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WASR 10 Questions
msmalley1227
Member Posts: 119 ✭✭
Can someone give me some info on an AK 47 WASR 10/63 UF. The serial number is BX 0714-86 and it says it was made by CA Romarm. It looks almost new but I wondered if the -86 on the serial number meant it was made in 1986. It is a 7.62x39 mm with a fold under stock and has black plastic instead of wood on the forend. It doesn't have any box or paperwork
A guy I know lost $600 to me in a poker game. He was short on cash so gave me the AK 47 as payment and I wanted to know if I got screwed or not.
Mike S.
A guy I know lost $600 to me in a poker game. He was short on cash so gave me the AK 47 as payment and I wanted to know if I got screwed or not.
Mike S.
Comments
You got something that was worked over by Bubba though. It was imported with a wooden stock, and to take a special 10 round single stack magazine.
You should be happy though, the folding stock and the standard hi-cap magazine makes it much more saleable. The only problem is that the feds require a certain number of US made parts on Wasr 10's, that have been altered into standard AK configuration with hi-cap mags and folding stocks. Without the required number of US made parts that you can prove that have been added, potential problems might arise?
MS
Thanks a lot. Don't anticipate any problems because it came with 4 mags filled with 30 rds each and no paperwork involved. I don't know how many US parts it has but I plan on keeping it anyway so shouldn't be a problem of anyone checking it out. It's the first AK I have had and it does shoot nice. From what you say, it sounds like it is a pretty new gun. Thanks again.
MS
What Rufe is talking about is section 922R compliance. If someone has opened up the magwell to take 30 rounders, (these originally came imported as 10 rounds, hence the 10/63 designation) you can get in some serious trouble for owning the gun without the US made parts requirement. If you go to the range to shoot the gun or just get caught with it somewhere in your possesion and a BATF agent inspects the gun, you will be in hot water. I think the required parts count is 9, but you can research to be sure. The later imported 10/63's are 922R compliant and have the required parts count to take the 30 rounders. Be careful and good luck.
Regards, Don
Usually, the trigger group (3 parts), flash hider (1 part), pistol grip (1 part), hand guard (1 part) are USA made, which is enough to be 922R compliant.
There were WASRs brought in by Century in the underfolder configuration. I saw them advertised at J&G.
Usually, the trigger group (3 parts), flash hider (1 part), pistol grip (1 part), hand guard (1 part) are USA made, which is enough to be 922R compliant.
Bubba sure does make things difficult. How do I know if the parts are american made. It does have a flash hider but will the individual parts be stamped 'Made in USA' anywhere? Thanks.
MS
quote:Originally posted by CDMead
There were WASRs brought in by Century in the underfolder configuration. I saw them advertised at J&G.
Usually, the trigger group (3 parts), flash hider (1 part), pistol grip (1 part), hand guard (1 part) are USA made, which is enough to be 922R compliant.
Bubba sure does make things difficult. How do I know if the parts are american made. It does have a flash hider but will the individual parts be stamped 'Made in USA' anywhere? Thanks.
MS
You didn't build it, so you don't have to worry about 922r.
Unless you want to start swaping parts out...
On compliance, to be absolutely clear here US Code Section 922r stipulates that its illegal to ASSEMBLE a foreign made semiautomatic gun into a form that otherwise wouldn't be legally importable.
quote:http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/18/I/44/922
(r) It shall be unlawful for any person to assemble from imported
parts any semiautomatic rifle or any shotgun which is identical to
any rifle or shotgun prohibited from importation under section
925(d)(3) of this chapter as not being particularly suitable for or
readily adaptable to sporting purposes except that this subsection
shall not apply to. . .[etc]
There there is a laundry list of parts (barrels, triggers, etc), where if a particular gun has more than 10 of them that are imported from that list, its considered foreign made, and non-compliant. Guns like this can have a number of parts (usually cheap and relatively easy to swap ones) replaced by American made parts to become compliant.
Note that the restriction applies solely to ASSEMBLY of said guns. The law DOES NOT prohibit POSSESSION of said guns.
For big companies who are bringing in and selling large numbers of these guns (eg Century arms), they have to be compliant, or they can get in real trouble. These companies will typically replace usual foreign made parts with American-made ones (all stamped "USA" somewhere on there).
But for everyone else, it really makes little difference because its not illegal to possess a gun illegally constructed this way. If you didn't actually build the gun in question, you're not criminally liable, and even if you did, proving that you did in a court of law might be fairly difficult.
Correspondingly, I've heard that NOBODY HAS EVER has been convicted of violating this particular section of 922.
Instead, I've heard that BATFE policy is that if they encounter guns like this, they typically just seize them, without filing criminal charges (in a case they'll probably lose). While that in and of itself is probably illegal, nobody is going to risk having to fight a criminal case in trying to recover a quasi-legal $500 gun from the BATFE.
Bottom line is, in this particular case, I don't really see an issue. If they gun itself was imported/converted before 922r came into effect, there is no issue. If the gun is compliant, there is no issue. If you didn't assemble/convert the gun yourself, there is no issue. If, and only if you built the gun with non-compliant parts is there potentially a criminal liability issue, and even there its going to be tough to prove.
If you really care, typical AKs only need 5 or 6 American made parts to become 922R compliant, and is many cases this can be accomplished as simply as swapping the gun furniture and trigger group for aftermarket ones, which is relatively straightforward and fairly low cost.
