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Please help Identify Double Gun

skipjackoneskipjackone Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
edited July 2013 in Ask the Experts
My buddy's Grandfather left him this double gun. Both barrels are rimfire. Right side has rifling, left is smoothbore. Markings on barrel: ).C5grN.G.P.M\71 and 19r.B1. Right side may be a .22 short, (bullet fits anyway). Left side is smaller than .410. Any idea what this is??
WeirdGun136_zps91a18316.jpg

WeirdGun135_zpse1c1dfe9.jpg

WeirdGun138_zps9c1b2184.jpg

Comments

  • charliemeyer007charliemeyer007 Member Posts: 6,572 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    A pic of the breach end would help. WAG 9mm rimfire shot shell.
  • skipjackoneskipjackone Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I probably won't be able to get the breech pic.
  • skipjackoneskipjackone Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Found similar guns on the net by searching "German 9mm garden gun".
    Anyone know who made this?
  • thorhammerthorhammer Member Posts: 977 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    NGPm/71 Neues Gewerhr-pulver Model 71 (new rifle powder model 71) or

    Nitrozellulose Gewehr Pulver (Nitrocellulose rifle powder.

    Offical black powder used by the German Army.

    German Double Gun? probably a guild gun, hand crafted.

    The other smooth bore barrel may be 9mm rimfire shotshell. The bore

    diameter would be .309, the chamber .314 and the rim .402

    If it's rimfire 38 short/long, the bore would be .376 and if it's

    rimfire 41 short/long than the bore would be .405
  • rufe-snowrufe-snow Member Posts: 18,650 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    I agree it's a garden gun chambered for the 22 and 9mm rimfires.

    The format of the proof marks shows early production. As the German proof laws were amended in 1912. To do away with the requirement for the marking of the specific proof loads.

    Many German sporting guns such as this one were brought back as souvenirs, by our GI's after W W II.

    Can't tell much from the photos but if it's factory original and in Very Good condition? It might be viable on the German collectors market. Their looking to get their stuff back. If you were to put it on our auction, might see some action from dealers who sell over there.

    EDIT #1, You would have better luck searching for "Garden Gun" or something similar. The early German proof markings not likely to be specific enough. This type of gun was made to sell as a inexpensive, utility gun. Other then the required German proof marks, not likely it had either manufacturers or retailers markings.

    EDIT #2, The proof marks you have given us are German. If it was made in Belgium. The proof marks would be entirely different.
  • skipjackoneskipjackone Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Rufe and Thor: thanks for the information.
    I'll try searching the web with NGPm/71 Neues
    Gewerhr-pulver Model 71.
  • skipjackoneskipjackone Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Looks like this might be manufactured by
    The Liege United Arms Co. of Belgium.
    Possibly a poachers gun?
  • Hawk CarseHawk Carse Member Posts: 4,381 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    The type is in the 1911 Alfa catalog, listed as a "small double rifle" 6x9, that is 6mm Flobert and 9mm Rimfire shot. They even show .22 Short and Long on the page with the 6mm.
    Cost 38 marks or so.
    Yours is in better condition than most. Cheap guns, commonly neglected.
  • skipjackoneskipjackone Member Posts: 208 ✭✭✭
    edited November -1
    Thanks Hawk.
    Greatly Appreciate the information.
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