US made parts in imported guns? why?

Kadaver

just out of curiousity...Why are imported rifles like AK-47's have US made parts installed on them in place of the original to make them legal?are they not the same exact part? just made by different people? or are they completely different pieces?for example, mags....what's the difference between the floorplates and followers in the Egyptian mags vs the modified mags?Thanks

budmott

Because OUR wonderful law enforement agency BAT F is trying to save us from ourselves.It seems like they think if I have a AK47 with US made parts in it I can not kill as many people at one time as I can if the bad Russkie parts are left in the AK47.More of our government in action.Your tax dollars at workWe love you and we just want to help.etc etchave a day.bud

badboybob

It's just more socialist, the goobermint knows what's best *. The regulationsbenefit nobody, protect nobody. But of course the goobermint gets more power against us and tramples on the Constitution yet again.

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PC=BS

lrarmsx

Now to answer the question. In March 1989 there was an assault weapons ban. It focused on the irrelevant features of the guns like the flash hider, bayonet lug, pistol grip, folding or collapsible stock, and their high cap magazines or at least their ability to take them. If the guns had these features they could no longer come into the country. The importers were caught flat footed. There had not been a vote or a committee, just the instantaneous ban. They had guns waiting over seas to be shipped as well as some on the water already on the way. At that point they could no longer come into the country. The importers had a lot of money tied up in these with no way to import them and no one else to sell them to. No country's military wanted semi-auto weapons when they could have the full auto ones. The importers were hosed until their lawyers looked at the way the law was written. They found loopholes. If they took off the offending features they could bring them into the country with a thumbhole stock, no lug, no flash hider, and only 5rd mags. The gov't said "That's not what we meant", but the importers pointed out "but that's what you said." So the guns started flowing into the country again, but this time with thumbhole stocks, etc. Problem solved for the importers and the US gun buying public. In 1994, the same rules were applied to the domestic production of similar weapons with the Crime Bill. (The 1989 ban only affected imports.) The US manufacturers did the same thing as the importers, took off the offending items and continued production. They were allowed only one of the evil features. Most chose to continue their design with a pistol grip (AR 15, etc.). The M1A from Springfield chose the flashider since their rifle normally did not have a pistol grip anyway, the list goes on... Anyway the imports, to the surprise of the politicians, were unaffected with the exception of the high cap mags could no longer be made or imported. (Since 1989 they could bring in the mags seperately from the guns, just not in the box with them. Now they couldn't bring them in at all.) Things pretty much went on as usual after the 1994 ban. The manufacturers just deleted the offensive irrelivent features and continued to make their guns US and Imports. The politicians were pissed. Each time they came up with a new law, the importers (and their lawyers) found a way around them. In October 1997 Clinton passed yet another Executive Order, halting the import of even the thumbhole stocked guns. This time the reason was stated that these imports did not meet the requirements for a sporting purpose as set forth by the 1968 Gun Control Act. Even if their was no bayonet lug, no pistol grip, no flash hider, no folding stock, etc. It stated that IF it is a semi-auto and even if it does not come with a high cap mag, If there is a mag anywhere in the world that will fit it, It can no longer be imported. A committee was put together (by Clinton and his people) to see if these guns did in fact meet those criteria. Clinton's order was a temporary one. After the committee compiled their findings 4 months later, the ban became permanent. (The imports were halted as soon as Clinton announced it back in October.)Again the lawyers for the importers went to work looking for loopholes. The first loophole idea was to redesign the guns with only a single stack mag. Again the gov't said that wasn't what they meant, but that was what they said. The imports began again with single stack mags and thumbhole stocks. The next thing the lawyers for the importers noticed was that the US manufacturers were still able to make guns with pistol grips and they could also take high cap mags. The lawyers then asked "Hey what about that?" The answer was "But these are US made." "What if the US makers use any foreign parts?" asked the lawyers. "As long as they don't use more than a certain number it is still technically a US made gun" came the answer. "AH loophole number 2" they said. "If we bring in the guns and take out a enough foreign parts and replace them with enough US parts, we should be able to not only bring the guns in again, but this time we can even have that evil pistol grip (that we hadn't been able to have since 1989) because by the gov'ts definition, it will legally be a US gun as long as it has enough US parts." Again the gov't was upset by the finding of the loophole, but that was what they had said. And that is the reason for the need of the parts in the magazine on some of the guns. The total number of parts is the key to whether a gun is legal or not. If it doesn't have enough of the US parts, it suddenly becomes an illegal weapon. Its sheer existance in this country at this time is based on the fact that it is technically a "US" made weapon. Without the US parts it becomes a foreign made weapon with a pistol grip and hence illegal since 1989. An incredable amount of government B.S., but if they had gotten their way, the last AK, SKS, HK, FAL, UZI, Galil, Daewoo, etc, etc. would have come into the country in March of 1989 and was never to be imported again. So the next time you bad mouth a lawyer, remember, if it wasn't for some of them being on our side (and under the employ of gun importers as well as US manufacturers), we wouldn't have had any of this stuff for the last 13 years.

just-shoot

Good info Irarmsx, even though I didn't ask the question, Thanks.

HAIRY

The next time you see a lawyer, give him/her a kiss and say thanks.

kimberkid

lrarmsx,GOOD JOB & EXCELLENT POST!

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Here's a thought: Let's make criminals responsible for their crimes ... ...Not blame society and the tools they use!kimberkid@gunbroker.zzn.com [This message has been edited by kimberkid (edited 03-16-2002).]

Kadaver

Thanks man, everything seems so clear now =-)

competentone

Fantastic explanation Irarmsx!(I've saved it to my harddrive; would you give me permission to re-post it if the question comes up here again?)Also:Do you know any of the lawyers?I can see a potential "loop hole" in some of the current law--including what I've read on the CA "assault weapons" ban.The phrase that is used in banning/defining certain weapons as "assault" usually start with "...any centerfire rifle or pistol..." The word I focus on is "centerfire". It would take the cooperation of a major firearms manufacture and ammuntiion manufacture, but if someone designed a round (something like the 7.62x39 or .223) which was "rimfire" I wonder if one would "sidestep" most of the "bans"?

gundummy

lrarmsx, that was one of the best post I've read yet. You are one of the reasons why this forum is a great success. Thanks for your time and effort in getting these good questions answered expertly. We all appreciate this. GD

Otoman

Irarmax, that was a very detailed answer to the question, Thank you for taking the time to explain it in depth. That is an answer to a question that I have been wondering about for a long time as well as a lot of other people here on the board. Thanks Otoman