Old Model 12

BayouCritter

I have old Winchester Model 12 16 ga. that has been been passed down to me. As I recall my uncle had to stop using it in the late 60's or early 70's because it would not chamber "modern" shotgun shells - that being 2 3/4" shells. Can someone tell me anything about what size shell it is chambered for? or maybe where I can locate information on this gun?

talon

It uses 2&9/16ths inch shells. Winchester changed the m12 to use the longer ones in about 1927. I believe you can still get the short 16 ga ammo from several places, one of which may be the Western Scrounger ( www.ows-ammunition.com ). Some folks have the forcing cone/chamber and the ejection port opened up to accept the current ammo, but that costs about 50% of what the shotgun is currently worth, while at the same time eliminating its collector value. But, a working modified m12/16ga does have some ($200 about)value, and that is slightly more than you will spend having it modified for the longer shells. If you can provide all but the last 2 or 3 digits of the serial number, an expert can tell you when yours was manufactured (123xx, or 24xx).

muley

My book says that early 16 Ga. made 1912 to 1914, were chambered for 2 9/16 inch shells. What's the S/N?

BayouCritter

Thanks for the quick response. SN is 2920XX. It's an improve cylinder and I bet it's killed more doves and quail that most of us ever shot at. I recall him telling me he could have sent it back to Winchester to be chambered for the 2 3/4" shell but he had another gun (almost as old) and did not want to alter this one.

muley

Your Model 12 was made in 1922. My book says that 12's, 16's & 20's were made with 2 1/2 in. chambers until 1927. Then it says that early 16's were made with 2 9/16" also. This info is from my 21st edition of "Blue Book of Gun Values". The date came from my Winchester DOM book. So, someone with first hand knowledge may be of better help. Why don't you measure the chamber and see what the lenth is?

talon

Mr George Madis, THE Winchester authority, more or less says: m12 20 gauges were the first to be manufactured, starting in 1912. Then, in'14 the 16 and 12 gauges began production. From the first, the 20ga was made in 2&1/2" chamber, and the 16 in 2&9/16ths". Then, in 1925, the 20ga began to have 2&3/4 chambering, and 2 years later the 16 went the same route. Mr Madis doesn't comment at all on the 12 gauge chambering, which is unusual as he comments on just about all changes that took place on Winchester arms from 1860 to about WWII. Perhaps this means that the m12/12ga has always been chambered as it is today.(PERHAPS). He has words on the 28ga, and the 3" 12ga, but that's not relivent here. The 'Blue Book of gun values' condenses too much, sometimes.

rick_reno

Talon posted "Mr Madis doesn't comment at all on the 12 gauge chambering, which is unusual as he comments on just about all changes that took place on Winchester arms from 1860 to about WWII. Perhaps this means that the m12/12ga has always been chambered as it is today.(PERHAPS)."Yes, he does comment on that chambering. On pg. 35 of his book "The Winchester Model 12" is written "Twelve gauge guns were chambered for two and three-quarters shells as standard." It's right below where he writes about the chambering for 20 and 16 ga. guns.