini 30 (7.62 x 39) to be a handy woodland/brush mid-range carbine for dear, but mid-range should mean 150 yards max. If weight and bulk are relatively unimportant factors, the M-1 (which, as you know, is chambered for 30.06), is an excellant rifle. The Springfield M1A1 (civilian M-14 in 308 cal.) is also excellent, but pricey. These are purpose-build weapons, and the purposes for which a military firearm are desinged are not exactly the same as needed by the sportsman. For dear at mid to long range, the best option, IMHO, would be to use a sporting rifle, in bolt or semi auto action, which is designed for hunting. Remington, Ruger, Winchester, etc, etc. all make some excellent rifles for that purpose.

Mr. Lobo

Here is another option. I too live in California and purchased a Remington model 7400 a couple of years ago thinking it may be next on the chopping block. I recently found this site and it brings up a new slant on this nice little hunting rifle. Check it out and tell me what you think... http://iyp.uswestdex.com/accuracysystemsinc/Page9.html