Yes, in this climate, any functional AK is easily worth $600. So that's pretty simple. Hell, in this climate 4 loaded 30-round mags by themselves are probably worth about $150.
On compliance, to be absolutely clear here US Code Section 922r stipulates that its illegal to ASSEMBLE a foreign made semiautomatic gun into a form that otherwise wouldn't be legally importable.
quote:http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/18/I/44/922
(r) It shall be unlawful for any person to assemble from imported
parts any semiautomatic rifle or any shotgun which is identical to
any rifle or shotgun prohibited from importation under section
925(d)(3) of this chapter as not being particularly suitable for or
readily adaptable to sporting purposes except that this subsection
shall not apply to. . .[etc]
There there is a laundry list of parts (barrels, triggers, etc), where if a particular gun has more than 10 of them that are imported from that list, its considered foreign made, and non-compliant. Guns like this can have a number of parts (usually cheap and relatively easy to swap ones) replaced by American made parts to become compliant.
Note that the restriction applies solely to ASSEMBLY of said guns. The law DOES NOT prohibit POSSESSION of said guns.
For big companies who are bringing in and selling large numbers of these guns (eg Century arms), they have to be compliant, or they can get in real trouble. These companies will typically replace usual foreign made parts with American-made ones (all stamped "USA" somewhere on there).
But for everyone else, it really makes little difference because its not illegal to possess a gun illegally constructed this way. If you didn't actually build the gun in question, you're not criminally liable, and even if you did, proving that you did in a court of law might be fairly difficult.
Correspondingly, I've heard that NOBODY HAS EVER has been convicted of violating this particular section of 922.
Instead, I've heard that BATFE policy is that if they encounter guns like this, they typically just seize them, without filing criminal charges (in a case they'll probably lose). While that in and of itself is probably illegal, nobody is going to risk having to fight a criminal case in trying to recover a quasi-legal $500 gun from the BATFE.
Bottom line is, in this particular case, I don't really see an issue. If they gun itself was imported/converted before 922r came into effect, there is no issue. If the gun is compliant, there is no issue. If you didn't assemble/convert the gun yourself, there is no issue. If, and only if you built the gun with non-compliant parts is there potentially a criminal liability issue, and even there its going to be tough to prove.
If you really care, typical AKs only need 5 or 6 American made parts to become 922R compliant, and is many cases this can be accomplished as simply as swapping the gun furniture and trigger group for aftermarket ones, which is relatively straightforward and fairly low cost.
Thanks a lot. The gun looks good and shoots good so that is all I'm worried about. There is no way I could assemble an AK47, it's all I can do to field strip one. Thanks
Yes, in this climate, any functional AK is easily worth $600. So that's pretty simple. Hell, in this climate 4 loaded 30-round mags by themselves are probably worth about $150.
On compliance, to be absolutely clear here US Code Section 922r stipulates that its illegal to ASSEMBLE a foreign made semiautomatic gun into a form that otherwise wouldn't be legally importable.
quote:http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/18/I/44/922
(r) It shall be unlawful for any person to assemble from imported
parts any semiautomatic rifle or any shotgun which is identical to
any rifle or shotgun prohibited from importation under section
925(d)(3) of this chapter as not being particularly suitable for or
readily adaptable to sporting purposes except that this subsection
shall not apply to. . .[etc]
There there is a laundry list of parts (barrels, triggers, etc), where if a particular gun has more than 10 of them that are imported from that list, its considered foreign made, and non-compliant. Guns like this can have a number of parts (usually cheap and relatively easy to swap ones) replaced by American made parts to become compliant.
Note that the restriction applies solely to ASSEMBLY of said guns. The law DOES NOT prohibit POSSESSION of said guns.
For big companies who are bringing in and selling large numbers of these guns (eg Century arms), they have to be compliant, or they can get in real trouble. These companies will typically replace usual foreign made parts with American-made ones (all stamped "USA" somewhere on there).
But for everyone else, it really makes little difference because its not illegal to possess a gun illegally constructed this way. If you didn't actually build the gun in question, you're not criminally liable, and even if you did, proving that you did in a court of law might be fairly difficult.
Correspondingly, I've heard that NOBODY HAS EVER has been convicted of violating this particular section of 922.
Instead, I've heard that BATFE policy is that if they encounter guns like this, they typically just seize them, without filing criminal charges (in a case they'll probably lose). While that in and of itself is probably illegal, nobody is going to risk having to fight a criminal case in trying to recover a quasi-legal $500 gun from the BATFE.
Bottom line is, in this particular case, I don't really see an issue. If they gun itself was imported/converted before 922r came into effect, there is no issue. If the gun is compliant, there is no issue. If you didn't assemble/convert the gun yourself, there is no issue. If, and only if you built the gun with non-compliant parts is there potentially a criminal liability issue, and even there its going to be tough to prove.
If you really care, typical AKs only need 5 or 6 American made parts to become 922R compliant, and is many cases this can be accomplished as simply as swapping the gun furniture and trigger group for aftermarket ones, which is relatively straightforward and fairly low cost.
I'd speculate that with the "black plastic instead of wood on the forend" this configuration was done by the importer -- so it probably is 922R compliant.
But as noted, I don't think there have been any prosecutions of individuals who were in possession of firearms that violated the 922R section of rules.